Navigating consent

[IHE]

(Middle aged man wanting advice from middle aged women.)
(TLDR in last sentence.)

After a week of chattin online and several long phone conversations, I had a first date with a woman and it seems a pretty good match for both of us. There was some kissing in the pub, after which she said she wanted to jump my bones. (Her phrase and we'd only had a couple of drinks.) My DD was home, so I said no and walked her to the station.
Waiting for the train, there was more kissing and my hands wandered a little, which seemed to be welcomed. We had previously agreed that sex is important to both of us, and she also said several things that leave me in zero doubt she wants us to have sex. We've since arranged that she'll stay at mine one night next week.

In text messages since, there has been flirty banter, but she made one joke about abusive behaviours that spooked me and made me realise I never asked to kiss her or put my hand on her arse or [... etc, etc ...]
I found myself reflecting on how, when I was last dating regularly (a quarter of a century ago or more) what was acceptable behavior was very different.
I am certain she expects us to have sex on our second date 😁, and I don't want to be purely reactive, constantly waiting for her to tell me what's ok and what she wants. But I am wary that times have changed and, after a 20yr failed marriage where my XW was the only one who was allowed to initiate sex or withhold consent, I have no idea what The Rules are these days.

Obviously I'm overthinking this, but in the context, I would really value some opinions on how to navigate pre-emptive/verbal/implied/assumed consent in 2025.

I think you are right to be cautious especially in a new relationship.

I’d let her be in control of the situation, without being too passive, allow her to control the direction of where things are going and ask her if she’s ok with ‘this’ etc a few times during being intimate. If she says no at any point stop.

I remember one of my first relationship last 20 odd years ago, where I asked her if I could take off her pants whilst we were in throws of getting steamy for the first time . I looked back on that a few days later and cringed a little but now, it’s the right thing to do/say as things have changed so much.

you could also have some sexting prior so at least you have confirmation that she wanted /expected to have sex with the you although this won’t count as consent

I also think you are right to be cautious. I slept with my now partner (but didn't have full sex) on our first date 4 years ago. I hadn't slept with anyone but my ex in 17 years.

He was perfect in how he managed it all. He definitely let me take control whilst leaving me in no doubt that should I make the first move - it would be welcomed. I was the first to kiss him and the one who suggested going back to his. I was undressed by him before I knew what hit me but at every stage he made sure through gradual touch and eye contact that I consented to whatever was happening. At one point I said something that he wasn't sure how to interpret and he stopped, asked me what I meant, I clarified and he said, "It's good to communicate".

He gave me some beautiful, heartfelt compliments and in the morning walked me so respectfully out to my taxi.

Don't drink very much and watch how much she is drinking. If she seems intoxicated I would gently call it off for the night, to resume when sober.

Good luck!

@RockingBeebo I was planning not to drink much, but that's a very good point about watching how much she does. And pausing to ask if anything is ambiguous. Thank you.

I don't really have any useful advice other than those little asks like, "am I OK to undress you", which can be done softly so it keeps the mood, and "are you OK with this" when you start particular things.

But I think a key thing is that the fact that you have thought to ask on here speaks volumes to your character.
That you recognise you have been out of the dating scene for a while and the landscape of what is acceptable has drastically changed.
It's so nice to know that there are men out there who have the forethought and awareness that you do.

It’s great to want to be careful and make sure you’re both wanting the same thing.

Personally, I would find it a turn off to be asked at every step - can I kiss you? Can I take off your underwear…etc.

I would prefer attempts to be made and if I respond positively, that’s obviously my consent. The hottest sex I’ve had was someone who just took it upon himself to hold me against a wall and kiss me passionately. He didn’t ask, but I definitely responded with a yes!

If I don’t like something, I’ll make him aware. If he keeps going, that would be without my consent.

I am aware that some women can feel forced or won’t feel like they can say no, so it’s such a difficult area.

If in doubt, find a way to ask that doesn’t feel like you’re giving an interview or ticking boxes.

Have fun!

OP, I think it’s good that you have raised this and that you are aware, good for you, good for her and good for life.

l would suggest there is such a thing as “deemed consent”, if someone takes their knickers off and throws them at you for example.

Looking back, questions l have been asked is, “are you sober” (obviously not applicable where the parties have not been drinking) and the occasional “is this OK”(or “alright with this” or similar. It need not be asked with each manoeuvre but is helpful with major key points.

Finally, one word, the same as l would say to any woman; condom!

Take care x

@StarlightLady I'm not even going to ask about condoms. She doesnt get that choice (yet). At fiftyandabit, I doubt pregnancy is an issue, but I have no more reason to assume they aren't needed for STIs than she does.

I’m a fiftyandabit female and find her a bit full on tbh. No way would I say that to a man on a first date.

Good that you’re asking about consent but tread carefully.

Consent can be gained without the dreary “are you okay with this” in my experience.

“I really want to take your top off”….she lifts her arms or takes it off herself…you have the consent.
Would you like me to (insert sexual act here) So on and so forth.

@thisrarefox After a sexless, emotionally barren marriage, 2 very lonely years since, I've met someone who wants to "jump my bones". Are you really going to be the one to rain on my parade? 😢

Seriously though, yes I'm mindful that we're rushing into this a bit like teenagers. I gather her friends have told her the same and I'm intending to have a conversation about that.

Thanks for all the sage advice MNers!

Just be careful.

I’m your age and I’d find it a turn off if I was asked can I at everything, you’ll know if she’s keen and she sounds like she is. You sound lovely by the way, if she’s not interested I am! 🤣

@millymoo1202 I'm really sorry to disappoint you, but she seems quite interested. And let's be honest, if she decides she's not, presumably she'd have a reason: would you really want to take the risk without knowing what that was? 🤔