Can a marriage survive mismatched sex drives

[Loopyloular]

Just that really. My husband has absolutely no drive at all, not an ounce of desire for me. We've been married for 7 years this year and im really really struggling now.
I feel constantly in the mood and im really starting to resent him for turning me down all the time. Surely i can't be that bad?
Is there anything at all i can do to bring some spark back??

When we start dating a potential long term partner we can "suss" out virtually everything about them - their beliefs, outlook in life, mannerisms, sense of humour etc. However the one thing we cannot accurately judge is sex. This is because the "honeymoon period" gives a false impression i.e you are at it like rabbits until the novelty wears off. After that people will revert to type which could be anything from wanting it every day to preferring a cup of tea. By the time the "aggrieved" party recognises a problem they may have committed to the relationship - house purchase, DC's etc.

I think what ConfusedDH is saying is that he wants his DW to generally want sex rather than going through the motions to please him. If you invited a friend to the theatre and their body language made it clear they'd rather be anywhere else you probably wouldn't invite them a second time.

" the "honeymoon period" gives a false impression i.e you are at it like rabbits until the novelty wears off."

Not all couples go through this though, some have a slower time at the beginning due to inexperience and shyness. I'd like to know if Confused's wife was really at it like rabbits with him in the beginning and who was doing the initiating.

"By the time the "aggrieved" party recognises a problem they may have committed to the relationship - house purchase, DC's etc. "

That would take many years though, not usually a honeymoon period of under one year.

"If you invited a friend to the theatre and their body language made it clear they'd rather be anywhere else you probably wouldn't invite them a second time."

Depends how badly you wanted company at the theatre I suppose. If you'd begged them into it and asked them to do it as a favour to you, it wouldn't be nice to then criticise them about their posture or how they sat in their seat.

I think the criticism towards ConfusedDH's post is unfair. It's quite clear from what he says that he's upset because his wife never initiates intimacy or shows a sign of desiring him sexually. Although she sometimes agrees to sex, it's not at regularly (if I've understood correctly). This is in contrast with his sex drive and this is where the problem lies - the incompatibility and sexual mismatch.

"It's quite clear from what he says that he's upset because his wife never initiates intimacy or shows a sign of desiring him sexually. "

And that her technique isn't good enough, that she doesn't 'ride' him in the way he wants, that she can't come as easily as he would like, that she's vanilla, and so on. He even complains about her smile FFS. He complains about the quality more than the quantity in that post.

To answer a few points raised...

In the beginning it was never fireworks or lustful passion, but much of this was borne from DW being inexperienced and somewhat shy. I had experienced this with my first partner years before, and as we grew together as a couple, her confidence increased and the true passion emerged from within. This was my frame of reference coupled with the limited life experience of someone in their twenties and I had no reason to doubt the same would happen, nor much reason to complain as the frequency and interest was there.

Things were fine for a few years - the sex was probably the least great element of the relationship, but not deal breaking.

Post children, things deteriorated, the libido dropped, any spark we did have went out and the frequency slowly diminished.

Without going over old ground - yes my wife does try and I acknowledge and respect that, however where sex is concerned, faking enjoyment and pretending to be interested just doesn't cut it. How many times do we read on here that there's nothing worse than having sex with someone who is not into it?

By trying, I think we need to clarify that trying is permitting sex once or twice a month and being totally passive during the process. No enthusiasm, no spark, no chemistry, no two-way enjoyment, precious little effort to please me beyond a repetition of 'paint by numbers' half hearted attempts to do foreplay, more to tick a box than because she wants to, enjoys doing so, and is interested in the result.

I've read plenty of threads on here from women where the diagnosis of their problems is 'crap sex' and how unacceptable it is and life's too short, and nobody should put up with that etc, etc, so I feel no shame for expressing my own discontent as many others (male and female) have done before.

The term 'genuine effort' was used - to me, this would be treating sex as something special, approaching it with anticipation, excitement, being proactive, giving feedback, taking charge at times, asking for things, suggesting trying things and generally displaying some kind of 'horny and up for it' behaviour, which is surely what sex should be like, and how it has been previously and with other partners before and with her to a point earlier on in the relationship.

I'm experienced enough to know the difference between two people passionately making love and one person putting up with it and going through the motions.

I also recognise when two people are living like friends rather than lovers.

Everything points to my DW having zero libido and trying to keep me happy, despite me communicating that sex can't be faked and that it's soul destroying to know and sense your life partner just isn't into it anymore.

Hopefully some of your can relate to or empathise with the feeling of not being fancied, not being needed, being rejected and turned down frequently, not being a part of someone else's sexual consciousness and how that could affect your self esteem and confidence?

"The term 'genuine effort' was used - to me, this would be treating sex as something special, approaching it with anticipation, excitement, being proactive, giving feedback, taking charge at times, asking for things, suggesting trying things and generally displaying some kind of 'horny and up for it' behaviour, which is surely what sex should be like, and how it has been previously and with other partners before and with her to a point earlier on in the relationship."

But that is just not her. She's not like that. She sounds like a nice woman doing as much as she can and you seem to want some non-vanilla raunch that she probably never promised you.

" some of your can relate to or empathise with the feeling of not being fancied, not being needed, being rejected and turned down frequently"

You're old enough to know that a low libido is not the same as not fancying someone. If you have a partner who's always pestering for sex it doesn't mean they fancy you particularly either. She doesn't seem to reject you all the time either and goes to great lengths to try to satisfy you.

I know you are going to counselling confuseddh, and think you respect your wife, but I really wish you would set the poor woman free. It sounds like she just doesn't fancy you anymore.

"It sounds like she just doesn't fancy you anymore."

Where do you get this from? She was never super raunchy like OP expects of a woman. Seems she was always quite shy and now tries her very best. We have nothing to suggest she doesn't fancy him rather than just being a less sexual person than him.

@Gwenhwyfar

It's not her now, but there was enough to keep us going before children. If it had been like this earlier on, I'd have not married her. I haven't changed, she has.

She tells me she still fancies me, but doesn't get the sex urge.

I have miss used the word vanilla and it has come back to haunt me - let me change that to boring, uninterested and lacking in any passion or enthusiasm, technique, proactivity or imagination - the sort most women would rightly call crap sex. To the point where half the time I just stop half way through, it's that 'one way'.

As for rejection, she does (or did) reject me most of the time,. I gave up initiating as the constant rejection became so hurtful - as it would you, no?

Mindful that pressure is the last thing to help libido, I backed off completely and never initiated for months. Guess what happened next? Correct, no sex at all. All that happens now is that every once in a while, maybe every few weeks I'll be offered pitty sex to tick a box. I do not see this as someone trying their best to keep a sexual relationship alive.

As for set the poor woman free - I want to make the marriage work, I want things to go back to how they were earlier in the relationship and I'm proactively trying to do everything I can to achieve this - is this not what people suggest or the correct and noble thing to do?

She doesn't want the relationship to end and neither do I. We love each other, we are best friends and devoted parents who are not willing to split up our family and hurt the children.

And before anyone says that it will damage the children if we stay together - utter nonsense, they have no clue and the family environment is loving, warm, inclusive and happy - the children have no clue about out sexual life and see us hug and (non-sexually) kiss during the day.

If setting free was that easy, we'd have done it now, hence I'm on here looking for tips, suggestions, advice, and support like many others.

Let me just reiterate - it was better earlier in the relationship prior to children. I am not chasing a rainbow that never existed.

This is, I believe a result of zero libido.

I'll let you know what the therapist says - so far we've established that we both want things to improve, that there is a big difference in current drives, expectations and needs and that we would both like a better sex life, however my wife's narrative is subtly different in that she "wants to want" sex, rather than wanting sex.

"As for rejection, she does (or did) reject me most of the time"

But because you know it's down to a lack of libido and not that she doesn't fancy you, you know she's rejecting sex and not you, don't you.

"every few weeks I'll be offered pitty sex to tick a box. I do not see this as someone trying their best to keep a sexual relationship alive."

I do! She has sex with you relatively regularly even though she has no libido in an attempt to keep you happy. What more can she do really?

" it was better earlier in the relationship prior to children. I am not chasing a rainbow that never existed."

It was better you said, but never great. I presume she never pretended to be something she wasn't, to have great technique, etc.

Yes, she is rejecting sex, not me. That doesn't make the problem go away, hence I'm trying to find a solution with counselling etc.

Relatively regularly is completely subjective. once ot twice a month might be regular to some and a complete deal breaker for others, as I've read on here plenty of times.

Just because we have sex once or twice a month doesn't mean it is satisfying or fulfilling and not 'crap sex'.

No, she never pretended to be something she was not, but was previously at least semi-enthusiastic, put some effort in and we had sex a lot more frequently.

I'm sensing from your response that you feel I am not justified in feeling unhappy with our sex life?

We started off with different sex drives, but they were at least close enough to meet our needs.

My sex drive hasn't changed - hers has changed significantly, which has massively impacted on the frequency, quality, fulfilment and satisfaction of our sex life. This in turn has had a significant impact on my self esteem, self confidence, enjoyment of married life and overall well being.

I'm trying to find a solution and have sought counselling to see if a resolution can be found, yet I feel I'm somehow in the wrong for feeling the way I do.

I trust you have seen the enormous amount of threads on here by both sexes where the sex life has deteriorated, leaving one party very unhappy?

"I'm sensing from your response that you feel I am not justified in feeling unhappy with our sex life?"

I never said that, but I think you're very harsh in your criticisms of your DW and that you expect too much from her.

"I'm trying to find a solution and have sought counselling to see if a resolution can be found"

I think that's great and better than just leaving her as she seems to love you and want to make it work.

"I trust you have seen the enormous amount of threads on here by both sexes where the sex life has deteriorated, leaving one party very unhappy?"

Yes, but quite often when the women are complaining, the men are completely unwilling to look into the issue or sometimes even admit there's a problem or they have sex much less regularly than you do.
Here, your DW is going to huge lengths to try to please you, but she's just not very good in bed. I don't see that as her fault, particularly as she never pretended to be anything else. I also think you come across as quite fussy and demanding with your list of things she doesn't do "correctly" and I feel really sorry for her.

I think i understand you, ConfusedDH. To paraphrase Jennifer Aniston from The Break-Up, you don't want her to have sex with you, you want her to want to have sex with you. There's nothing wrong with you for wanting mutual desire and passion in your relationship but equally there is nothing wrong with her either. There is no rule that says she has to be sexually enthusiastic and whatever the reasons are for her not being so, that is who she is. I think the real issue here is you ultimately see the solution as her changing. Everything will be fine if she changes. That's not right. Why don't you change? Why don't you find some way to stop having any sexual desire? Of course, that's not right either. Compromises are part and parcel of a relationship but making fundamental changes to who we are is not.

Honestly, I think if it has got to the point where you are venting your frustration on here with some frequency it's probably time to seriously consider that the two of you are just not compatible enough to continue the relationship. Yes, I know, kids, marriage, commitment, need to try and make it work blah blah blah, but ask yourself this, how would she feel if she could read all your posts about your sex life and your disatisfaction with her? It doesn't matter that this is an anonymous forum and nobody knows you or her. When it gets to the point that you are disclosing things to strangers that would break your wife into pieces, the relationship is fucked.

Anyone can make a token effort to please their partner, but as Confused says, this is a massive turn off when they are clearly just going through the motions. And therein lies the big issue: the lack of her passion, the lack of her desire for passionate, spontaneous sex with him means that he just has to move on. No sex is better, more dignified, than bored, pity sex.

I agree, Christian77. This is why I have completely given up on sex with my husband.

My sex life with my DH has been soul destroying and completely unsatisfying. I'm just saying no now. I can't bear it.

But i have a high sex drive

I would and have left a sexually unfulfilling relationship. Pretty much the exact same as confusedDH describes.

The only thing I'd do different in future is leave sooner.

Feel free to PM me confusedDH. I'm female and I can identify with both what you're saying and your wife's described behaviour. I have sympathy for you both. It's a shitty horrible position to be in for you both.

In my opinion, generally a mismatched sex drive is less of an issue in people who have a low interest in sex generally. I think it causes the most problems where one partner has the higher sex drive.

I think if both people have a higher sex drive they're more likely to try more things in an effort to satisfy what is a very important part of their relationship, and have more of a chance of coming across things they both enjoy and even building up a good rotation of activities that they are both really into. But I also think people with higher sex drives can be the quicker to get frustrated if things aren't going that way because they know they're trying a lot.

Ok I'll rephrase, I feel bad for ConfusedDH's wife. Being married to someone so critical, judgemental, never satisfied, etc, despite doing my best would certainly disappear my libido, quick smart.
ConfusedDH mentions his wife is on mn too? I wonder if this is why he's on every thread on the sex forum putting her down as much as possible, hoping she's reading it? Just a thought?.

I do understand how selfish it seems. It comes from a very self absorbed place. I hated myself going through it.

My ex would probably describe me the same as confusedDH has his wife if he really thought about it, but I think he just thought because we had sex every night it's fine. Or he couldn't raise any kind of need or want because he should just be happy he's getting a shag. I think society places a lot of these kind of barriers in our minds when it comes to talking about sex on men aswell as women. Women are just as conditioned to think they shouldn't admit they are unfulfilled sexually if they have a husband who is good in other ways. I see no reason to accept being unfulfilled in any way. Neither of them should be living this.

I feel sympathy for the wife because I don't doubt she's trying. Just like my ex did long after I'd given up. I honestly hated myself.

I realise now that no amount of effort on either of our parts would've made sex with him the way it is with my boyfriend now because we match each other with the emotional and sexual drive. I would say we are both high maintenance that way. And I can see how soul destroying it must be to be with someone like this when you're not. The emotional side effects the sexual side because its what makes me able to relax and let go without self consciousness or anything. I've never been able to do that with anybody else and I've never had sex like I do with him with anybody else. I've done things with him I'd never consider doing with anyone else before because he makes me want to.

They will be happier if they find someone who matches their drives and energy.

I just posted the following on another thread and it definitely seems to apply here. Confused your wife is literally harming herself to try and make you happy. You should be ecstatic and grateful that she’s willing to go to those lengths for you and this should tell you everything you need to know about her commitment to you and your marriage.

Should you be satisfied by unsatisfying sex? No. I can’t believe you’re still allowing this to happen knowing that she is essentially switching off so she can get through it, for your benefit. If you want things to improve, stop coercing sex that makes her feel violated and start trying to get to the root of the problem. If she had a libido before, something has changed - what is it? How can it improve?

I’ll tell you right now, counselling can’t fix it unless she’s experienced sexual trauma and gets therapy to deal with that. Counselling cannot fix an absent libido.

Best case scenario, you’ll get a good counsellor who understands what a loss of libido is (unlikely, the medical community has no interest in understanding this) and that it can’t be fixed and try to help you come to terms with this and understand she loves you and figure out whether it’s enough or not.

Worst case scenario (as happened to me), you’ll see a counsellor who has no clue, who’ll tell your wife to force herself to do it more, and if she follows that advice not only will your marriage end but her mental health may suffer permanent damage.

You say the sex is shit so why are you still doing it? She can’t stand it, so stop doing it and try to work on the actual problem. Having more sex will not make things better.

Response to another post which may help you to understand
*But! I’m not sure having no libido is a good enough excuse actually. Because to desire being physically intimate with the person you love isn’t the same as having a sex drive I don’t think

Yes, it is. When people talk about loss of libido, they’re thinking of having a low sex drive - as in, you’re not in the mood very often but still have a sexual side, sexual thoughts, desires etc and can get in the mood if you want to. That’s not what a loss of libido is. It’s when you have no sexual thoughts or desire, can’t stand to be touched or kissed, see sex scenes on TV and feel revulsion and panic.

If two people love and respect and care for each other then regardless of whether or not sex is the goal, both people should be able to enjoy kissing each other, touching each other, showering together, massage. All lovely stuff you wouldn’t do with other people

See above - you’re separating physical intimacy from sex and it doesn’t work that way if you lose your libido completely. Kissing your partner is sexual. Being touched by your partner is sexual. Any of that would trigger a fight or flight response in me.

If that is missing then I don’t think it is nearly as simple as “I don’t want sex” and I don’t think that is an acceptable answer tbh. It might be because she’s scared of where the intimacy might lead to, it might be her confidence is knocked. Whatever the reason, I don’t think telling your partner you just don’t want to me physically intimate with them is acceptable.

This is just, I’m afraid, completely ignorant of what it’s like to experience a total loss of libido. The fact that there are women discussed here who, despite completely losing their libido, have sex with their husbands anyway is absolutely disturbing to me because I know exactly what it’s like to be in that position, and forcing yourself to do it anyway is so damaging that I can’t even put it into words.

What do you think someone in this situation should do?

I knew that there was a physical cause for my loss of libido - it coincided with the use of medication that has this listed as a side effect, but never went away when I stopped the medication. I knew it was hormonal because in situations where my hormone levels changed significantly, it would sometimes come back like a switch being turned on (and usually then off again in the same way). It’s not like I had 60% of a sex drive one day and 10% the next day. It was 0% or 100%. Then I started noticing that it was coming and going alongside my cycle.

I’ve begged multiple doctors for help - they just said it’s normal to feel this way. Blood tests showed nothing useful, because female hormones are complex and you can have an imbalance that affects you while things are in normal range but not optimal with each other, if that makes sense.

I paid for more in depth tests, saw counsellors, took supplements, took it upon myself to do the opposite to aversion therapy with masturbation and it was absolutely horrific. I didn’t want anyone to touch me but I also didn’t want to touch myself. I didn’t want to have sex with my husband but I didn’t want to have sex with anyone.

It came back recently for three weeks or so, then disappeared again. Now it’s back. I love DH as much now as I did before it back and every day in between. I can’t control it because I don’t fully understand it or how to fix it.

The only compromise in this situation is having sex that you don’t want - not to be too graphic, that is utterly traumatic in this situation. You really don’t want to associate that feeling of violation with your spouse if you want to stay married. Reading stories here of women who’ve clearly lost their libido but are doing it anyway and are clearly dissociating from the experience to protect themselves is really upsetting, especially when their partners are then complaining that they aren’t enthusiastic enough. They wouldn’t be doing it if they didn’t feel they had to, and doing it is undoubtedly harming them.

So yes, saying that you can’t tolerate physical intimacy should be good enough, if that’s how you feel. What your partner does with that information is up to them, if DH had wanted to leave then I would have completely understood, and I hated the fact that this problem was causing him pain, but I couldn’t do any more than I was doing to try and fix it.

Sorry, the bolding disappeared which makes it unclear which parts were my responses, but I’m sure that will be clear if you read it.