slightly confused, pretty cross, and in need of a moan about OPTIONS, plus advice too please.

[psychomum5]

DD2 and DH are at options evening together. I would normally go, but as I am still very ill and unable to talk well, it is better for them to go.

DD2 is trying to work out her options for GCSE's. She has had a book over the half term, and we have looked lots to work out what she might like to take. She isn;t sure at the moment what she want to do after school, so wanted to take what interested her so she had an open path to still give her time IYGWIM.

anyway.....

she originally liked the look of - hair and beauty (a double option), dance and photography. Her school only gives them chance to take four options as english language, english lit, Maths, RS, PE, IT, and two others (sorry, cannot remember the others) are required subjects.

Well, yesterday she came home from school confused and upset. It seems that they are all put into pathways at her school (we knew this from DD1, but DD1 already knew what she wanted to do, and all her subjects fitted with her pathway so didn;t have issues......altho I did have a teeny rant about it at the time).

anyway......DD2 has been put into pathway 2, but the hair and beauty option is only on offer for pathways 3 and 4, which means she is not allowed to take them.

oh, and photography is only available if she also take art, and she doesn;t want to do art as she is not inclined for drawing.

plus, she is also dyslexic, so wanted to take options which were more 'hands on' so to speak....ie, not as academic.....as she finds it all difficult, and seeing as she has no choice on 8 options, she wanted her four choosable options to be ones she was going to enjoy and not fret over (IYGWIM).

The problem now is that in pathway two, there are no options she likes the look at.

oh, and it also seems that the pathways are set as....

pathway 1 = girls who are going to get grades A* - B in GCSE
pathway 2 = girls who are likely to get above C grade for GCSE
pathway 3 & 4 = girls likely to be below C grade for GCSE.

Now, in my mind, this is kind of cruel, and it is discriminating against all the girls. Hair and beauty is only offered to girls in pathway 3 & 4, which kind of suggests that only the 'dimmer girls' (for want of a word........how do I phrase it otherwise) are allowed to take it.

the girls who are likely to be the brighter ones are therefore assumed to be uninterested in hair and beauty (which really isn;t true).

Oh, and not being funny, but most women I know who are beauticians and/or hairdressers are either self employed or run their own business......surely that requires a decent knowledge of maths and accounting and budgeting.....and yet, this school seems to imply that it is only worthy of the 'dimmer' girls.

My DD2 wants to do courses that give her a choice of careers......she is only 14 (well, 14 tomorrow in fact), and she has no idea yet where she wants to be in 10yrs time. I think she is being very sensible.......she is trying to opt for GCSEs that interest her (obviously if they interest her she will do better in them as she will enjoy the subject), and the three options she was aiming for gave her three very different possible careers, but ones which she had the chance to enjoy.

Now tho.....she is stuck. She could choose the same as DD1 (dance, drama, textiles and catering).......all options still that are more practical, but she doesn;t want to copy her, nor is she the same girl.....she is very different with (altho the same love of dancing) different skills and interests.

sorry for the length........

can anyone make sense of what I am trying to say, and can anyone advise so when they get back, if they are still confused, we have something to think about before thursday when she has to fill out her forms.

TIA

oh I am not not being realistic.

I am just cross that it seems to be discrimintaing between abilities.

I am fully aware that they need to take into acount timetables etc, but I cannot understand why they can;t offer all the choices to all the girls, as long as it fits with the timetables.

don;t lock out girls from their interests just to appease the board of directors who want the best possible results for the league tables. (which, IMVHO, is how they are working it).

The whole thing is it doesn't fit in the timetable. Obviously i don't know this school but on past experience, doing this kind of course means you are in a special group for all your lessons as your timetable is completely different to rest of year group to fit around college hours etc. This means your Maths, English etc are with the people also doing this group. Would you want her to basically be in bottom set English and Maths so she can do hair and beauty beacuse that is what it may mean?
They are on a limited timetable as they are not considered capable of doing 9 GCSEs. Where I last worked these students only did GCSE Maths and English and made up the rewst of their time with study skills and Certificate of Achievement courses (lower than GCSE. This is VERY limiting to anybody but those it is designed for. The course itself may be very low level and she would be bored.
As I said before, ask them why they have made the choice that hair and beauty can only be done on pathway 3 or 4. There may be a very good reason.

Psycho - just to add to the mix, I loved doing art at that level. And I'm really glad I did it (still) even though I don't do what is normally thought of an an 'arty' job.

Just had another look at ds1's options booklet. It really is as confusing as I first thought.

At the options evening the teacher stressed that they shouldn't choose a subject because they had to, they should only choose ones they really wanted to 'opt in'to.

Fine and grand. Exceot that ds1 hates languages with a passion so kept wildly choosing any of the four pathways that didn't include languages, even though he doesn't want to do Vision2Learn, a diploma or an apprenticeship, which are all included on three pathways.

So that leaves only the straight GCSE course, which is 8!!!! GCSEs plus up to 2 options. And includes a language. He knows he wants to be a lawyer so that's something I suppose, but I don't know if he's suited to 9 or 10 GCSEs, not with his track record of mucking about.

Gah. It's all so difficult.

'Scuse me. Am very ranty on this topic.

Well. I have spoken to the Deputy Head in charge of curriculum organisation (not his proper title of course) this lunchtime.

With minimum explanation or query from me, he was very open to the possibility of dropping the language in favour of one of DS's preferred subjects - probably history or media studies, (We would prefer the former but they and us are going to discuss this with DS). He reckons that the subject/choice list this year has been designed in line with what the majority of employers are looking for. Apparently 75% like to see a foreign language at GCSE, and it is his view that this is the world we are living in - limited or no choice!!

So far so good, then it gets better sort of. Apparently there is a 'taster day' tommorrow at the school at which the IT diploma is being taught - I had wrongly assumed it would be at the local college, it is actually one of the other schools in the consortium of which ours is a partner. Provided they can get a letter to DS today for me to sign for consent, he can go have his taster. Had I not rung today, and I was in two minds until I decided to query the location of the diploma course, we would not have known. Makes me wonder what other opportunities he has missed/will miss due to the school's lack of organisation/communication. There is so much not in the booklet.

Apparently, in the DH's words, they are a little behind other schools in issuing the options booklet and therefore are not as well geared up for certain things .

What a rollercoaster. As I'm typing, Deputy Head has rung - missed DS in school, is bringing letter on his way home & putting through our letter box!!

I have read the other responses, so please don;t think I am ignoring you, but am answering MNistoaddictive.....

DD2 has dyslexia. She is doing fabulously well at overcoming how behind she was when she started at the school (it took a long time to get to diagnosis, and at 11 was only age 5yrs for reading skills and 6yrs for spelling). The school when she started were utterly wonderful....they supplied a private tutor, for free, for the first term (she came to our home for 1hr a week too, as opposed to school, as she felt it was more comfortable for my DD!). DD2 caught up amazingly well, and is now (in just the 2.4yrs she has been DX'd), risen to age 11yrs for reading and age 11yrs for spelling. Other factors (too long and boring to go into here) have also risen accordingly, yet at first, they said that she was in the worst 4% of the poulation for dyslexia!

However, she is still in the lowest set for english, but she is in the 2nd set for maths and everything else (bar french, but she is very confused by languages due to her dyslexia, so I am not overly bothered). I assume, because of her obvious intelligence otherwise, this is why she is in pathway 2.

But this is why we are so confused with the pathways.......and then the system for offering the options.

I wish I could go and talk to the school, but right now, with me still recovering from my illness and not being able to just talk (ie, shuddering and stuttering really don;t go down well when trying to explain your confusion.....it is hard enough trying to talk to friends without trying to talk to teachers who are strangers to me, and so don;t know my normal speech patterns anyway).

hence, me being on MN. I can actually type quicker than I can talk now, and my typing is still not that quick!!

**

Psycho - I can understand the issue with languages - I'm mildly dyslexic - and it meant that I couldn't write a single French sentence correctly. I could speak it quite well - but the school didn't seem to add the two things up. But I'm glad she's doing so well in other things now - must be a relief that she's got help etc.

In terms of communications, can you not, in your current circumstances, email the relevant teacher at the school and explain that you've been v.ill so can't come in and sort it out yourself, but need to 'discuss' your dd's options in the light of her dyslexia and the only way you are able to do this at present is via email? Might help you to work out with the school whether there is leeway on the 'pathways' for other options that would best suit your dd...

well, panic over.

DD2, bless her heart, went to see the learning support teacher, getting all upset about her options and panicking about coping etc.

LSO has stepped up, wonderful lady, and explained all to DD2 about how the pathways work etc.

I have to say, I am pretty miffed that it took DD2 getting upset for someone to catch on that none of the girls understnad the pathways, and that the options book and evening are not allaying the fears.

what it all boils down to is this.....

the pathways are given so that the girls are given an understanding of where their anilties lie.

ie, girls in pathway 2 will find that following courses in pathway 2 will suit their abilities, but if they tried, for EG, something in pathway 1, they would find it harder, and if they chose pathway 4, they would find it easier.

the pathways are not set in stone in other words......the girls are allowed to opt for things out of their pathways, they can choose whatever they like........they just need to take note that some might be easy, some might be hard.

and they could not explain this to us in a letter, at the evening.......when DD1 was taking her options

very very now TBH (relieved too, am not going to take anger out on anyone, I am just very angry that we have wasted so much panic (and DD1 took options that she might not have wanted), all thru crap commmunication from the school.

soooooooooo

DD2 is able to take the hair and beauty course if she so wishes

she is going back tomorrow to see the LSO, the LSO is going to talk to the head and the options/careers teacher today (or should have done.....she was pretty shocked at how confusing the letters were when she read them and is worried that all the girls are having the same panic issues).

I am not sure if that means that all the girls are now going to be given the chance to change............options were supposed to be in today.........DD2 however is being given extra time. She told the LSO about me and what is going on at home, so is allowed extra time for 'compassionate reasons' (IYGWIM).

sooooo

I eat humble pie........all my moaning was not needed after all.

that said, the school were slack in how they set it all up. not once has this been explained that the pathways are not set so that the girls are only allowed to follow those pathways.....no-one knows that they can chop and change to take what they please, assuming of course it fits with the timetable.

maybe by the time it comes to DD3 (yr 6 at the moment, so a few years yet), all will be very simple and understandable.

MAYBE!!

I am SO proud of DD2 for going and asking tho, instead of just taking options she felt she had to.

that said, she is now considering only putting down the hair and beauty as a third choice, if her other options dont; work. She really likes the sound of the apprentiship, and is pondering catering and dance now.

I give up..........girls eh, change their minds with the weather.

What a great thing for DD2 to have done and got sorted herself - you must be very proud psycho!

I am......very very proud.

She has surprised me TBVH, I know she can be confident, but never expected her to be THIS confident.

I still don;t know what she will opt for yet.....I will find out later I guess.

I really don;t mind tho.....I have complete faith that whatever she chooses she will do well in, because it has all been HER choice, all the way through.

I think the standard GCSEs for many and certanily the private sector are
English lang
English lit
Maths
French
Geography
History
Another language (German/Spanish/Latin)
Two or three sciences

Then perhaps add RE or Music.

I hope most people do realise that that is the classic list and ify ou depart from that it has serious implications and I fear some state schools don't make that very clear.

what serious implications??

tis not like its a death sentence on their future career if they don;t take all those you listed is it!!

It's a good solid list agreed, but I wouldn't think it's the end of the world not to do history and geography or a second language & I wouldn't say the first language has to be French either or even that there absolutely must be a language at all (though I do think it's a good idea if you have even a moderate aptitude). I also think one or two more creative fun subjects are a good idea too.

The key thing is not to rule out anything you might want to do at A level and to have 7 or 8 solid subjects across a range of areas - beyond that I don't think it matters that much.

Some state schools are out of touch though, I agree with Xenia. Especially in 11-16 low-achieving schools, where the focus is certainly not on students who have the potential to attend top universities.

If they just do core subjects, plus 'alternative' options (ie those not on Xenia's list), then when it comes to sixth form they are really limited in their options to do 'rigorous, academic subjects' at 6th form. If they want to do maths/sciences A Levels, it's fine if their options are Engineering and Media Studies. But if they want to do arts/humanities subjects and have not even done History/Geog/MFL for GCSE, then it can be a struggle.

That was my only point. Some of my children didn't do geography and history although I did and none did a second language although I did. If you go back to the 1930s when my mother did School Certificate those subjects were the core ones and it's interesting that all good private schools make children do basically that list or at least 8 core GCSEs from the list - they may well do music, RE or IT in addition but you need the core curriculum subjects otherwise your CV looks like one for a not very well educated person. I am not sure all the comps tell children that. So they liev in a fool's paradise and when they're 20 they think why did no one bother to tell me what employers want/think?

My older daughter has slight dyslexia but is clever. She is now in her first job in the City. She wouldn't be had she gone to a comp and been shunted into rubbish GCSEs though. Because I work and picked well paid work so I can pay school fees she does better.

Anyway this is just a diversion on the thread.

ah, sorry then xenia, got the worng end of the stick then maybe.

riven, DD2 has now decided against the art/photography course. Fickle child....and after we bought her a camera too for her birthday. Oh well, tis something she can do as a hobby maybe!

Youngest son is in Yr 11 so thankfully we have survived the GCSE options nightmare ( he ended up doing 13! He has double Maths, triple Science, double English, History, Geography, Law, French, Ethics and Philosophy and ICT. Thankfully PE is for him a non exam subject) He had no choice over the maths,science, english,french, E&P and ICT options which were all compulsory for his ability stream so managed three choices. Art and DT were definite No No's-which really left him with little choice at all!
We have now just been through the GCE option nightmare. His school offers 29 different A levels plus 3 different diplomas. I'm beginning to think no choice is better than too much!

I've got 2 years before DD has to 'chose' her options, and I'm already worried. She is so far behind in everything that she hasn't done French since Christmas (she's in Y7) so that she can have extra maths and english lessons. Yet for GCSE French is compulsory. How will she manage to do GCSE French if she will always be behind in it? She definately wont be doing French for the rest of Y7, and probably not for Y8 either. She is the only child in her year that isn't doing French.

Loudlass I would have thought if she had missed so much of French then she wouldn't be made to do it at GCSE. Most schools have pathways, at my DD's school it is only the DC in the higher pathway who do a compulsary language and from what I can see in the other pathways more time is spent on English and Maths.

I hope so...but every child I know locally that has been to her school has HAD to do French/German GCSE, even those in the lowest set, something to do with one of it's specialities being MFL...might ask her form tutor when I'm well enough to go sort out the parents evening appointments that I missed by being in hospital.