Thinking ahead re YR9 options

[circular]

First ever post here, apologies in advance for the length.

DD in YR8 very keen on science, always wanted to do triple. In top set for eng, maths & science. Eng. weakest subject.

School groups everyone into one of 4 pathways, with only the top/most acadamic pathway doing the 3 sciences.

Recently had parents meeting. Good feedback on all subjects (although skipped PE,Art and ICT).

Slight alarm bells when talking to the RS teacher (DD G&T for RS). On mentioning that DD 'may' not be able to fit RS in as a GCSE option as once 3 sciences and a language (optional) chosen, only 2 choices less. Which are likely to be geog (also G&T)and music. Was told that it was not only necessary to be a good academic all rounder to be in the top pathway BUT the following is also considered (in no particular order):

1. Year 6 Sats results
2. End of KS3 targets
3. Parents education
4. Postcode
5. Parents marital / social status

Re 1) - school do not appear to have these hence nothing set for 2)

Unsure of the context any of the above are considered in - so not yet clean if DD will be at a disadvantage.

Anyone else come across this?

C

Not sure if I can add anything useful. Our school gave us 4 options in addition to Maths, English, 2 sciences and they all do RS at GCSE if I remember correctly.

Sounds like your DD should be doing 3 sciences and all higher tier papers for other subjects as she is a high achiever.

How can they consider anything other than the childs ability? Marital status; parents education. How dare they? That is outrageous.

You have to do a half GCSE in RE anyway. At DCs school the only way to do a full GCSE is through a twilight class which i assume is an extra choice.

I started a thread the other day. DS has only 3 choices one of which has to be technology which leaves him just 2 choices to cover languages, humanities and things like business studies.

Was just about to correct myself. The RS is half a GCSE unless opted for to do the full.

I think if judged on academic ability alone she should be OK for the 3 sciences.

My main concern is how the 'other considerations' influence the decision as to whether she will be alowed to.

Without getting too political, I dread to think which way round these factors are being considered.

Incidentally, I was told this was a curruculum thing, not the school. Standard type of form everyone fills in - but won't see it till next year.

What type of school is it. Ours is a state comp. No grammar around this area. They should only take the child's ability into consideration.

Is this a church school? I've never heard of anything other than the child's own ability and achievements being taken into consideration when streaming children. How do they justify this? Or were you too gobsmacked to ask?

I'm sorry have I read this right - your school is saying your child's postcode and parents marital status will affect which academic pathway your child follows I have never heard anything so outrageous in my life - why aren't you hopping up and down with anger? An academic decision should be based on academic information.

I think I looked a bit scruffy at DS's year 8 parents evening last night - will they decide he can't do triple science because my social status isn't high enough? The choices for DS will be based on the levels he achieves and the teachers assessments of his ability not the fact that there are some small terraced houses in our postcode and they might affect module 2 in chemistry

I meant to say 3 sciences in my first post. So DD does 3 sciences, english language/lit, maths, half RS, business studies, history, geography, drama. Think that is it, so 4 options. All higher tier papers. That works out at 11 1/2 GCSE's also they might do an extra equivalent one for business.

It's a state comp in quite an affluent area. Just above a drags performance. Not a faith school. Two specialisms, but no compulsory option from either.

With our options if you opted to do triple science (as my dd did), then only 3 other choices one of which should deffo be creative/technol/less academic as a balance. So probably not dissimiilar to yours.

If she didn't do SATS I can't see what excuse that is for not setting end KS3 performance. Our school uses sats and current performance as a guide and guide only.

Nothing else should be remotely relevant. I would (not sure in which order) - query the marital status/postcode/profession stuff with (1) head of curriculum (2) letter to head and (3) your LEA.

Apologies - typed from a mobile and didn't preview.
'a drags' should have read 'average'.

She did do SATS but her current school do not have it on record. Suspect as she came from a private school, where hardly anyone leaves in year 6, and was the only pupil from that school.

Excuse me? Parents marital status, education and postcode affect which GCSEs a child can take?

I do hope I've misunderstood, but if I haven's then I do hope you're howling with outrage and complaining to the Governors, the LEA, the local press and whatever the Department for Education is called now.

How many GCSE's do the school do? From a quick count my son is doing 13 ( Double English,Double Maths, Triple Science,French, History, Geography, Law, Ethics and Philosophy, ICT!) and doesn't seem to have any problems fitting them all into his timetable. ( is this because I am a single Parent, at a pretty dubious postcode but with parents having degrees!) I would be having rather STRONG words with the school, governors and education authority if I were you!

The no. of GCSEs variy according to the pathway. The more academic appear to do less - probably because they are chosing more traditional subkjcts rather than the options that count as double.

The top pathway do double English, Maths (some also Stats, otherwise an ALAN qualification FWIW), triple science, core ICT & RS (RS not for an award, not sure on ICT). Then 3 free options - some of which can be double awards, but they look like the soft options.

So 9 o10.
A language is not compulsory with triple science (that changed this year), but it is with double. It could all change again, but DD will have trouble choosing whatever as she wants to do French, Music and Geography BUT also does not want to give up Drama & RS.

I have questioned the criteria before jumping in all guns blazing - and have just been told that DD will be discussed with the head of science - so it looks like they've missed the point. She has also been told (by the teacher I spoke to) not to worry, as the 'additional factors' do not come into it very much.

I think there must be some misunderstanding here. Schools will use academic achievements of the students at their present level to decide on GCSE highers and triple choice.

Obviously if they are doing triple they will have less choices. In our school they will have 2 options choices but all students take 13 GCSE but take a language and Business studies in year 9.

I would contact the school, say you wish your DC to do triple and is this what he is on target for.

There seems to be a huge difference between how schools deliver their science teaching and I thought there was supposed to be some sort of push to offer triple science to everyone who gets above a level 6 at the end of KS3. Offering "pathways" just confuses the issue. In the OP's case I would just make sure at option choosing time next year she makes it clear she wants her DD do the triple and makes a fuss if there is a problem.

DS is in year 8 and should take triple science because that is just what you do in set 1 - it doesn't use up any extra option choices and just fits in the time allocated for "science". When DD2 did GCSE last year only double science was offered but they finished the course for the double in Jan of year 11 and took an AS level in the remaining time (not a particularly worthwhile one called "Science in Society" but an extra AS so who cares!). Now they just fit in the triple in that allocated time.

I think when we choose schools for our kids we have no idea what on earth the school does when choosing options in year 9 and how limiting this can be.

Same as webwiz, at DS's school they all only get 3 options whether they are doing triple or double science. DS yr9 will actually starting his science gcses this term and has been doing his OCT ITC since yr8.

I do hope the OP has complained to someone - this seems completely outrageous.
I'd really like to keep it bumped so that we fins out what happens next!

Why on earth are people taking 13 GCSEs? The most academic schools take 10 max! Universities want 8-10 high grades in traditional subjects. What's the point of so many?

I agreem =notabully. My dd is at a high achieving grammar school, and they take 10 GCSEs - 11 in exceptional circumstances.

I doubt I will find out much this week as it is half term. But I have raised with the learning head of year who will get back to me after the break. Although I suspect this will be in the form of whether DD is likely to be in the pathway we want.

So I think he has kind of missed the point on our questions on how it is decided.

As odd and unfair as it seems, reasearch has shown these factors have a huge factor which is why the school is using them.
Not saying it is right or fair or anything else but it is not that rare. Whgat is rare is for school s to be so open about admitting it.
Alevel predicted grades are done using a survey that includes questions about parents work and postcode and other social factors. An unpleasant but real part of education.