Appeal stage 1 hearing

[ForLemonNewt]

I'm currently in the very stressful process of appealing a secondary school place for my child and have now received my hearing date and schools case. I have found the information here incredibly helpful and understand there are a number of very knowledgeable posters.
I would be grateful of any guidance in relation to the stage 1 part of my appeal which is being held as a group hearing and especially suitable questions I could ask regarding the schools case to try and support that they could admit additional children as the schools case seems very strong. Thank you.

The school has a PAN of 145 but states it is exceeding the admission number this year due to demand, offering 180 places for Year 7. This equates to 30 per class. The school states they do not have the staffing, teaching space or resources to further increase place.

Class sizes of more than 30 are a challenge for us in terms of timetabling due to the number of very small classrooms we have in some parts of the school.

It will not be possible for us to teach groups of over 30. In the smaller classrooms currently there is no room for additional furniture. There are a number of general teaching rooms and science labs with floor space of less than 49m, the smallest being 39.79m.

The school is not equipped to cope with any more than 180 children in Year 7, and to admit any more would be detrimental to the other pupils and the staff.

I would be very grateful of any suggestions of appropriate questions I could ask in relation to the schools case at stage 1. Thank you

I didn’t know you could win after stage one! Congratulations! X

You can, but it is rare. In general, if there are multiple appeals you will only win at stage 1 if the panel think the school's case is so weak that they can admit all the children without any problems.

That’s exactly what happened today!

So your killer argument could be scuppered in an instant by those currently below PAN year groups taking on a couple of children each in September maybe children moving into the area, or children whose parents can’t afford private school fees any more, or children doing a managed move from another school…..

If they haven’t got capacity they haven’t got capacity! How can you change that?

Absolutely, I have since learnt that my argument is not overly valid 😂💔 the whole process is tough. I have lost many nights sleep over it!!

Well you have to prove that them going over capacity would be less detrimental to the school than the detriment to your child if they were to attend somewhere else. The school can argue they are full, but the panel can overrule that and insist they take one more pupil if the individual case is stronger

Mummyspider27, I just wanted to check in with you and give you some hope as it can be done despite the strength of the schools case. We have won our appeal!!
You need to be able to demonstrate that the prejudice to your child is greater than the prejudice to the school and back everything you say with evidence. For anyone else going through this, my advice would be to really understand the process. There is a wealth of information from very knowledgeable people on here. I have also found the 11+ Forum Appeals section very helpful. This is for grammar appeals but there is also lots of information which is more generally helpful for other appeals. I truly appreciate all the experienced posters who have shared advice with me and with other parents previously. Thank you.
The very best of luck to you Mummyspider xx

Yay!!! Congratulations! You must be so happy. Mine is in a couple of weeks, however I found out that due to other appeals I won’t find out if we have been successful until mid July. I am really sad, that feels such a long way away. I am confident in my case although the schools argument is strong obviously. I’m very nervous and now so down that the waiting will go on and on. Also means my child is likely to miss out on transition days which I am devastated about xx

Thank you x I understand that you should hear the outcome within 5 working days of the last appeal for the school. The appeal was tough and I took a friend with me in the end as I am a single Mum. I was going to go on my own but glad I didn't, so definitely take someone with you just for moral support. I also wrote a speech which I read out. I'm glad I did this because I felt very nervous and didn't want to miss saying anything so I would also suggest doing this.
We are so pleased with the outcome and being able to move on with life as it has been a very hard few months.
I am rooting for you and wishing you the best of luck with everything xx

Thanks so much. So apparently the last appeal date is early July (despite mine being in May) so it will be 5 works days after that. Right before they break up.
I feel confident with Stage 2. Stage 1 is my worry. Any advice on arguing the classroom sizes etc would be appreciated x

I spent a full day trying to think of questions to ask!! It was a group stage 1 on teams. The panel were really good and actually asked a lot of these questions of the school themselves. A small number of parents asked questions but many didnt. I did ask how many of the places offered had actually been confirmed as of today's date. Also around grouping for some subjects being less than 30 so demonstrating more flexibility. The advice to focus on your own case at stage 2 and demonstrate that the prejudice to your child is greater is spot on, as this is where the outcome will be likely decided x

This is great thank you. I’m actually more nervous about stage 1 so this is positive to hear.
I have worked very hard on Stage 2. I have written myself lots of notes and prompts but I might actually form them into a speech like you say. I wanted to come over more personable but I don’t want to miss any key points

I spend quite a bit of time in my job speaking in meetings etc and was originally going to present in this way. However, on the day, I found it very helpful to have my speech and have everything written down that I wanted to day. I wanted to make absolutely sure I didn't miss anything and to walk away knowing I had said and done absolutely everything I could. For reference my speech was about 8 mins long but I had a number of relevant points to my case. The suggestion was no more than about 10 mins. Good luck x

How did your speech differ from your case you submitted? I have quite an extensive case but don’t want to just repeat it all as they will have read it all. My case files are as follows…
2 page cover letter detailing the main reason for appeal
5 different letters from professionals supporting my case/supplying evidence (vary from police to school people), that is 7 pages in total.
Then a 3 page document from me detailing all other reasons about 7 different reasons listed.
How in depth should my speech be when they would have already read the above? Xx

I will send you a PM x