Whether to drop English Literature (Year 11)

[Retrecir]

DD will be taking her GCSEs in under a month and we are in two minds whether to suggest she drops Eng Lit.

In her February mocks she got 9s in everything except English Literature. A couple of the 9s (including Eng Lang) were a bit borderline. However in Literature, she got a 5! She's hated English since she was little. She's a scientist to the core and cannot see the point of analysing poetry. In fairness, the 5 was a bit unexpected - she usually gets more like a 7, even an 8 on a good day, but we are worried that a rogue 5 or 6 on her CV could put paid to some of the most selective universities (Oxbridge, Imperial, Durham etc).

She's currently taking 10 subjects. Should she stick with the Eng Lit, bust a gut for an 8, but potentially neglect other subjects in doing so, and risk a couple of them also dropping to an 8? Or should she drop it, and focus on getting 9s in the remaining 9?

There's a bit of me thinking it's a completely pointless GCSE for her (almost certainly going to to study STEM at University) but on the other hand, I don't want her to learn that you should just avoid things that are hard.

Please advise!

She won’t be allowed to drop it by the school because of the way that the Englishes are calculated for Progress 8. Also, the late entry/ withdrawal fees would kick in at this point so there would be a hefty price tag at this late stage.

She's at an independent who have later in thread said it is OK if she wants to.

She's a scientist to the core and cannot see the point of analysing poetry.

Ha ha, so is DD and she would agree with you (and so do I). She has an excellent memory so she just memorised all the revision on BBC Bitesize and achieved an A (in 2016 before the new style GCSEs).

I love reading but also hate analysing literature.

If she "got 9" in everything. she'll do fine.

It's incredibly unlikely she'll get all 9s anyway.

Only 1165 students achieved this last year out of. Around 600,000 students...

Only 545 students taking 10 GCSEs for all 9 and around 360 who did 9 GCSEs.

Lol and when they don't get the electric grades?

Or they aren't capable of 8/9?

And their parents are all on mumsnet 😉

But we know the reason they will let her drop it is because her low grade affects their results overall.

Ds just memorised a load of quotes, form, structure for poetry etc, worked at it and got a great grade because he was determined not to be defeated by both English Lit and Lang. He was 8/9 across the board except for English so he was very capable and just learned to play the game.

It's so weird that MN kids are always "all grade 9" pupils, when it is incredibly rare to be that pupil...

With those grades I can’t see any reasons why she should drop it at all. I think it would
look very odd on her school record when she goes to apply for other things.
If she’s due such high grades in everything then she can afford to to see but if time to improve her English grade.

Apparently so, because last year there was a poster who said her daughter got all 9s and so did all her friends and made out like it was really common and easy to get 9!!

If the OPs kid is genuinely one of the few hundred children in the ENTIRE COUNTRY that's in track for all 9s then she'll be fine.

Plus it will build a little resilience hopefully if she passes with a lower grade.

@tnorfotkcab If they aren't capable of 8/9 they could do fewer. Obviously. (Not sure why that is controversial.)

The misunderstanding is, that the majority uses 8/9 for grades, while you used it for number of subjects .

@FourSevenThree Oh, I see, yes, I mean number of subjects / number of examined subjects. (I'd be OK with even fewer exams actually; I think 8 / 9 taught and examined subjects is just the current norm, so that's what we are conditioned to think is normal.) But I don't want to derail the thread further!

I think she should still do it. It'll look odd on applications if it's not there at all.

She’s done 95% of the work, she may as well sit the exam. I have my doubts that Imperial or Oxbridge are going to care about someone applying for a science degree and ‘only’ having a 5 or 6 in English Literature. Although ask the school - they will know.

FWIW, I was similar to your daughter - excellent student but no interest in literature and in fact almost no ability to read between the lines (since been diagnosed with autism). I was expecting a D in English Literature but hoping for a C. I got a B because my friend did some last minute revision with me while we were waiting to go into the exam and she has a very lucky guess on one of the Shakespeare questions. We talked that question thorough and she was a straight A student in that subject. So I had a fantastic answer to balance out my weak to average answers to the other questions.

.... The grades 8 or 9.

I see where the confusion is. My mistake.

Surely a pass in it is better than no mark at all?
And I agree it sets a poor example to allow her to drop it, is she going to avoid all disappointments in life?

She should do it and accept that there might be one grade which isn't an 8 or 9. This will be a hugely important life lesson moment....we are not always perfect and we must learn to live with our imperfections. If she doesn't learn to accept things like this she may have a life of performance anxiety ahead.

DS got a 5 in actual English and still at a great university. If she likes science, treat it like a science. Learn those quotes like formula and just have a very methodical approach to it. Learn what each question is looking for and make sure you answer using that method. And yes think it might be good to accept that you can’t be perfect in everything.

I think if she's getting those marks in other subjects, including English language, she's possibly going a bit out of her way to do so relatively poorly in Lit - she has to be not reading the text, or not responding to questions, or both. I wouldn't let her drop it - there will be parts of her degree in Stem that she 'doesn't see the point' of but she'll have to do them anyway. If a bright child can do that number of GCSEs and she's a bright child, she can do that number of GCSEs.

I honestly don't think it's deliberate. She's (very mildly) dyslexic and reads and writes slowly. She gets extra time in exams but still rarely finishes Eng Lit.

This has been really helpful. Thanks everyone. It's clarified my thinking about the potential longer-term negative impact of just giving up when you're struggling, so we're not going to suggest it.

As someone up-thread said, it will be no bad thing to enter adult life having tried and (sort-of) failed, and finding that the sky did not fall in.

A 5 is a pass. Why would someone drop an exam that they're expected to pass?

She doesn't need to get all 9s!

I really doubt the school would allow her to drop it. It's a core subject and she's doing perfectly OK in it.

I got 6As, 4 Bs and a C back in the day for GCSEs and still passed the entrance exam to Oxford. Made it down to the final 20 for 4 places reading English at Oriel, screwed up my interview and ended up at Leeds which I loved! Having an 8 is not going to her from applying to Oxbridge. They will be interested in her predicted A level grades and how she thinks.

DD got a 5 in EngLit and offers from Cambridge and Durham. I don't think it matters if there is the odd low grade, unless it's relevant to what she plans to study. The odd 8 instead of 9 is also unlikely to be a problem.

If she got 9s in everything else in the mocks, then I think she might do well to continue, putting in a fairly standard amount of effort on any of the other subjects where the 9 was borderline, and a bit of extra on the EngLit.

If nothing else, it will be good for the job application questions like "tell us about a time when you found something difficult", and dropping it won't.

The school might be delighted if she drops it if they can then claim a higher percentage of 9s.