Why is he having a problem with history?

[arcticpandas]

Ds12 y8 is a good student. Average grades in PE, arts and music. Slightly above average come geography, physics, science, technology and English. He's way above average when it comes to maths and Italian and French.

So history is the only subject where he is way below average- and this is while really trying (ofcourse or I wouldn't need to ask why he's failing). So what is it he doesn't get? I have asked to meet his teacher but she's been quite dismissive saying that we will see next year.

I just want to help him but I can't because I don't know why he's having problems. Ok, so there is tons of information and he just mixes everything up in his head. I have helped him make a timeline and mindmaps so he can visualise. I spend time interrogating him before a test but he just keeps messing people and dates up. Like he doesn't get it. I never liked history myself but I know his lessons by heart from having interrogated him but he doesn't!

Has anyone had this problem? And I told him that it's fine if he's not getting good grades in one subject but he is so gutted after making so much efforts and not seeing any results from it. It's eating away on his selfesteem. I wish I could blame the teacher but since other students manage to understand I really can't...

If someone has any advice (teacher/former student/mum) it would be lovely..

About to suggest the same as some previous posters, might it be easier if you can bring the history to life a bit? Horrible histories is brilliant at that but you might need to search online for relevant bits for his course or else just get him to watch it to see all of history come alive. There is also Blackadder and loads of other TV shows and films that can really give colour to history. See it more as the story of people in the past rather than a load of dusty old dates and names. It doesn't matter at this stage if the fiction stuff is entirely accurate because once he is interested and has the gist of the 'story' it will make fitting the facts in a lot easier.

Well, he do need to get things right on the timeline. Not a lot of critical thinking demanded on tests; just being able to answer the questions correctly. And that's where it gets complicated because he's not answering the question- it's like it's so muddled up he doesn't understand the question. Like when asked about the arab musulman empire's evolution he gave Muhammet's biography in his response..
And dates don't stick at all and he mixes everything up.
The teacher is old and old-fashioned in her approach. She writes on the board and they copy.

In the big scheme of things....does it matter?
It's not compulsory for GCSE.
I didn't take history at GCSE but I find a lot very interesting now as an adult (as in I read books, watch films or documentaries, visit museums etc).
I just wasn't very interested at age 12.

Interrogate- I meant ask him questions from his book and lessons to revise. It's not interrogation police station style:) I just can't find a good synonyme..

I ask him to read his notes and book- I do the same. Then I help him pick out what's important, try to get it in categories on a mindmap - dates on timeline. Read it through with him- then interrogate. Ask what he didn't know again. Repeat.

He's copying what the teacher writes on the board. I think as some pp mentioned that he would learn better if he could just listen and not copy at the same time.

Yes, but that is a skill to be learned - note-taking.

Couls you practuse with him. MUCH easier by hand than typing.

He knows how to take notes- in some subjects they are supposed to. In history they are supposed to copy everything verbatim.

My son just wasn't interested in the history that was being taught. He switched off.

If that is the instruction being given i would query it with the school, because it's bullshit not a technique that contibutes to learning.

You should ask him how he feels about the class, the teacher, the work.

He might be bored. Does he find it hard to take in information in the ways they are teaching it? Does he have any interest in any aspect of it? He might just never be any good. Is the teacher too strict, too pally? Are there big disruptions in class?

I was shite at a couple subjects. Even if I tried really hard it was dull and confusing and pointless to me.

Not everyone has to be great at everything. Even if he quit history it wouldn't really affect his chances later in life.

In our house history sort of background noise - podcast, doumentaries - kids books/TV shows - visits to historical sites - you tubers we watch clothes,food, fighting history etc.

DD2 really struggled to put it in any order - she once asked how the victroian's dealt with the bombing from second world war.

I bought time line books explained. At secondary there were humanity lessons - and she seemed to get more geography and RS than history in her lessons - she did okay not great. She has no interest in taking it at GCSE.

One of her sibling took it GCSE and other who didn't is doing a related to history subject at univeristy - and we still do days out at castles and mususms though less than previously but it comes up gets discussed round her.

She is now 16 - doing none history subjects and seems constantly amazed how much history she knows compare to her peers - even those from schools that taught history better - local and national. She may not know dates but can look them up and seems to have a rough mental timeline now.

It does sound like there could be an issue with the teaching this year for him - but generally I wouldn't worry - it's one subject that should be easy to avoid at options time.

This.

He likes his class, it's a calm environment. Teacher is "dull"- doesn't make history come alive as some great teachers are able to.

But he's quite serious and wants to obtain "good enough" grades so does try to learn. But he's basically just confused.

Yes, that's him- utterly confused. He could have asked the same question about how the victorian's dealt with ww2😅. I am trying to show him the time line.. they're at medieval times now and reading about Lancelot and Tristan at the same time so I'm hoping will find this easier. I would like to take away some information and just give him the very strict necessary so he could atleast learn that. Because there are just too many dates, places and new vocabulary to memorise..

Is he trying to learn history as unrelated facts or as a chain of cause and effect?

i couldn't learn history at school way back as I didn't see the narrative.

But if he ca see that A led to B which led to C and then X happened as an outside event that triggered D leading to E it might help?

eg (may not be right) The Black Death led to a shortage of workers/peasants which meant they became higher value which led to the Peasants Revolt which meant ....

I personally think the narrative is more important than exact dates.

(Ultimately he doesn't have to do it for GCSE, so you could just stop extra effort anyway.)

I personally think the narrative is more important than exact dates.

I agree - I think it was stories that drew me in and later DD2.

There's loads of history content on you tube - from long documenatires to how like this to shorts on sperfiic periods - then there food (What Medieval Fast Food Restaurants Were Like), clothes ( ) weapons ( castles (What Was Life REALLY like in a Medieval Castle? | The Truth About Castle Living What Was Life REALLY like in a Medieval Castle? | The Truth About Castle Living language spesific stuff (What Did Medieval English Sound Like?- horrible histories drew DD2 in as well

There are many good books and podcasts.

Reading about Lancelot and Tristan at the same time so I'm hoping will find this easier.

Is this more arthurian legend than history and depending on how writting be widly inaccurate and misleading though I supposed it does come from mediaval France.

-

It was as Blue was ranting about how many English Kings there are - I mentioned I used the Kings/Queens most of England as a starting point - roughly know main events and very roughly dates - as turn out that what DD2 done in the end - then additioanl facts get slotted into that time line -

You say he's in year 8. How did he do with History in year 7, was it a different teacher? Whilst other pupils are doing OK with this teacher, probably many won't be, and like your son, will be struggling. Teachers teach in different ways, some pupils take better/worse to different teachers and teaching styles. Also, the subject matter and skills being taught vary between years in History. It could just be that the subject matter, the skills and the teaching method simply isn't compatible with your son this year. If he gets a different teacher for year 9, things may well be very different, even moreso with different subject matter and/or different skills.

My own son yo-yo'd at secondary school in both Maths and History. Some years he did very well, but a couple of years (different years for each subject), he really struggled. Eg he consistently got 80% plus in tests and termly exams for Maths, but one year he struggled to get over half marks in any. In History, most years he was getting 75% or more, but one year he was only getting 30-40%. We couldn't understand it. But with a different teacher the year after, he was back to high marks again.

He ended up with grades 9 in both in his GCSEs.

I'd only really be worrying if the OP's son was getting poor marks in a one-off subject, year after year. But, ultimately, it maybe that History just isn't his thing, regardless of the teacher/content, and hopefully he'll be able to simply not choose it when it comes to choosing GCSE subjects and choose something different for that block.

If its the timeline he's struggling with maybe a Dorling Kindersley book on kings and queens or even 1066 and all that might help. SOmething that's not too long but basically provides the overview of the timeline.

I don't think that for the GCSE, it's really necessary to "rote learn" all the dates etc. I couldn't do it when I did my O level and my son couldn't do it when he did is GCSE. He still got a grade 9 in history without a particularly strong memory as to dates etc. Some teachers obsess about rote learning, setting tests based on dates etc., but in the GCSE, you can get away without knowing them verbatim as a lot of the marks in the GCSE are from logic and skills rather than regurgitating dates.

What's more important is the "cause and effect", i.e. as an above poster mentioned, the cause and consequences of the plague, and having a rough order of sequence of things, and a rough idea of things that happened roughly around the same time.

For example I seem to remember Henry 8 being the 1500s, but I couldn't then and can't now remember the exact years of his tenure. I know that Elizabeth 1 came after Henry 8 (not directly) so she was probably 1600s. Then we had the Charles' (again maybe not directly after Liz 1). I remember Richard 111 was around the time of the Wars of the Roses, but again, not the exact dates.

It was enough to get me a good O Level grade. For my son, whose knowledge was similar, he got a grade 9.

I really don't think it's healthy to obsess and get stressed about the exact dates of things. If the pupil isn't the kind who easily remembers dates, it can do more harm than good. If you identify that's the problem, then maybe spend time helping him do timelines without fixed dates, i.e. just centuries, and put different things on the time lines, i.e. one line for monarchs, another line for wars, another line for agricultural/industrial changes, another line for medical changes, another line for warfare changes (i.e. new model army, gunpowder, etc). to "set the scene" for the past thousand years or so to at least ensure he knows context.

It's a shame about the teacher. I remember having a couple of really fun, interesting history teachers. They were very easily led away from the subject of actual history though!

I hope things improve for him. X

It sounds like your son is really putting in the effort, and you're doing great to support him! History can be tough because it requires remembering a lot of details, so here are some tips:

1. Understand the "why": Help him grasp the reasons behind events, not just the facts. This will help connect the dots.
2. Why did the history teacher break up with the geography teacher? Because they couldn't find any common ground!
3. Active recall: Quiz him on the material without looking at notes to strengthen his memory.
4. Why was the math book so sad about history? Because it had too many problems... but none as old as history!
5. Chunk info: Break history into smaller parts to make it easier to digest.
6. Storytelling: Turn historical events into stories to make them more engaging.
7. Visual aids: Keep using timelines and mind maps to organize info.
8. Use alternative resources: Try videos or apps to present the material in different ways.
9. Stress management: Encourage him to relax and remind him that struggling in one subject doesn’t define his abilities.

And remember, a little humor can go a long way in making history more enjoyable. Check out these history jokes for kids for more fun ways to make learning history exciting!

I think if your son can drop it then he should (you haven't mentioned whether he can - do geography instead!). In Y9 I wouldn't be too worried. My son was predicted a low grade for Spanish in middle of Y10 when all his other subjects were high. He seemed quite talented linguistically (he loves to do impressions of other people, picks up new languages easily) so I knew it was likely the school environment and the way languages are treated/ taught rather than his ability. I got him tuition in mid Y10 and he actually got his highest mark in Spanish GCSE (98%), is doing it for A level and wants to take it to degree level! Absolutely passionate about it.

I think it's worth intervening like this if you think something may be a passion and it's just being taught badly - but if he's going to drop it anyway, it's really not worth focusing on it at the expense of self esteem and enjoyment of learning.

History teacher here. Firstly, learning the knowledge is the easy bit. It’s the application of the knowledge that is the challenging bit. Having said that, there’s LOTS of dates and facts so the easy bit often isn’t that easy.

I wouldn’t put pressure on your DC, instead focus on ensuring he does his best but doesn’t kill himself to get a particular grade.

If DC wants to take History as a GCSE and isn’t doing well, a chat with the teacher sooner than later is needed.

Have you tried something like Jungle AI? He can add his notes in and it creates mini tests for him with multiple choice. Just the repetition of it might help him to get facts to stick.

History is insanely interesting, but it may also be how its being taught. Kids can wonder why its relevant. But also what is his learning style? Visual? Maybe other learning approaches might help it stick.

Dc struggled with history and it was subsequently found much later on that he had dyslexia. He had to work really hard at it. I didn’t want him to drop it (and neither did he as he found it interesting). However, in your dc case, if it’s affecting his self esteem and he’s not too bothered, he can drop it at the end of year 8 or 9 when they pick their options.