Good specialist music secondary school (co-ed)?

[PortraitMum]

Wondering whether anyone can offer any advice. I have DS, in KS2 at our local State school, where he is very happy. DS definitely has some Autistic traits but hasn't been diagnosed. I mention it only to say that he's not very socially adept and has interests that most boys his age (7) don't seem to share (classical music and composing at present). I want to encourage his interest in music partly because it will help him socially. Can anyone offer any advice re secondary schools. We're in N London and the local State schools favour girls. Not great options for co-ed (DS is only friends with girls so I'm not keen to send him to a single sex school. Does anyone know any smallish secondary schools that specialise in music in N/NW London? I would consider State or Private and think he could handle the 11+ if needs be.

I don't know much about the schools in North London other than Fortismere being well thought of for music a while ago, but have you looked into CYM or any of the junior music programmes around? A number of them begin at 7 e.g. CYM's brass programme.

I also know nothing about schools in this area but I agree with PP, how about encouraging love of music outside school?

INE in general the provision of music education within secondary schools (state schools anyway) varies; but even when it is well delivered it is not a large element of KS3 or even KS4. A school that offers music GCSE should have ensembles he can join; but you may find a better range of music on offer at a Saturday morning music school (DD and DS2 went to one with a huge variety of very supportive ensembles and it was very cheap). Does he learn an instrument? Depending on the choice of instrument aged 7/8/9 is a good time to start. I guess what I am trying to say is, don’t rely on the school for all the input.

I’m assuming your DC already does a lot of music outside school but you’re looking for a school where he will have peers who share his interest?

I don’t have any concrete answers but perhaps could be worth searching for schools that offer music places through the music aptitude test (MAT) - my understanding is that some state schools have a few places for musical kids who can then bypass other admissions criteria (eg distance), and I’d assume that schools that prioritise music in this way have a good music offering.

Most private schools seem to emphasise music so I think tbh you could go for any of those in London.

Have you thought about making the change sooner and going for choristership and a choir school? At my son's school, almost everybody is into classical music, many of them play 2-3 instruments and there are three choirs singing every week. An 11-year-old boy composed and conducted a piece for 4-part choir and several instruments last year, in honour of a retiring teacher. Many of them are neurodiverse but that's not an issue at all. Most cathedrals have generous bursaries; several boys at ours have 100% bursaries. And they achieve such high levels in music that 100% scholarships to private senior schools are not uncommon at the other end if you need it (so I'm told; we haven't reached there yet). Send me a private message if you want to know more.

Have you thought about making the change sooner and going for choristership and a choir school? At my son's school, almost everybody is into classical music, many of them play 2-3 instruments and there are three choirs singing every week. An 11-year-old boy composed and conducted a piece for 4-part choir and several instruments last year, in honour of a retiring teacher. Many of them are neurodiverse but that's not an issue at all. Most cathedrals have generous bursaries; several boys at ours have 100% bursaries. And they achieve such high levels in music that 100% scholarships to private senior schools are not uncommon at the other end if you need it (so I'm told; we haven't reached there yet). Send me a private message if you want to know more.

Have you thought about making the change sooner and going for choristership and a choir school? At my son's school, almost everybody is into classical music, many of them play 2-3 instruments and there are three choirs singing every week. An 11-year-old boy composed and conducted a piece for 4-part choir and several instruments last year, in honour of a retiring teacher. Many of them are neurodiverse but that's not an issue at all. Most cathedrals have generous bursaries; several boys at ours have 100% bursaries. And they achieve such high levels in music that 100% scholarships to private senior schools are not uncommon at the other end if you need it (so I'm told; we haven't reached there yet). Send me a private message if you want to know more.

Have you thought about making the change sooner and going for choristership and a choir school? At my son's school, almost everybody is into classical music, many of them play 2-3 instruments and there are three choirs singing every week. An 11-year-old boy composed and conducted a piece for 4-part choir and several instruments last year, in honour of a retiring teacher. Many of them are neurodiverse but that's not an issue at all. Most cathedrals have generous bursaries; several boys at ours have 100% bursaries. And they achieve such high levels in music that 100% scholarships to private senior schools are not uncommon at the other end if you need it (so I'm told; we haven't reached there yet). Send me a private message if you want to know more.

Can he sing well? If so becoming a chorister would be ideal, it doesn’t need robes full time position (like Westminster abbey) any robed choir with child choristers would be a great fit for him (they still go to regular school usually) because he would make friends with others who appreciate choral music. Both my dc were choristers and one “makes a living” from music (well barely pocket money so far but early days) the other is in a completely unrelated field you would think but it got them noticed and has given opportunities you wouldn’t expect

Ashmole (state comprehensive) in Southgate, Dame Alice Owen’s (state selective) in Potters Bar and Latymer (grammar) in Edmonton all offer musical aptitude places. For the last two you have to be in a qualifying north London postcode which you can check on the websites. All of them are co-ed but none of them are particularly small.

if you want a smaller school I think you’re probably looking at private. I would imagine that all private schools have a good music offer but I don’t know any that specialise in it. I’d check out the Good Schools Guide where you can search by postcode and get detailed info. Good luck.

We used to live in N London, there are no specialist music schools in the area, the nearest one is Purcell and it is small indeed but very specialised (~not very academic).

Most serious musicians do music after school, for N London it's Colourstrings for string instruments and piano, Guildhall and Guildhall Kings X are the easiest logistically. Both Latymer and DAO are good for music but not exceptional so it depends on your DS's level when he's 10. My DS is autistic and went to Latymer, the school offered excellent support so I can definitely recommend, but my DS is not musical. DD played grade 8 on two instruments at 10yo and would've been bored in Latymer's ensembles, we haven't even applied for her. Having said that, her private school was not much better music wise.

Composing is non-existing in state schools, not sure about private ones. Guildhall offers some composing lessons in JD but not in kindergarten.

Which instruments does your DS play?

Have you seen YMC at Henrietta? I have no personal experience but I'm sure there are lots of girls in their orchestras www.youthmusiccentre.uk/classes-2/

@Ubertomusic where have you sent your DD?

Ive got an almost 8yo DS. Wouldn’t contemplate boarding but considering private for secondary. He’s bright but probably not exceptional - difficult to know at this age mind you.

She went to an academic private school and JD on Saturdays, then we had to (reluctantly) move to a specialist music school as I cannot afford VAT on private fees.

Specialist music school can be more intense than JD, depending on the instrument.

Thank you so much everyone for your comments. Apologies not to have been on top if this. Firstly I couldn't work out how to reply to everyone (all good now hopefully) and secondly I've been in hospital since Sunday (also all good now!).

We are very involved in our local Saturday Music Centre @Musingaboutmusic @clary , which is how DS got into music. However I'm starting to feel like it's not enough - it's progressing so much more slowly than he is. He also has a 20 min a week instrument lesson at school (previously recorder, now starting flute) - also not enough.

@mamagogo1 He's not a great singer I don't think but he does love to sing! I don't think a choral school would be the way to go although @anotherfinemess1 your school sounds absolutely wonderful.

I will search for schools that do the Musical Aptitude test, thank you @Op1n1onsPlease that's a really good idea. And it's really good to know about Dame Alice Owen, Ashmole and Latymer @Jumpingthroughhulas - I think DAO was the school I'd heard of but couldn't find * *and didn't know about the other two, thank you. Will look into it.

@Ubertomusic He plays the recorder and is now moving onto the flute. I hadn't heard of YMC* *and it looks great, thank you. I've looked at Guildhall CYM, the Primary Academy at RAM and the Junior Academy at the Royal College of Music (which looks like the best fit for him). All look intimidating and difficult to get into but I'll give them a call and see what's realistic.

I think for now I will look into a more challenging Saturday provision and will also look into all of those school options, thanks again everyone for taking the time to reply.

If you are happy to travel, Kingsdale in Dulwich has a superb music department and is equally welcoming to both non classical and classical musicians.

Students come from all over London and well beyond as no catchment. Their music aptitude test is extremely comprehensive compared with most.

My DD had an extremely happy 5 years there and now at a specialist music college.

Twyfords CofE in Acton offers music places, as do a couple of the sister schools (Ada Lovelace and I think Ealing fields). It all ties in with Ealing Junior Music School which runs from Twyfords on a Saturday. West London Free school also has music places (don't know very much about it).

If you are a practicing catholic then the London Oratory from 8+ or Cardinal Vaughan for secondary.
All are offered regardless of distance from school.

try rcmjd and ramjd, as well as guildhall young artists i believe its called? also slyo (south london youth orchestra) might be good for him - they run for about 4 days in the school holidays at jags (non residential), or nco which is residential, and he'll get lots of really good orchestral exposure in those. when he's older also nyo? for specialist music schools there's all the big ones like menuhin, purcell, etc.

Depending on where in North London you are, Simon Balle in Hertford might be a commutable option. They introduced the Music Aptitude test last year for admissions and offer up to 12 places.

My son went there, it has superb music provision for a state school across all types of music, orchestral, classical and contemporary.

Mill Hill County isn't small but other than that meets your requirements - it has a thriving music department with lots of ensembles and concerts, excellent exam results and an opportunity every year for older students to compose pieces to be performed by members of the RPO. I've been to a recent concert there and it was very impressive, and inclusive. I believe there is a music aptitude test but I don't know how many places are available.