PE GCSE - rewards kids for just being naturally sporty?

[mids2019]

My daughter is taking GCSE PE and I have to say looking at assessment I wonder if it is quite fair to rate on sport skills when some children are naturally good at sport and to a large extent skill and ability are determined by such things as hand eye coordination. Also if you have say a visual impairment I don't see how think can be fairly accounts d for in terms of assemsent.

Has anyone got children doing GCSE PE and is it a fair exam with the ability to score a high grade without just being innately good at sport. Seems to me if you are lacking for what ever reason you can't just work harder to be Messi or Emma Raducanu!

Thanks, Yes I had realised fluency wasn't needed for a 9 and don't think it should be.

It's more that I'd hope a native speaker could pull themselves together and follow the criteria sufficiently well to get a 9! IME most of them do though?

and fwiw I don't think it's "unfair" if a bilingual student does get a 9easily. Qualifications are to evidence skills and if they have it, they have it.

@Calliopespa yes at GCSE IME most native speakers will gain a 9. The only time they wouldn't would be if they had massively missed the exam spec and so when asked Where did you go on holiday? just answered "France" without any development. As you actually might in a genuine conversation! But while I have known native speakers not always show off the best of their skills because they are trying to make the conversation too much like a real conversation (I had a candidate like that this year) I would be very surprised if even that candidate did not gain a 9.

It’s a very different story at A level but that's a whole other thread.

Oh but an interesting one! Please start it!

Many vision impaired pupils take GCSE PE. It can be adapted quite easily. VI Boccia or goalball can be played instead of other more contact team sports such as netball or football. Individual sports can be anything really- running with a sighted guide, swimming, dance etc

As for improving sporting ability - it very much depends on the 3 sports chosen. My DS did road cycling and cricket for 2 of his and school did no road cycling at all (not even a trip to the velodrome) and very little cricket. They seemed to be playing football or rugby 90% of the time, and as much as it was good for general fitness, it wasn't helping his performance coursework.

Also with Music GCSE, the teacher did absolutely nothing to teach him how to play the piano. If he'd only done music at school, it would have been impossible to persue a music gcse.

Surely part of the point of having options at GCSE is that it allows students to pursue subjects that they have a natural talent for, or at the very least a strong interest in?

If he'd only done music at school, it would have been impossible to pursue a music gcse.

Yes that was also our experience. Tbh music GCSE is not advisable without taking music externally IMO. PE is less of an issue – DS offered one sport that he solely undertook in school and he was not alone in this – but for sure if a student already plays footy or swims or skis or does athletics outside school then that will help.

Meant to say (but was too late to edit) that wrt my comments about native speakers missing the point, and fluency in the speaking exam – ofc that is only 25% of the overall GCSE; I would expect a native speaker to be able to do very well on reading and listening papers for sure and writing too if they work to the spec. But while listening skills may come to the fore, fluency of speech/pronunciation is no help (and digressing badly is not going to be such a hindrance apart from in the writing!).

It isn't different in terms of fairness from other exams. In terms of disability, of course many SENs will make specific subjects difficult for specific individuals. But every individual has strengths and weaknesses, and at least with PE, it's not something you have to take.

I doubt you can pass an English literature GCSE without ever reading outside school either. I don't understand why you sport is being singled out

I don't think you have to be 'Messi' or 'Emma Raducanu' to pass GCSE P.E, not even an A*.

My DS did GCSE and A level PE. Being "naturally good at sport" is not enough to get you good grades and in fact the teachers stressed that to pupils and parents in the run up to choosing GCSE options. Lots of kids seem to think that being good at football guarantees them a good PE GCSE and it absolutely doesn't. Of course having a natural ability helps, just as having natural ability helps in most subjects but you still have to work at it.
At GCSE the focus of the practical component is in fact improvement so you can score quite well without being a particularly talented sports person. And you still need to get good marks on the theory to get a good grade overall, no matter how talented you are on the sports field. A level is a bit different in that the practical assessment does measure absolute performance more than improvement and you do need to be at quite a high standard to score well, but the majority of the marks are still from the theory papers which are largely science based. To get a high grade you need to score well in all components of the course - top practical marks can't override a poor performance in the exams.
It's an optional subject and it seems unlikely that anyone would take it if they weren't interested and had at least some ability in sport. It's no more discriminatory than any other subject with a practical element such as music, art, drama, dance etc. Nobody would take GCSE music if they can't play an instrument or sing, art if they're totally uncreative or dance if they've got 2 left feet.
Disabled students can still do PE GCSE as there is activity adjustment process that the school can apply for to ensure fair access and there's a good range of sports you can choose from beyond the ones provided in most schools. Personally, the only thing I would change is remove the requirement for all 3 of the sports at GCSE to be competitive as I think it would be good to include things done for personal fitness. I guess that would be hard to assess though. But otherwise it's a perfectly good subject. Yes, it favours those with natural talent to some degree but what exam doesn't? I found maths and science easy and intuitive. I got the highest possible grades in my O and A levels with fairly minimal effort. There were kids in my class who worked their socks off and never got anywhere near my exam results. Whether that is "fair" or not, it's reality.

Totally agree

Yes PE GCSE will probably be enjoyed more by those who are good at sport and they are likely to do better than kids who aren't good at sport. But that's true of lots of optional GCSEs - if you're naturally talented at something you will do better at it than someone who isn't. Pick the subjects you enjoy and are likely to do well at, and don't pick ones you're not. I don't see the issue.

I thought you weren't allow to do a GCSE language that was in your mother tongue?

Yes for sure you are. Apart from anything else, it’s almost impossible to draw a line. A student might have a German parent but in reality only have a slight ability to speak and limited understanding. Or they might be fluent. How would anyone discriminate?

My DD is taking PE and was a high level gymnast, competing nationally and internationally, since she was 6 years old.

She had a severe back injury which eventually led her to withdrawing from gymnastics and is now stumped in terms of sports to choose for her practical assessments. She would previously have breezed through the practical criteria but as she is injured will now have to pick a sport that is more gentle and that she has no experience of. It does seem a bit unfair that her overall grade will be damaged by this, so I agree with you.

You absolutely can pass Eng Lit without outside reading. Additional reading wouldn't really help in these exams because they're based solely on set texts, studied in class over 2 years. Perhaps more beneficial for English Lang, as exposure to more texts will only broaden vocabulary, improve understanding of different writing styles, and give more ideas for writing. But so many students don't read outside of school now and pass with flying colours.

Despite being reasonably sporty dd was basically told by her school not to do it as she was good enough.
She plays county level netball
and also plays tennis and football. She was prepared to learn new sports but they weren’t interested in her.
Only the very very sporty girls (academy/ county level in multiple sports) were encouraged to do it.

Maybe I'm just really out of touch but are pupils really doing all the required reading within school time?

The way you come across is: you're unhappy that your daughter is not amazing at every subject and you just can't bring yourself to accept that. And because you can't accept it, you try to find faults in the system/grading.

As a mother whose son pretty much only excels in sports due to being nd, I would feel very bad if the only thing he was good at was taken away from him in the way of levelled grades or whatever.

Buiding self-esteem on the things you are good at is a natural process of growing up. As is accepting your weaknesses and where you lack. And being ok with it.

That’s on the school then.

A student who plays outside school to a reasonable level should be fine. County level for sure. Like I say, DS played footy with a local club, competed for his county at athletics and then did a third sport in school which he never even competed in.

Sounds like your DD's school only wants the best athletes which is a shame tbh.

Yeah I'd say so. I was really into reading at school, but absolutely wouldn't have read the GCSE texts outside of school, they weren't my thing at all, so that would have all been done in class. That was in 2004 though!

I've got a 21 and 15 yo who both hate reading and neither read the texts at home, or had homework set requiring them too. 15yo gets a lot of homework around interpretation of the text, essay writing, annotating etc. The actual reading is definitely all done in class.

That's a fault with the school, not the subject though.
There's no reason why you need to be ultra sporty to do GCSE PE. It's very useful to be doing sport out of school but it's absolutely not necessary to be playing at a particularly high level to get a decent GCSE grade.

You could say that about any optional GCSE subject.