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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

Primary SATs

36 replies

shirtyshirt · 12/07/2025 21:15

I may have got the wrong end of the stick but I thought I read on here something about being benchmarked against your yr 6 SATs results in secondary? And if you were GD you would always look like you weren't doing particularly well. But maybe I am confused?

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Snorlaxo · 12/07/2025 21:21

I’m not solute if this is what you mean.
Year 6 SATS are used to come up with GCSE predictions.
If you have high scores in year 6 then your predicted GCSE grade will be high so it’s difficult to be exceeding expectations in secondary.

Say someone else gets 100 in maths and predicted a 4 at GCSE. If they achieve 5 or 6 then they are exceeding expectations.

shirtyshirt · 12/07/2025 21:26

@Snorlaxo so dd got GD in everything but writing, what does that mean her GCSEs should be?

Is it really an accurate predictor? I was way advanced at primary but it levelled out 😆

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shirtyshirt · 12/07/2025 21:27

could you potentially be working towards in secondary?

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Snorlaxo · 12/07/2025 21:28

I’m not a teacher but presumably she would be predicted 7/8/9 depending on how far she was from 120.

It’s a weird one because they use literacy to predict grades in subjects that they’ve never studied before.

shirtyshirt · 12/07/2025 21:28

Yes how does a good SPAG mean you are good at art or history?

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shirtyshirt · 12/07/2025 21:29

Thank you

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crumblingschools · 12/07/2025 21:31

In Secondary school there is Progress 8 measure which measures GCSE grades from SATs. On average pupils will be expected to get certain grades based on their SATs scores. If they do better than that is positive Progress 8 and a negative is on average GCSE grades were lower

Bonsaibaby · 12/07/2025 21:32

DD got top marks in her SATs and her target grade was 9 in all her GCSE’s.
DS got about 105 and his was target 5. He was underestimated throughout school and theyd say he’ll easily achieve at least the 5 as he’s just got a 9 in his mock so I was like then change the target grade, at least for your own assessments and keep the exceeding target for the stats!

crumblingschools · 12/07/2025 21:32

Due to COViD this measure won’t exist for a couple of years

Vivienne1000 · 12/07/2025 21:35

All our kids have CAT testing when they start year 7. That gives a true benchmark.

JessicaTookMyLunch · 12/07/2025 21:41

It gives them a guide as to where children roughly are. Some schools set from year 7 for maths, English and science and the rest are their form class so history, art, drama etc. It helps the school work out form structure and at my DC's school those coming in with low SATs were in smaller classes with a TA from the beginning. Sets are decided on SATs but also CATs they sit at the start of year 7.

It also gives the children a "flight path" of where they sort of expect them to be for each Key Stage. One of my children was average and had an average grade 5 projection but completely smashed through that, my other child got full marks in English SATs and almost full in maths. At GCSE they got a 9 for maths and were very able all the way through and tanked English but with help from the teacher and me in year 11 aced out an 8. My children achieved almost identical results at GCSE with a high number of 9s. Went to RG unis.

What all of this means is, deciding at 11 how good a child is at something is pretty pointless but schools have to be measured on their progress from reception to year 6, and year 6 to year 11.

shirtyshirt · 12/07/2025 22:18

All our kids have CAT testing when they start year 7. That gives a true benchmark.

Same at DDs new school but do the schools measure against that or SATs?

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shirtyshirt · 12/07/2025 22:19

What all of this means is, deciding at 11 how good a child is at something is pretty pointless but schools have to be measured on their progress from reception to year 6, and year 6 to year 11.

You confirmed my suspicions 😆

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CatatonicLadybug · 13/07/2025 09:23

shirtyshirt · 12/07/2025 22:18

All our kids have CAT testing when they start year 7. That gives a true benchmark.

Same at DDs new school but do the schools measure against that or SATs?

Former head of core subject in a very large comprehensive.

Both the SATs and CATs test scores are used as data which inform the flight path for the student. Also attendance percentage for Y6. How much weight every school and every head of department give to each of those data points and any additional points added is unique - data analysis is very much a strategy and is not a standardised process across the country, though there are obvious examples of good and bad practice.

In my school, we also tend to get a one sentence comment from the y6 class teacher that can often hold far more weight. All sorts can be shown in that one cell on a spreadsheet: ‘scored surprisingly high/low’ tells us the child is different in class attainment than in exam conditions, ‘must be encouraged to write’ for a child who is actually quite able but is not self-motivated, along with things that might be relevant pastorally, like they have trouble with friendships or are moving up with a student they could really have done with a fresh start from, and sometimes a note of whether a child is known to be tutored or parents don’t believe in homework or whatever thing they feel compelled to report. Often it will just say ‘no problems’ for a typical child. Not all primary schools do this (state schools cannot require extra reporting), what they say is vague at best, and not all secondaries pass it on (some prefer everyone to just be a raw score and have a completely fresh start for the rest). But at the most, this is the data given to subject heads at the start of year 7.

Equally, subject heads know all the faults of the testing used. So if a kid gets an unexpectedly low SATs test score (every child who ever sat that test with a fever or stomach bug, I see you!) and work at a level higher than that straight out the gate in the first half-term, it will (should be!) caught and setting and expectations adjusted. Equally if they aced it by sheer dumb luck or start year 7 with a dreadful attitude, they will probably move down a set after Christmas.

As for GD scorers looking like they are not doing well, it’s just a case of adjusting to a secondary marking mindset. Especially when you get to GCSE - the first marks of year 10 will look rubbish purely because they haven’t seen all the material yet, so if they went in to sit the final papers that day, they wouldn’t be ready. We aren’t giving an imaginary grade of where you would be if you keep working at this exact level, we are telling you where you would be if it was all done right now. Obviously it’s not all done right now, so you will move up! Not all schools are entirely consistent on this either, so ask for clarification if you are ever unsure. The teacher will be able to tell you.

But if you achieved GD on Year 6 SATs and you have decent work ethic and attendance, you should be achieving excellent results across your subjects at GCSE (and yes, literacy really does impact success in other subjects that much) so don’t get bogged down in data analysis. That’s someone else’s job. Yours to help keep that student on track so you get the same sort of happy exam results at the end of year 11 and 13, when they really count!

Yuja · 13/07/2025 09:25

DD got 120, 120, 119 in her SATs and has been saddled with target grades of 9s in year 7

Funderthighs · 13/07/2025 09:31

SATs are a load of old boll**s!

shirtyshirt · 13/07/2025 09:35

@CatatonicLadybug thank you, very informative.

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TeenToTwenties · 13/07/2025 09:39

Thank you @CatatonicLadybug for your informed and nuanced response.

My DD was the first (I think) year of the new SATs, and scored 100, 97 and 96. She wasn't really 'secondary ready' but also not quite bad enough to get extra support. Ultimately you can recover if no underlying issues but if your literacy is low on entering secondary it will impact all subjects.

Finteq · 13/07/2025 09:43

shirtyshirt · 12/07/2025 21:28

Yes how does a good SPAG mean you are good at art or history?

You can't understand how having an excellent grasp of spelling, punctuation and grammar may help someone when they are doing history or answering questions in a history exam?

I think its obvious.

OverripeBananaBread · 13/07/2025 09:54

Our local high school pretty much ignores SATs as far as I can see and they use their own tests at the beginning of year for setting and then setted subjects like maths are reconfigured each half term on feedback from homework and end of unit tests.

I find it fascinating that a local Outstanding Academy chain gets far higher/better SATs results than the surrounding primaries (despite drawing on almost identical demographics) yet the students from the less well rated/lower achieving primaries are overrepresented in comparison in top sets and GCSE results.

If I was Ofsted and whoever is involved in moderating SATs I'd be speaking to the high school to work out what they think goes on. Are these children genuinely outperforming their local peers at the end of year 6 but losing all that "extra" over the summer holidays? Or are they genuinely outperforming their peers but that increased attainment is actually not useful/relevant/platform for KS3/KS4 attainment? Or is the local Outstanding Academy chain up to something and those DC would get different results if they sat their SATs in a neighbouring school?

shirtyshirt · 13/07/2025 09:56

You can't understand how having an excellent grasp of spelling, punctuation and grammar may help someone when they are doing history or answering questions in a history exam?

You can have excellent grammar skills but if you can't remember the historical event you should be writing about or don't understand the lasting impact of said event then I don't see how punctuation will get you a good grade. Same with art....

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shirtyshirt · 13/07/2025 10:00

I also have friends with older dc who were GD in yr 6 but had some 4/5s in their GCSE results. Revision and whether you enjoy the subject matter does make a difference imo.

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TaborlinTheGreat · 13/07/2025 10:05

shirtyshirt · 13/07/2025 09:56

You can't understand how having an excellent grasp of spelling, punctuation and grammar may help someone when they are doing history or answering questions in a history exam?

You can have excellent grammar skills but if you can't remember the historical event you should be writing about or don't understand the lasting impact of said event then I don't see how punctuation will get you a good grade. Same with art....

Yes, but this data is a blunt instrument. It's great at predicting outcomes for whole cohorts, not as great for predicting outcomes for individuals. Of course there are kids who have great SPaG scores, reading ages etc who turn out not to be good at history. But on average, bright students with good language skills are much more likely to have good memories and be good at subjects like history. I was an anomaly in that regard. Great memory, excellent linguist, shit at history!

shirtyshirt · 13/07/2025 10:36

Yes, but this data is a blunt instrument. It's great at predicting outcomes for whole cohorts, not as great for predicting outcomes for individuals

I never said otherwise? And I am very much talking about individual as the post is about my dc.

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TeenToTwenties · 13/07/2025 10:43

I agree with @TaborlinTheGreat someone with good English at age 11 is likely to be better at history GCSE than someone with poor English at age 11 (assuming not EFL or major disruption to schooling from eg illness).

It isn't about the remembering facts, it is about being able to put together a cohesive argument of this leads to this because this etc, being able to look at sources and comprehend the details potential bias etc.

Any individual child can out perform their SATs, or indeed underperform them, but the likelihood is that at GCSE a child with 120s SATs will outperform a 110 who in turn will outperform a 100