Advice on outstanding State schools around Barnet , Finchley for my Daughter

[Suisan07]

Can anyone advice are there any state secondary school near barnet which are Outstanding for my Daughter.
All grammar school comes with catchment criteria, please advice if there are state schools which are around barnet, finchley, Mill hill areas.
Thanks in advance

Henrietta Barnett in Hampstead Garden Suburb. Doesn’t get much more outstanding.

Latest ofsted inspection (in 2022) downgraded to "good"

Wren Finchley
Compton Finchley
Archer Academy East Finchley
Alexandra Park School Muswell Hill/Bounds Green
Ark Pioneer Academy Barnet
Good
Totteridge Academy
Mill Hill County

They had a safeguarding issue. Changed a lot since then.

outstanding in terms of academic grades.

no catchment but hard test

academic grades attributed by hard test or outstanding teaching?

The school has a 3-mile catchment area for priority intake. However, every year, 30%+ of students who live within this area AND score in the top 300 on the difficult entrance exam still decline the offer. I wonder why.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/stats_of_applicants_within_3_mil

Please note most of the non grammar schools listed above have tiny catchments. Archer has a postcode allocation- it’s really tiny in East Finchley (N2). Wren has a feeder primary school and is a Church of England school so there aren’t lots of places allocated solely on distance from the school.

I would also consider QE girls in High Barnet.

'Outstanding' as in, a really good fit for your DD, or just those with the Ofsted label 'Outstanding', whether or not it would be? 'Outstanding' when last inspected 5 or 10 years ago desirable, 'Good' when inspected a year ago definitely not? What would actually be an outstanding environment for your DD?

The Michaela School in Wembley is Ourstanding according to Ofsted, but I can't in a million years think that I would want a child of mine to go there.

More to the point- if you already have an address which you will be using for school applications, which of the schools does your DD stand a chance of being offered, looking at the oversubscription criteria?

A friend of mine sent his children to Alexandra Palace School, and liked it a lot.
My DP liked The Compton School more than Wren. (We were too far away for either)

Dame Alice Owen's in Potters Bar? Selective but takes plenty from Barnet and Finchley.

Yes but 3000 applicants for 90 places and priority within the A band after the exam for those who live <3 miles away.

In addition to the suggestions above, I’d look at Outstanding and Good schools. if you’re looking at the OFSTED rating - things change, and the rating is over a very short visit. Worth reading the reports to see what OFSTED said could be improved - for Good schools, the list may be very short.

From East Finchley - Fortismere, Archer, Bishop Douglass and Christ College might be possible. All comprehensives, and very different and I know children thriving at most. They are different enough that you will likely have a strong preference for one over the others.

@PreplexJ you really shouldn’t judge a school going off Ofsted. The head gets notice of the visit and a lot of it is down to paperwork.

@PreplexJ - you seem to have something against Henrietta Barnett? I’d imagine a lot of people turning down places may have opted for competitive privates like Highgate…

Well, then tell me — how do you judge a school as 'outstanding'? Certainly not by public exam results if the school only admits students through a super-competitive entrance exam to begin with.

@lookbook321

Let’s stick to facts rather than prejudice. If a school is truly ‘outstanding’ and reasonably close—say, within 3 miles—then why do around 30% + of girls who pass the entrance exam (most of them likely with tutoring) consistently reject the offer year after year? There must be a reason why some families would rather pay private school fees or go to other comprehensive school they think deem to be more suitable than send their children there.

@Suisan07 do you live in that area or are you wanting to relocate so are looking for school recommendations to help with your property search. Do you need to be in a particular area?

You haven't given much information in your post. What is your dd like? Is she academics, sporty, creative or have any additional needs? Any info will help people to tailor their advice rather than giving random information.

@PreplexJ - but it doesn’t make a whole load of sense if you’re using that stat to reflect something negative about the school? No idea why people would be turning down places down post-offer - but it wouldn’t really be primarily due to the school at that stage, because they wouldn’t have experience of the school yet?!

It would be different if you were saying ‘80 percent of girls go elsewhere for sixth form’ or something - then you’d rightly ask what that says - but you can’t judge a school over how many people choose to go there or not!

@lookbook321

You can’t judge a school over how many people choose to go there or not! they wouldn’t have experience of the school yet.

You certainly can, especially when the families passed the test, lived within 3 miles, applied to the schools, and ultimately chose not to attend.

These families who held offers are usually more involved further in the process and have deeper insight into the schools than many parents seeking information blindly on Mumsnet.

They received offers, visited the schools, and likely spoke with more teachers and students to make a more informed decision. One can definitely use this as a point of reference, based on how a group of parents perceive the school and this is consistent year after year.

When I pointed out that Ofsted downgraded the school to 'Good' three years ago — contrary to someone earlier referring to it as 'Outstanding' — some people said it didn’t make sense. That’s why I shared more statistics to clarify.

When you said I was being negative, you're always welcome to share some statistics or personal experience to show how 'positive' it is — rather than just saying, like some did earlier in the thread, that it's 'outstanding' without offering any real substance..

you were saying ‘80 percent of girls go elsewhere for sixth form’ or something -

I believe the actual number is around 30% and it is growing in recent years. If you want to know the stats.

If you're interested in some recent student reviews of the school, I can provide you with a few references as well.

https://www.reddit.com/r/sixthform/comments/1e1p63m/should_i_go_to_henrietta_barnett_for_sixth_form/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

@PreplexJ - but why are you so fixated that there’s some kind of sinister ‘reason’ for those year 7 entry stats? The kind of girls that get offers from HB will get offers from multiple schools…they’ll take their pick , which would explain the numbers.

I don’t have kids at HB by the way, and I’m of course aware it can be pressured! But also, I’d trust the Good Schools Guide and their outstanding results over Reddit forums too…

@lookbook321 The kind of girls that get offers from HB will get offers from multiple schools…they’ll take their pick

Sure, a sizable number choose other schools over the one nearby. Not necessarily for the same reasons but that is what they chose.

Why are you so fixated on public exam results when the school admits students through one of the most selective entrance exams to begin with? Any school that works this way is bound to produce outstanding public exam results — but most schools operate based on a broader educational ethos not academic selection to catch some nonsense attentions.

If you trust the fancy word Good Schools Guide provides more than open forums, then I don’t see why you’d care about Mumsnet discussion at all.

@PreplexJ - not fixated on results, but if the OP’s daughter is highly academic then it’s probably going to be a better option for her than, say, Fortismere - and you seem to be suggesting something negative about HB based on something that’s questionable. It doesn’t make sense to judge a school based on pupils who make a decision not to go to a school - a lot of girls might sit 5 or more entrance tests and have 5 or more offers, so…

Anyway, OP - another thing to flag on accuracy here is that Dame Alice Owen’s is only partially selective, it also works like a normal school with a catchment and standard criteria - though the catchment is tiny and it’s very oversubscribed. It’s a good school - nowhere near as academic as HB 😉 - but very nice from what I’ve heard. Also if you happen to live in Islington, or your dd goes to school in Islington, it’s easier to get in…

@lookbook321 You're fixated on results, but the fact is that a sizable number of girls—who not only passed the entrance exam but also live within the catchment area—choose other schools over this one, year after year. That suggests these highly academic girls clearly believe there are more important aspects to education than simply attending the most selective school in the country. Some of them may well choose schools with characteristics similar to Fortismere.

You mentioned that DAO is partially selective. By definition, its public exam results won't be directly comparable to those of fully selective schools. However, that doesn’t mean the school is any less academic. It may well have more academically qualified teachers or a stronger academic environment - though I’m not necessarily saying that’s the case with DAO.

Your assumption—that a school is 'academic' is fundamentally flawed. Your comment about it being 'nowhere near as academic' seems to rely entirely on the selectivity of the intake. But on an individual level, many students can and do perform at a similar or even higher academic levels in a less selective intake basis.

I am quoting a comment from my link above,

"We all did well, not because of the teaching, which was lacking, but because we were naturally all quite intelligent and all perfectionists. Interesting to see that the culture was maintained..."

Perhaps this is the kind of 'academic' environment you're referring to. If so, it's certainly not one I would recommend. And most likely, the families of academically inclined children who chose other schools over HB wouldn't see this as a good academic environment either.

95% A*-B at A level at HB and 92% at Owen's ... not that different. I think there are 20 Islington places, with 200+ Islington applications. There are 22 places for catchment, 10 for music and 65 for entrance exam. Around 800 applications.

@Moominmammacat - I know a fair few DAO families and without getting into loads of maths, it is quite a bit easier to get in ‘via Islington’ than it is from the more standard route. Simply put, they HAVE to take 20 kids from Islington so not counting siblings, they will be taking the best (either on academics or music) from a smaller pool. Therefore the competition is less. Not saying it’s not still competitive…but it works to your advantage.

Also on results - I agree with @PreplexJ that results aren’t everything. But don’t think those DAO stats are quite right (I think last year it was 85 percent not 92?) and there’s quite a significant difference with GCSE results. But you’d expect this as DAO is partially non selective whereas HB is a wholly selective grammar…

Finally @PreplexJ - you’ve obviously got some kind of issue with HB as a school. But quoting someone from a Reddit forum or making a weird assumption based on entrance stats isn’t particularly helpful for the OP. All schools are different and all schools will have their pros and cons. But if you have an environment that’s purely academically selective, and consistently gets better results- one would fairly say that one environment is more academic than another!

More academic and top results doesn’t necessarily make for a better educational experience- it’s well known how pressured HB is. But let’s not just make stuff up because of some personal beef!