Effort vs Achievement.

[seeker]

I have always made a big thing with my children about doing their best, and it doesn't matter what result they get so long as it was the best they could do. Well, today my year 7 dd got a prize for being the only one in her year to get a 1 for effort in all her subjects (they are marked 1-4 every term for effort, achievement and organization) She is very pleased, but said "It'll make me look like a boffin" I said I thought that 1s for achievement were more boffinish, but she and her friend both said very definitely that effort was boffininish because you could theoretically get 1s for achievement without trying at all! Do your children feel like this - that achievement is cool but effort isn"t?

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She's not worried - the kids at her school have a fab attitude to work. I was just interested in the effort/achievement split!

Probably worse with boys. My ds never gets above a 3 for effort (goes 1 to 5) and his teachers are forever on his back about it.

Good on your dd!

Good for your DD. My take on it is that as long as the effort grade is there, the attainment grade will come. I'm better pleased with a good effort grade than with an attainment grade of A where all he's done is copied and pasted - or just dashed something off quickly so he can get back to his computer games.

Getting an A for dashing something off quickly is obviously much cooler, though!

I remember when I was at university being hugely impressed by a guy who always got amazing marks and wrote brilliant essays and went on to a double first but was never actually seen to do any work at all. Years later he told me that he only every slept 4 hours a night so he had hours more time than the rest of us had - he did his work in the earl hours of the morning, then played all day and partied all night.

He gets an A because the school is lazy and doesn't mark properly. It's an International school that doesn't use the levels and seems to concentrate its efforts into KS4, where obviously the results are published as opposed to KS3 where they are not, as they don't do SATs in year 9.

I am a secondary school teacher and he would be getting much lower marks if he handed his work into me, than he gets at school.

My dc's are the same. I've always tried to reward effort over achievement, but they still think it's best to get an 'A3' (A for achievement, 3 for effort) because that means you're 'brilliant without trying'.

Well of course they do, Snorkle.

And in a way (though I suspect the teachers wouldn't agree), I'd rather ds got a Bfor attainment and 3 for effort than a a B and a 5(highest effort) as the latter would mean that no matter how hard he tried he couldn't get an A.

If he's coasting and still getting half decent marks (his are mainly Bs with a few Cs), there's room, as and when he can be bothered to work hard, for an improvement in the grades.

That's interesting, mumbbechum - I feel the exact opposite! I put huge amounts of store by doing your utmost in everything you do - if a B's your ceiling that's fine, but you've done your absolute best. I think I must be incredibly old fashioned - I make soup too!

Could you take him over for 6 months or so??? I'll pay!

I didn't say it worked, umblechum - I said I set gread store by it! I also set great store by doing the washing up without being nagged,, not playing football in the livingroom, eating plenty of fruit and vegetables and not wearing eyeliner to school at the age of 12.........!

I'm with seeker, but it doesn't help if the school don't back it up. Ds told me a while ago that one of his teachers had told him that 'C1' was a rather sad mark as it ment you tried really hard but still couldn't do it. It would be a simple thing to instead focus on how much worse the achievement could have been if the effort wasn't there. Comments like that just reinforce the prevalent 'achievement is all' culture.

That's awful, snorkle - I didn't realize that my dd's school making such a big deal out of her effort marks was at all unusual. And it's a very high achieving school that likes its A*s too!

I agree with effort over attainment. Children can't be brilliant at everything and there are going to be subjects they are not so good at or struggle with.

I also think enthusiasm and interest are more important as well.I not sure how teachers feel, but I would have thought it is much more rewarding to teach a child that is middling but shows interest in the subject, than one that gets top marks effortlessly but is obviously bored by it all.

My DS got a "Commendation for Attainment" certificate last week, but his postcard home for showing enthusiasm and working hard in art (not his best subject) meant a lot more.

Yes, mine definitely do. I tell them that I don't mind them scoring less for effort ONLY PROVIDING they get As for achievement. That seems fair doesn't it? They think an A for achievement coupled with a D for effort is the ultimate in cool.

I tend to think the highest achievement mark coupled with a low effort mark ought to indicate that the school isn't providing stretching enough targets or work at the correct level (for your child).

DH and I have always told our children as long as they try hard we don't mind if they only get a D in thier exams. DD3 16 is dyspraxic and she is unlikely to get above a C in any of her GCSE's. But we know sheis putting a lot of effort in and does a lot of revising.

This is a big issue in our household right now.

My younger stepson gets As for achievement but, were he to be marked for effort, he would get Ds. He doesn't have to lift a finger at school (last year of French primary school) and is getting into terrible habits, thinking that he can coast through life... he is bored and depressed...

Both achievement and effort are important for life and human equilibrium, methinks...