Resitting GCSE Maths and English

[Hazeby]

I have honestly googled this and cannot find a definitive answer, which seems ridiculous.

If you don’t get a 4 in Maths and English, you will have to resit them in college, alongside whatever course you are doing, as I understand it.

What I don’t know is whether it is English Language or English Literature or both that we are talking about? All the websites just say ‘Maths and English’

English Language.

Literature is an add on, it doesn't matter if you have it or not.

Yes it is unclear.
Oʻ
www.gov.uk/government/publications/16-to-19-funding-maths-and-english-condition-of-funding/2024-to-2025-academic-year-16-to-19-funding-maths-and-english-condition-of-funding

Table 2.

If you have English Lit at 4+ the government doesn't require a resit. Though you may want to incase a later employer requires Lang.

Also note lower down in the doc it says if you get the level 2 english functional skills that is OK too.
The FS English is much more straightforward than GCSE.

It is English Language that needs a 4 in GCSE. Some pupils at my DS school didn’t even take English Literature.

Honestly look at the link above.

For government funding purposes a 4 in English Lit is sufficient.

Institutions may of course add in additional requirements and it may be a good idea to try to get Lang anyway, but it isn't required.

As soon as we showed college that Dd had passed her English FS outside of college she was allowed to drop English Lang resit lessons. To great celebration in our household.

My ds was equally delighted not to have to resit English AGAIN when he got his FS L2.

@TeenToTwenties Thanks for that link, that’s so helpful.

So if they get a 4 in either English subject, then they’re good and no resits. If they don’t get a 4 in either, they have to retake Language but not Literature.

Yes. That is my understanding.

@TeenToTwenties is correct, although I have seen colleges insist on a lang resit even if lit is passed. I cannot understand why…

My guess is because they think some unis or employers might require it?

yes, spot on.

It's English Lang, not literature that you need so just English Lang is retaken.
If you fail English Lang but pass English lit, you still have to retake.
My DDs friend got a 7 in English lit but a 4 in Lang and couldn't get onto A Levels at the 6th form as she needed to retake the eng Lang

And if they get a 4 in lit but not Lang, they need to resit

You may find that if they don't get at least a 4 in English language, even with a 4+ at English literature, they'll be locked out of a number of L3 courses at college.

My son got a 5 in literature, but a 3 in language and is currently doing a resit to move on to his chosen L3 course. He wasn't able to do A levels or T levels this year because of his Eng language grade. An absolute waste of his year, imo.

No. Not according to table 2 in the government document I linked to above.

For funding purposes a 4+ in Lit is sufficient.
Obviously specific courses may still require the Lang pass (or even a 5 or 6 or 6).

I think that's just guidance though. I'm willing to bet every single 6th form of college in London would ask you to resit if you don't pass eng Lang but do pass lit.

Out of interest is he doing any other courses alongside the resit?

There are (at least) 2 things in play:

1. Meeting the government funding requirements, which as detailed above are OK with Lit pass only
2. Meeting the standard set by the 6th form / college for the course you actually want to study. This of course may require Eng Lang to have been passed, or even passed at above a 4. Just as they may require other GCSEs at a certain grade too.

The reason that some settings insist on a Lang resit is that they know it is the gateway qualification to obtaining apprenticeships, university places and securing many employment opportunities. The Lit 4 thing being accepted when Lang is 3 or below is about meeting a government funding requirement for 16-18 year olds . In fact, I have seen high-performing STEM A -Level applicants unable to apply for some universities due to their GCSE Eng Lang grade. Some will even request a 6 in Lang for pure science courses. Also, all professional jobs require a decent quality of written communication so it’s used as an essential criterion by employers too.

Well, I don’t feel bad for being so confused now as it clearly isn’t a straightforward answer. Depends on the college and course by the sound of it.

My dd got a 3 in English language and a 4 in English literature and did not have to resit she is severely dyslexic and was unlikely to ever get a higher grade and was looking at a vocational based college course.
I think resitting if you have a 4 in literature is very dependant of what you want to do for some kids it might be the right decision if they want a more academic path but for many it's better to focus on what they are good at.

This is a good point and might be why. Manchester uni for example allows functional skills level 2 instead of English Lang. But it doesn't allow English lit!

FWIW my DDs 6th form (huge range of courses from L2- T levels and A Levels) makes anyone who didn't get a 5 in eng lang retake. Even if they're going to do a btec. Argument being, that's what's needed for almost all courses after 6th form.

You've had some very good advice but to be clear, many 6th forms will take you without a pass in either but still require you to retake.
However, possibly even more importantly you may need these passes to get future employment, apprenticeships, higher education.
My son achieved 5s in English Lit and maths. So was accepted into 6th form, but he retook English Language (got a 3 in Y11) as it's important for his future. He got a 4 in Y12.

Wow I didn't earliest how many school restrict dc from next steps. DD2 failed her lang ( since been diagnosed with ADHD and doesn't cope well with long essay questions). She was able to access 6th form and resat her Lang alongside the A'level / Btec courses