A-level choices for uncertainty

[quoque]

DC is clever and at a great school, with a good chance of straight 8 - 9 in GCSE, but doesn’t know what she wants to do at uni yet. For her A-level choices she talked about modern lang (she is dead set on this), maths/further maths and physics, but last night she said she prefers English to maths and would like to maybe do lang, maths, physics and English.

It feels like this is just about open-ended enough for potential English or degrees in the modern language AND maths or physics related degrees depending on how she feels closer to the time. But maths or physics at a top ten university might need maths AND further maths and physics, right? And I am anxious about her narrowing her options there. I feel the language + English is probably fine for applications to study English (or the language!).

She hasn’t noticed this yet, but the only subject she TALKS about at home is history. So there is a risk of that popping up, especially if she gets a good GCSE in it!

For a child who is good at everything, how would you advise her or do you reckon she’s fine and to leave her to it? Her school wants to do its timetabling sooner rather than later, and would like ideas before Christmas.

@quoque There is the Morrisby Test she could do. Not sure how much it costs but it might give her pointers about a career

My DD1 was a rounder. I would not say IB is worth changing schools for if she is settled. My DD liked MFLs best, so they were two of her A levels and uni degree. She was good at maths and sciences but did not really enjoy them. My DH is an engineer and she could have followed him, but she greatly preferred “arts” subjects.

I think if she wants science, maths is non negotiable really. What science goes with it opens doors and of course closes some! So most engineers are best advised to do maths and physics. FM is good if dc can get a high grade. There certainly are engineering degrees with a year abroad. However my DH knew he wanted to be an engineer or architect. He didn’t want anything else. So I would start evaluating what makes her tick. What excites her? Buildings? How things work? Design?

Or does she prefer learning to acquire greater knowledge? This way lies lecturing. My DD became a barrister after MFL degree - is your DD interested in law or what about a management degree and a MFL? Look at Bath university for management degrees to give you some ideas . Maths is useful for these. It’s easy to look at school subjects and then project them to degrees. It’s more difficult to look at more vocational degrees at 16 and plan what the best route is. Law, for example is happy with MFL, History, English and Maths! Plus lots of others. I would suggest doing two of the above for law and certainly maths for management degrees.

The main aim is to check out what she really enjoys the most and will get the highest grades in. These go together!

An engineering degree is mostly maths and FM will make life easier.My neice is doing biochemistry and got reduced offers for having FM, moreover she says those who have maths but not FM are struggling with the stats.

Yh she sounds ideal for IB

Yes but few state schools offer it. None where I live - so how? Nor independent schools. It’s easy to trot out the advice about IB but it’s not readily available for the majority. For many uni courses there is no advantage and the DD will still need to consider what course at uni regardless of the subjects studied in the 6th form,

I think her choices sound great OP.

It sounds like she won't want to pursue a career in medicine/engineering etc but having the physics certainly shows breadth,

DS2 is studying Maths, Physics and Film Studies so another good mix!

A few random thoughts:
If she is already saying she prefers English to Maths it's unlikely she will want to pursue a pure Maths degree (making a huge assumption!)
If she likes languages, some universities offer Maths + language which could be interesting if she wants to work abroad so Maths, FM + language might work
My niece was in a similar position, could not decide between languages and STEM so took Maths, Physics + 2 languages at A level, eventually went on to do a language degree after realising that A level Maths is really not anything like GCSE!

I think, as a couple of people have alluded to, part of the uncertainty is whether you think she will be aiming at Oxbridge/Imperial/LSE/Bath/Warwick-type unis for a maths-focused degree, or whether she’ll be aiming at a non-maths-focused-degree and/or would be delighted to go elsewhere.

Sometimes thinking about what you’re ruling out can be more useful than trying to work out what you want to rule in.

So maybe the clarifying way to put it to her is: if you want to go to one of these institutions to do a maths-related degree, you will damage if not obliterate your chances if you don’t take further maths. And you’ll also need physics for physics (obvs) or engineering. So if you don’t take those subjects, you’re all but ruling out those specific degree combos. (Actually I suspect physics is required for almost all good engineering courses? But if she has zero interest in engineering that’s no problem.)

When I think about choices in this way I find I usually have a ‘no problem’ or ‘noooo’ gut response!

NB my info is a couple of years old now - you should definitely check. As others have said, the stats for which A Levels were taken by students who are now studying specific courses are usually available if you look around.

My sons' school (which is mostly Asian/ Indian and fee paying) had so many parents pushing boys to do maths who were not really up for the big jump at A level it had to warn people off if their other subjects were better. I agree with the post above about looking backwards - even right backwards. Eg although none of my children seemed to listen to me at the time - I would say look at what kind of life you want eg do you want to buy a house and where, would you want children, how many? , would you want to pay school fees, or whatever your life aims are. Then look at what job is likely to ensure you can achieve those aims. If the aims are life as a trappist monk or zero income as a nun etc you will take different choices. If you want to spend your life protesting against the oil industry and don't need any money etc then you might similarly make different choices.

Then work work to what A levels people have for the degree you need to get the career you want. Lots of linkedin profiles of people in graduate jobs will give their A level subjects for example.

My son has been looking at sixth forms and the general advice seems to be that 4 A levels isn’t a great idea unless one is further maths.

What about maths, English and a language? I did that plus Psychology, and it was a good mix that keeps it quite broad, and keeps up both numerical and essay writing skills

My dd sounds very similar and in the end went for maths, fm, English language and French.
History would have been an option but she didn’t like the course at her chosen college, picked French instead and it’s currently her favourite subject.
Still no idea what she wants to do after but I felt it was better she chose subjects that she’d enjoy in the hope she’d stick with them.

Counting backwards from the life she wants is a good approach, I think - thanks @Xenia and I think also @PacificState that the institution is important.

She sees herself at Oxbridge, or certainly within the top 10, and this weekend when I showed her the requirements for Maths + Modern Lang at UCL (AAA in M, FM and MFL) she finally took it seriously - I don't think she had fully grasped that going to a top institution really DOES mean getting top grades and it's not just me exaggerating.

I honestly don't think there's any point in taking M+FM if A* isn't a realistic outcome, and I honestly don't think there's any point in taking subjects that will make sixth form a misery for her either.

My DS has no idea what he wants to do. He chose Maths, Physics and Chemistry as they were the subjects he was best at at GCSE, and to give him options at uni. But he really regrets taking Chemistry, it is really hard work. I wish he's chosen something more creative like Photography or Music which he also loved and was good at. It would have been something 'nice' for him. So if I was your daughter I'd definitely do Maths and Physics but for the third one pick something she will enjoy. Otherwise it's just a two year slog. We're only a half term in and DS feels burnt out already 😫

Is he in y12? He still has time to change it. Can catch up on coursework over Xmas if it's a creative subject. Chemistry is brutal if it's not clicking at A Levels it's a long hard slog and often ends in tears on results day. Better to have some stress catching up on a creative subject now, than that tbh.

Sorry meant to say above that UCL Maths + MFL is A star/A star/A with the 2 A stars in M & FM. Formatting bolded it instead of showing the stars!

@quoque If she’s uncertain about maths is FM really what she can do and enjoy it? I’d probably stick with maths and use it to enable other subjects she might study, eg management.

If she likes MFL then she could go on and do an MFL degree with one language at A level as pretty well everywhere now offer a second language ab initio. Also MFL is useful if she wants to do eg engineering or history so if she's undecided an MFL seems a sensible bet. Maths is also useful - t demonstrates logcal thinking - important for a grammatical second MFL ab initio or for linguistics as a PP has suggested. Its also useful for History if she went that way and found economic history useful (and also for research as academic history almost always sees to involve databases/mapping or something computy these days).

So MFL and Maths both see useful - she then needs to have a really close look at the A level syllabi for other subjects - what can she see herself studying and what leaves her cold. Maybe do the Morrisby test as a PP mentioned and then look at people in those careers on linkedin and see what they studied.