What should we look for in sixth form?

[PrincessOfPreschool]

My twin DC are Y11. They go to a great school in a dodgy area (where we live), low attainment, mostly white w/c. School does have a small sixth form. Teaching is good generally I would say, but it has the staffing challenges most schools have. We know the teachers now so we know whether the subjects they want to do have decent teaching (if you move you probably have no idea unless you know people at the school), although DC not decided on all 3. Many of the talented kids leave after GCSE to go to other local schools with bigger sixth forms and better A level grades, many leave to go to college. It's a small sixth form and no one really comes in from outside the school as there's an outstanding sixth form up the road (which I don't rate that highly but they might consider).

The school has done a great deal for my kids and I'm very grateful. I feel it would be disloyal to move them! They have been encouraged and celebrated in a way they may not have been in another school. DD is Head Girl of Y11 and would have a chance to continue as HG in sixth form if she stayed on.

I feel moving schools they may not be as 'recognised' and would just be average. The teachers wouldn't know them and genuinely care for them in the way they do now. However, maybe the current school can't stretch them as much as another school could with 'higher calibre' students. (Sorry if that sounds snobby!).

Interested if anyone been in this position and has the benefit of hindsight. Or, teachers who work in schools like DC's current school and what you think.

We spent a lot of time thinking about this when DC1 was in y11. DC1 is very academically gifted (just got a 1st in a masters at a top university) and was in a very average comp with a small 6th form.

We toured many schools, far and wide, and DC1 was offered a place in a super-selective grammar. The grammar had a much bigger sixth form and all the A level subjects DC1 wanted to do had classes of 20 or 30.

In the end, DC1 decided to stay at the comp. Reasons:

• knew the teaches for the A level subjects were good
• classes would have less than 10 in them and in some cases less than 5 (l probably even smaller classs sizes than in a private school )
• there is no time to waste with settling in. You start the. a level courses in September and they really have to be finished by about February of the following academic year to allow time for revision
• DC1's friends were all staying at the comp and DC1 considered them essential for their happiness

Anyway it paid off. DC1 got very individual attention in small classes and came out with 4xAstar and a lot of happy memories.

I would say the only downside was that the grammar school offered special tuition to get into Oxbridge and the comp didn't have a clue about this.

I feel it needs to be mainly the student's decision. It's not whether their parents move them, it's whether they choose to move themselves. I understand where you're coming from with "I feel it would be disloyal to move them!" but I think you need to squash that one down. It would not be disloyal of your DC to choose to move to a different sixth form. A lot of this will be about general feel/vibe, whether they want the security of staying where they are or whether they want to spread their wings, what subjects they want, class sizes, certainty of their subjects running. Also they don't have to decide until results day and would usually be well advised to apply to more than one school/college. I've always been strident that parents should choose secondary schools, because a 10 year old shouldn't have that weight on their shoulders, but 16 is very different.

A levels provide enough "stretch" in themselves IMO but it's not ridiculous to consider attainment, especially with the more able students often leaving. We looked at standard offers for the uni subject my daughter wanted to do and did check that these grades had been achieved recently at her preferred college.

Another factor that matters to students is how much freedom they get. Can they arrive late/leave campus freely between lessons? Is there a dress code? What is the homework commitment?

I feel moving schools they may not be as 'recognised' and would just be average

I don’t think this is a downside. Better to be a medium fish is a medium pond for a while at16 than be thrown unceremoniously into the ocean at 18.

DS got good grades at GCSE but for A'level we went for trusted teachers who already know and understand him, and the lack of disruption that small class sizes offer.

DS is relatively immature for 6th form and being able to concentrate easily was more important.

@Halvana, yes will definitely be their decision but not sure how much to 'guide' that and they will look to me for that guidance.

I agree with the level of freedom being a factor but the college local to us is pretty dire and better colleges a very long commute. The only choices are schools really, of which their current school is a bit less 'schooly' as in kids are given more responsibility etc.

@Meadowfinch, good point about class sizes. I hadn't thought of it so positively.

@Blondiie, it's true that they go into a huge pond at 18 - but at uni it will be very different and based much more on interest/ passion. I think A levels are the hardest level!

We do need to apply to a few places anyway, I guess.

@dizzydizzydizzy ,that's incredibly helpful. My DC sound like they're in a very similar position/ school. I hope it goes as well for them as your son. The school does try to get kids into Oxbridge and managed Cambridge a couple of times but I'm not sold on that as being a good reason to choose sixth form.

My dc moved from her old school to a new sixth form and returned within two weeks. She missed her old teachers who were excellent, she missed feeling known and the whole uni application timetable was so short there just wasn’t time for her to adjust and settle. But it depends on your child

I think there are a couple of other things to consider.

First is the so called big-fish-little pond effect which in education is the finding that students do better if they feel they are above average relative to their cohort. This can be a very powerful effect especially when supported by positive reinforcement (head girl, celebrated etc.) and would be likely to be sustained in sixth form.

Second is that many universities look at school performance as part of their contextual measures. Oxford being the most notable example in terms of their use of contextual GCSE scores for shortlisting.

@tadger98 , thank you. It's good to know facts to back up instincts! I didn't know that about Oxford. So basically they take your school's attainment into account and weight GCSE grades?

@Stopsnowing , that's my worry, that they'll think 'oh, this shiny school is so good' but then feel a bit lost/confidence knocked and time is so short.

That's the idea. They will look at school performance at GCSE and A level to benchmark to benchmark what an average applicant should be getting in terms of top grades. Though I should stress that they look at a range of other contextual information alongside written work, entrance tests, interviews etc.

DD is in Y13. She did look at other 6th forms & got an offer from a very good one, but stayed at the 6th form her school has with another school because it had excellent support for university and apprenticeship applications. The pastoral care is very good. She's fortunate to have a form teacher who is in the same area of study that she wants to go in to, and he's always suggesting things to go and see, or universities to consider. Also one of her good friends is in two of her subject classes.

It's not just results, it's the whole kit and caboodle to think about.