11+ 2025 support thread

[AquaPeer]

Hi all,
I really enjoyed reading previous 11 plus support threads and I think we’re probably ready for a new cohort of year 5s start their prep?

so I thought I’d set up one for next year. All welcome!

we are trying for dame Alice Owen. DD currently has group tutoring once a week but we are looking to increase to twice a week before Xmas.

i am trying to get her to do a cgt GL 15 min tests a day very unsuccessfully! This half term is going to be all about embedding routine 😀

look forward to meeting other parents preparing

All I am seeing is 22.3% of reviews with a 120 score were unsuccessful because hundreds of bloody DC from out of catchment bumping up the scores

Wow that just sounds bonkers. Trafford has a lot of out of area applicants as Alty girls and boys will accept you from out of area with a certain (very high score) this obviously will push the standard up too.

Got Ds mock back. I was a bit concerned that he got a full section of VR wrong so I went through it and it was all right! Spoke to a friend who had a similar thing on the same section. Fortunately was a glitch on the system which isn’t great! The were quick to remark and send out amended score.
Ds got 88% the average mark for the group that sat was 70% so really pleased with that. Weirdly its was exactly the same score as ds who sat last years last mock too.

That's great news, well done. Sorry about the wobble though, they like to test our nerves these providers don't they?

Tomorrow afternoon is our first one -4pm which is a weird time. Hoping she has a calm morning. I have to go into work until lunchtime so fretting slightly but will be ok.

25 children who scored 120 were put forward for selection review and were unsuccessful. 25 kids who fell one mark short - after standardisation - and will now have to live with the consquences.

Meanwhile, across Brent, Barnet, Bexley and Hounslow, a total of 164 passed the Bucks admission test last September; not one of them will be starting at a Bucks grammar school this week. None at all. Each of them passing pushed two other kids below the cut-off, so 328 children lost out for no reason at all.

219 passed it in Hillingdon, of whom just 13 are headed to Bucks schools - almost all of them qualified due to siblings already in the system or because they're children of staff or whatever. So that's another 432 kids who "failed" for no reason.

Again, if anyone here is planning on having their kids sit the Bucks exam next week without either planning to apply for expecting to get a Bucks grammar school, I am literally begging you to think again.

I completely agree with you — brilliantly put.
We went through the same last year with HB. There were four of us, all living right on the school’s doorstep, and each of our daughters was only 0.2–0.6 points off the cut-off. At the same time, I personally know of 16 girls who made it to the second round, received place offers, but are now heading to independent schools — having never intended to accept an HB place in the first place.

Many of them were heavily tutored and sat the exam purely for practice, coming from very far outside the local area. It feels so disheartening, especially when local families who genuinely want a place miss out.

Wow, it is shocking what some people will do. We looked at the Bucks criteria and decided not to apply based on distance, then to find out that a boy in DS class who has sat over 23 mocks, will be sitting the Bucks with no chance of getting in. I think that there needs to be a review of the whole process as it's not fair. I also have a feeling that this year will be more competitive than ever due to the private school hike. If it was fair, then it would align to the curriculum. We were no way as strategic or as competitive as we have now understood others have been. We only started in January. He has worked so hard that he will be a hero to me.

Do you know if they're aware that entering the exam when they have no chance of a place is not a cost-neutral exercise and that it can directly lead to two children who woud otherwise get a place at a local school not qualifying? Or do they simply not care because as long as their DS squeezes in his 24th mock that's all fine? If you see them before next week please do let them know.

@Tiredlady1 23 mocks?!!!! That's insane! Especially for a place he can't even have!

I'm guessing it's the same here in Trafford (although happy to be corrected). I think the grammars each allocate 20 places to top scorers regardless of location so we get a lot of people out of catchment over-tutoring in the hope of getting one of these and either moving afterwards or putting their child through a very long commute (which definitely happens too). I saw some forum or chat recently where the parent was weighing up which area of England they were going to have to move to based on how the child had scored in various 11+ exams across different counties! As you say, the desperation for these places = more tutoring = standard getting pushed up. I read somewhere that there was a 13% increase in the number of children who took the 11+ in Trafford last year too, which I'm guessing is also a knock-on effect of the financial changes to private schools.

This is the sort of thing I try not to think about - DS is probably a borderline candidate and it just makes me wonder why we're bothering.

My understanding is that some of these children pass and then they move very quickly and then state that they are waiting for their house to sell. Ive heard it all ! The logic they say is that the money they spend isn't even 2 months of private school. It does mean that there is alot of movement on the waiting list which is my hope now, given that we started soooo late into this journey.

I guess there are ways if you do genuinely move via late applications/waiting lists etc. It sounds like madness to me but what do I know? I'm still wondering what the hell I'm doing applying for a school with a 50 min commute but everyone round here tells me this is fine and they take it on their stride. I'll worry about it if we actually get in I think. Good luck anyone else with exams today.

How did yesterday go?

That system in Bucks is nuts, I don't understand that. Why don't they just introduce a catchment?!

Hertfordshire doesn't have full grammars but has some partially selective schools - although they mostly have catchments, I do know of lots of people who use them as practice runs for the independents, QE with no intention of ever taking a place. Thankfully the system here means that when they are offered a place and decline it, it just bounces down to the next eligible child on the list. There is no specific mark to achieve, they just offer places from the highest scorer down until all places are filled. Still annoying for the parents of children who miss out on allocation day and then have the process of waiting to see who gives up their spot - but at least local kids who score high enough still have a chance.

@IsThatYouPam you’re so right to not think about!
We can’t control it so all we can focus on is our dcs trying their best. Which site are you sitting at?
Ds last year did it at Alty boys and my god there were so many there!! I’ve already spoke to ds that sitting in a couple of weeks to try explain how bonkers it is 😝

The issue is that the superselectives stay superselective because a lot of the local comps want the higher achieving kids and don’t want the superselectives to take all the local high achieving kids either. So then the kids who do not quite get into the superselective (because here we get exam tourism from people living all over the country, I kid you not!) and so there is push out and down from that level. Grammars are free whereas catchment schools you pay up via stamp duty or higher rents. So those in Central London travelling on the train to St Olave’s, HB, Wilson’s, QE etc should they also be forced to go to their catchment schools? I know some kids travelling out all the way to the superselectives in Tonbridge as if you live on the train line and walking distance to it in London itself, it is quite a nice journey going out. The “superselectives” in Kent were increasingly made to allow less out of catchment. Bucks is actually quite protective as the date you have to move in is early. Imagine in Kent you have until some time in December to move into catchment. I think Bexley too. So some kids are being pushed out of Bexley potentially too and then the parents move to Kent by the deadline! There is movement happening all over. There just are some parents who will only do “grammar” at whatever cost. Hopefully they are the small minority!

I’m on a WhatsApp for Ds who starts Y7 tomorrow at the grammar I’m hoping for for Y6 Ds. Everyone was asking who was getting which bus in the morning and someone asked if anyone else was travelling from Bolton. Bolton is about an hour and a half drive away in rush hour traffic! I felt really sorry for that poor boy it’s just madness.

For Bucks though, if you live in catchment, you are a higher priority (usually rule 5 rather than 6) than out of catchment children. So if your child does succeed in passing and you’re applying to your local grammar, they will have a higher admissions priority than out of catchment children.

Totally. I think I'm right in saying that in most years all the Bucks grammar schools offer places to all applicants in their catchments (this may well change as developments like Hamden Fields add hundreds of new kiddies but let's see). The problem is that they've combined a solid locals-first admissions policy with a selection test that is open to being skewed by prep school pupils in Aberdeen or wherever. So if you're a local kid who passes the test you'll likely get a place without too much fuss, but passing the test is harder than it should be thanks to non-locals. ARRRRGHHHH!

Anyway, DS, just got his best-ever score on an NVR practice paper so maybe he's finally getting his head around it just in time. Our plan now is to keep him doing lots of practice papers over the coming week just so that every type of question is familiar and he knows where the beartraps are and what mistakes to avoid. Nine days to go...

Home! It sounded tough tbh, especially the timings but she's in reasonable spirits, especially when she realised she never has to do NVR ever again. Latymer on Saturday but that's English, maths and VR only

I was pleased to get her there on time with the right bits of paper!

@Magnificentkitteh where did she sit for today? We have Latymer on Sunday.

Henrietta Barnett. Good luck for Sunday. Are you sitting for anywhere else?

@Magnificentkitteh thanks, you too! We had DAO yesterday and have Henrietta tomorrow! How did your daughter find it? I've told mine to try and be quick as I know time is tight!

Yeah it was quite tough I think. I think she just about finished it but had to guess a couple and definitely no time for checking. There was like 4 mins per section. Sounds unnecessarily stressful. How was DAO? We aren't in catchment for that unfortunately even though the Islington border is down the road

@Magnificentkitteh yes I heard the NVR sections are 4 mins each... 30 seconds per question! DAO was fine she said - she likes VR and there were no surprise question types. She hates rhyming synonyms, anagrams with missing letter and Shuffled sentences - none of which appeared! Although I know they're popular for Latymer.

30 seconds a question is ridiculous 🙄. I am not sure if they are measuring natural ability or speed 🤔