Those who just did the 11+ exam, can you help me please to understand it?

[fool11]

Hi, hope somebody can explain in simple terms how does it actually work (11+ exam)...my daughter is in y5 currently. I'm not from this country so don't really understand the whole system and really confused by all different posts about the scores and also stage 1 and stage 2..
We only have one and NOT very good secondary school (not even good, needs improvement) in our catchment, so the only other option would be private, which we cant afford (unless we try to do an exam and apply for bursary is she would do v well) or try some grammar school (out of catchment), as DD loves learning and doing really well and her teacher thinks she should try.
So is 11+ exam just a different name for SAT tests they take in y6? are there diff versions, depending on where you live or school you apply for? or do kids need to sit some generic test first (SAT) and then do some separate tests for different schools and do it at stages? I thought 11+ is a test (in english, math, verbal and non verbal reasoning) you take on the same day and max score you can get is around 140..or is each section rated separately and you take in on diff days (hence stage 1 and 2)? how do you get scores 210 or 300 etc - is it different for each school? So confused by the whole thing I have no idea where to start. We can't afford private tutors and it looks like everyone is having one, so i would need to try to get some workbooks or online papers (again, it looks like there are so many different versions..are they different for each school or are there some generic which you could use for SAT/11+ test). Would really appreciate someone explain in simple terms how the whole 11+ exam works as I've searched google, forums here and I'm more confused than ever before, thank you kindly.

Short answer is that it depends on where you live and, in some cases, which school.

Can you let us know the county?

Thank you. We are in Surrey, closest grammar school is Nonsuch girls ( out of our catchment), then only private schools like Reigate Grammar or Epsom college .

Google the Sutton Selective Eligibility Test and use the advanced search on Mumsnet. Looks like first stage is maths and English multiple choice then a second round for smaller group with written English and maths.

Thank you. Appreciate it.

I don’t know much about Surrey so I won’t try to answer most of your questions To answer one though, no it’s not just another name for SATS. 11+ is usually taken in autumn of y6 (varies by county/school), by a relatively small number of pupils. SATS are taken in May of y6 by almost all pupils who are state schools. Though children who do well on one will likely do well on the other, there’s no connection between the two.

thanks @modgepodge. ..so 2 diff exams..so presume the study material would be completely different..

Ok so you live around Banstead? Depending on where exactly you live might be worth looking at other Sutton comprehensive schools as well as for example the Epsom ones if you are that side.

You really need to look at the exams for each school to see what is in it - for Nonsuch see here: https://www.nonsuchschool.org/attachments/download.asp?file=243&type=pdf

The biggest difference is not so much in the content as that the exam will examine stuff that your child may not have learnt in the autumn of year 6 yet and also they need to be used to the exam style and how to answer questions for that exam.

Also just to add - the Ofsted report you are worried about is a snapshot of a school that is clearly in the middle of huge improvements that weren't fully embedded at the time of the report. Ofsted will be back perhaps not before you apply, but before your daughter starts year 7 wherever she ends up. It will definitely be worth keeping an eye on what that says but in the meantime, do go and look around. You may well be surprised by what it's like.

I am going to do this very simply. If sounds like I think you are 5 I apologise!
The 11 plus is completely different from SATS - essentially there are three main different types of school:

• Secondary schools
• Grammar schools
• Private schools

Secondary schools are state run (although they may have some business funding if they are academies). They are financed by the government so parents don't have to pay to send their child there, and take most children regardless of ability.

Grammar schools are also state run and parents do not have to pay to send their kids there, but there is entrance exam to get in (usually 11+, or some schools have their own tests), and they will likely take only children who get the top scores in the exam.

Private schools are not state run or funded. Parents have to pay to send their children there. They may take children of any ability whose parent is willing to pay, or the child may have to pass a test as well.

History...
Historically, up until the of the 1800s, education was only compulsory up to the age of 11. Most children went to the free village school until then, and after that the wealthy would send their children to "Grammar Schools" and the poor would send theirs into the factory or down the mine.

As a legacy of this, a lot of private schools with old foundations will be called Grammar Schools because this was what they were set up as before other secondary schools existed. When "grammar schools" became the term used for a state run school which a child needed to pass a test to get into, many of these foundations didn't change their names. So they are now called "...grammar schools", are private, and may have an entrance exam or may take anyone willing to pay.

SATs is not the same as 11+
Why would you like to apply to school ( NonSuch) that you are not in catchment of? Call the school and check if they are even considering children outside of catchment if they pass with flying marks.
Consider instead Wallington, I don't think they have catchment. There are many grammar schools that don't have catchment in London but you would need to move.

yes we are close to Banstead. Thank you all, appreciate it. Have something to start with now..at least i understand now that SAT and 11+ are 2 different exams ( just came across somebody mentioning ISEB on web, presume another type of exam). Will check Nonsuch exams and Sutton Selective Eligibility Test...Any online/paper books you can recommend to help to understand the exam style and answer questions? (or does each school have a diff style?) I've seen people mentioning CGP books and Atom? online..would that be useful/good starting point for home learning?

If you want your child to take the 11+ you will also need to register them for it. Every year, we see people posting on MN who forgot/didn't realise they had to.

If you look at the websites for each of the schools you are interested in, they should provide all the information you need about the entrance procedure for each school, as they will all differ. There is usually information about the type of 11+ exam each school uses, and when to register your child for the exam (you can’t just turn up on the day!)

The schools won’t encourage or recommend tutoring, but recognise that it is helpful for children to have a good idea of what they will be dealing with, so they often signpost useful resources for familiarisation with the exam which can be used at home.

Our local state Grammar offers some after-school familiarisation classes later on in the school year for Yr 5 children who intend to sit the school’s 11+, and I imagine some other schools will do the same. That can be helpful as well, as a way of getting the children used to going to the place where they will eventually sit the exam. Hope all goes well, op!

@fool11 , there is a website that covers lots of your questions
elevenplusexams.co.uk
The Surrey forum page covers nonsuch.

Thank you all for your time/help and suggestions.

My best advice would be to ask around other parents to see if any of their kids are doing it (or if older siblings did it) and enquire about the better local tutors.

The test is much more in depth than SATs and covers the whole of year 6 Maths & English even though it's taken a few weeks into year 6. It also has a large section on Mensa type non-verbal reasoning picture questions which aren't included in the school curriculum at all, so some prep is needed.

There are a lot of free practice resources online - maybe print DD off a few and see if she enjoys doing them?

Definitely have an ask around. There will be parents who are knowledgeable about it.

Schools will often have a practice paper or two on their websites in the admissions section.