Applying to Harpenden from overseas

[perplexedmom]

Hi, we live overseas and are going to be returning to Hertfordshire within the next two years. I have 3 children going into Rec, Year 6 and Year 7 this September. We have a house in St Albans and it is currently generating a good income so we don't want to disrupt that. We also have the option of staying at my mother's house in Caddington rent free. Here's my issue. If we all move back in summer 2026, the three children will all be 'in year' applications. Which will be virtually impossible to get into any of the schools in Harpenden (that's where we want to buy a house). If we get my year 6 daughter to apply for year 7 for 2026 entry, then it's a natural intake year and she will have the best chance of getting in to a Harpenden school, then the two other children would follow a year later with the sibling rule. I'm not sure which one to put down as 1,2 3. Sir John Lawes, Roundwood Park or St George's (we would have to provide a signed certificate which we could by a Vietnamese priest but I'm not sure how much weight that would have). Also, I'm not sure if applying from Caddington would actually get her into a school in Harpenden? Especially as it's in another county. But I know it's not impossible.

I'm so anxious about this so any advice would be great. Sorry for the long post.

• Sorry, I meant year 7 for 2025 entry, not 2026.

Those are all very popular schools OP, ones that people in Harpenden don't get their DC into unless they live within the catchment, so I find it very hard to imagine how you'd get a place for your DC if you were a) doing in-year applications and b) living in Caddington. I live very nearby and have friends with DC at all those schools and you have to live very close to be guaranteed a place. I doubt they have any spaces for in-year applications.

It's not clear how you would apply for a year 7 place this October @perplexedmom - would you use your mother's address for the application? You would need to be living there - is that the plan?

I don't know the specific schools I'm afraid but if you are hoping for your other DC to jump up the list on a sibling rule, make sure that the secondary school operates that rule (not all do IME).

Sibling priority would only work if your dc1 was placed at top of waiting list, there was a space in their year and after dc2 had actually started.

I'd move into the st Albans house and apply for a school
There You won't get harpenden remotely. You will easy get a tenant again

Harpenden Is Full of snobs and the shops are
Shit anyway.

I am living in Vietnam and we would be applying this year for a year 7 place next September. Yes, if we gave the Caddington address then we would live there.

True. We could get another tenant.

So would you be living there in October? You need to be living at the address (and be able to prove it) to apply for a school place.

If the St Albans house is in the catchment area then you could apply from there without actually living in it but this would be against the rules and it would depend how good the local authority checks are.

We live in SW London and they don't check unless someone reports you and people WILL report you so don't tell anyone if you go down that route. Be aware that some councils will remove a place even after a child has started if they can prove you broke the rules. Our council will do it up until Xmas so if you get through the first term you're fine.

You're absolutely right that your best bet is to apply for a place in the normal cycle for Yr7 and Reception and that will get your other DC to the top of the waiting lists but you will need a house in the area. You could rent somewhere but you might find the council will only count the house you own - this might apply to your mums house too - but you could probably easily prove you've had the St Albans house rented out for years if they challenge you. You need to check the rules very carefully so you know what you are doing.

I know a family who bought a flat in the catchment area for a good secondary. They never lived in it but used it for their application. They then sold their actual house and moved the day after school started. So the paperwork all stacks up that they moved from one house to another. Someone reported them, the children were interviewed by the council. It was messy but they got away with it and it all cost less than 6 years of private school.

You'll need to decide how heavy your conscience will weigh on you and your appetite for risk before going down that route!

If it were me, I'd buy the house I intended to live in asap and apply from there. Then either rent it out until I moved back or suck up the mortgage payments for however many months it might be.

We would have to use our Vietnam address as the permanent address and then give our secondary UK address ie. Caddington and then send them proof the day we move back to the UK (next June 2025)

You definitely wouldn’t get in to SJL from there - our friends who live slightly further away in Harpenden than us are having to move to get into catchment. I would assume the same for Roundwood. Don’t know about St G’s given church element. However, you need to be living in the house when you apply or it would be fraudulent to use that address.

If your oldest is a girl you could go STAGs from the St Albans house as it is a fantastic school with a bigger catchment, then deal with siblings when needed.

You can't apply until you are actually in the UK so that plan won't work I'm afraid (unless you're a crown servant).

Yeh that won't work - you will not be living in the UK so you cannot apply for a state school place.

@RNBrie Be aware that some councils will remove a place even after a child has started if they can prove you broke the rules. Our council will do it up until Xmas so if you get through the first term you're fine.

Yeh you're fine if you can square with your conscience that you are committing fraud to get a place at a specific school! tbf you do say that.

It would have been a good idea had we not re resigned the tenancy contract and it ends next September!

If you are not applying from a local junior school the residency checks will be much tighter.

There are few flaws with your plan:

1. The secondary school application system is probably designed to stop exactly what you want to do . The system is designed to put local children in local schools.

2. Caddington is in Bedfordshire so isn't in the "priority area" for any Hertfordshire schools. Even if it was, the distance is too far for any Harependen or St Albans school. You can see the schools and how far the catchment is for this year here:

https://www.hertfordshire.gov.uk/services/schools-and-education/school-admissions/research-a-school/school-admissions-previous-years-statistics.aspx#DynamicJumpMenuManager_1_Anchor_1

You'll see this year no children went to Roundwood or St John Lawes got a place from outside the priority area. In fact , for Roundwood it had to be your nearest school.

3. In reality for a good school, there is very little movement between allocation day and 1st day of term (I know, my son sat at #8 in the St Albans schools list for the entirity of this period and through Year 7). People just don't tend to move at that stage. Many have set up plans for years to be exactly in the right place for their kids to go the right school. It's usually a year or two before these plans start to change. I think your older children would probably have a better chance of getting a place TBH.

4. I think your best bet is to move back to your house in St Albans and get whatever school you are allocated. Uness you're on the doorstep of another school, this will likely be Townsend School or Verulam.

My youngest son goes to Verulam. Even though it's the 2nd least desirable school in St Albans it's absolutely fine. Lots of bright boys from Hong Kong recently joined. And nice, polite local kids , interested in the world. New head interested in lots of new technology. (My eldest son went to a highly desirable state school with no sibling rule, I am not noticing that much difference).

If you can't stomach this, I guess see if you can get a private school place until you have found your Harpenden home and places have become available.

Thank you @Sparsely , it's certainly food for thought. I think we will have to wait until our rental contract expires with the tenant and move back to St Albans the year after and they will all be 'in year' applications.

I'm not sure I mentioned any fraudulent activities in my post. And yes, you can apply from abroad (guess what, people do live abroad you know and they move jobs) and the rules are that you have to put your overseas address in your application and you have to give your UK address when you move to it. Thank you.

Thanks. I'm not worried about the residency checks as I won't be committing any fraudulent activities. If you apply from abroad, you have to give your overseas address and then change it when you move to the UK. That's the rule. It's just the timing of when we move back will be in June, as soon as school breaks up in SE Asia.

@perplexedmom I never said you were committing or planning commit fraud. Or that anyone was tbh. I just pointed out that another PP's post appeared to be encouraging or at least suggesting fraud - ie breaking the rules by claiming to live somewhere they don't. And how you could be 'fine' as long as you got through the first term without being found out.

Can you not move back and rent somewhere for a year, until you can end the tenancy on the St A place which you own?

At Reception level you may end up with a decent choice of school due to falling birth rates (this has been the pattern in St A - catchment for one primary went from something like 300m to 3k in a single year!!). But for in year applications for your older two I agree your only choice will likely be Townsend or Verulam for boys. You hear good and bad things about both schools.

But if a particular school or schools are important to you really the only way to get them is to move well within catchment in by the end of October (though as above catchment not necessary for STAGs), which I appreciate may not be at all feasible.

Can you not move back and rent somewhere for a year, until you can end the tenancy on the St A place which you own?

I would be very careful to establish that the LA would accept the rental address and not use the address of the existing house for admissions purposes - especially if the rental would confer an advantage for 'more desirable' schools applied for than the latter.