Secondaries: State or Private around Blackheath area SE3? Opinions on these schools?

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I have a difference of opinion with my DH over education generally - in a nutshell husband thinks private is universally better and I would prefer state if possible. The irony is that I myself went to private school and husband went to state, and husband did much better than me and ended up at Cambridge! I think husband arrived at Cambridge and saw a lot of privately educated people with all their confidence and opportunities and feels he wants that for his son. I get it but I am keen for our son to be able to operate in the real world and mix with everyone. But we are keen to find a school which is very aspirational.

Anyway, that's the broad debate but it's not relevant just yet. Child is still early primary so as yet we don't know enough about his needs / attributes / interests but will obviously look for a school that suits him when the time comes.

I an ideal world there would be an amazing aspirational state school near us (similar to, say, Graveney in Tooting) and this would satisfy both me and my husband! However as yet it seems the main state options for us are
John Roan School
Thomas Tallis
Leigh Academy

Plus an array of private options. I know grammars in Kent are popular but we are not keen on the stress that the entry exam might induce.

What are the opinions on these school options?

Tallis is probably perceived as 'better' than Roan locally - but none of them are like Graveney if that's what you're after? Maybe go and have a look round them.

There are single sex schools for girls that you could consider? Eltham Hill / St Ursulas / Greycoats (in town) - not sure there are any real boys equivalents.

in SE3 you will also be able to access the Bexley grammars and St Olaves. Appreciate you don't like the idea of an entrance exam but it might be worth considering if you're planning to stay in SE3?

Tallis is the worst academically, but none are great really. https://www.compare-school-performance.service.gov.uk/schools-by-type?step=default&table=schools&region=203&geographic=la&for=secondary&orderby=ks4.0.PTL2BASICS_95&orderdir=asc

Surely he will have to sit entrance exams for the indie options (unless your DH is thinking of finding an indie which gives the polish but isn't too bothered about the academics, just for the sake of indie rather than state on your DS's cv?).

True enough. I guess I'm just weighing up the options. We are quite settled and have been forging friendships for our son (only child) so I'm no longer feeling like I'd like us to move area for a great school, which I had asked we would when he was younger.

I'm fairly local to there, I send both DC to state schools but I wouldn't choose/ settle for any of those options if I could afford private. Colfes is a nice option if you don't want hot house pressure or too many super wealthy kids. It's fairly 'normal' middle class as far as I know. Buildings are a bit like a state school but nice playing field and good teaching

Graveney has a good reputation and the ex-students I know have done well and were very happy. I also know someone who taught there recently who thought it was a good school - they only left for promotion.

I think you should look at Colfe’s. It was a state grammar until a change in government policy in the 1970s. Lots of parents share your views and many are first time users of independent schools, but they know their children will be happy and have a well rounded education. It is not a hot house. Many parents make big sacrifices to pay the fees and there are scholarships available for those on low incomes, including some 100% bursaries in the sixth form. It does not attract the type of parents who are seeking social advantage through their child’s school (recent Mumsnet post on where A listers sent their children!).

A Level point score - Colfe’s 46.05, Thomas Tallis 33.33, John Roan 33.8, no A Level results yet for LAB as it only opened in 2018, (it achieved Ofsted Outstanding at is first inspection which is impressive, but only 22% of boys achieved EBacc at grade 5 plus - GCSEs in English, maths, sciences, geography or history and a MFL, so I would look at this in more detail given you have a son).

Tallis is in a state of total anarchy. It is the worst school I have ever seen. Ironically it has some fantastic teachers, but they don't really get a chance to teach.

Fights with throwing acid and DT tools at each other, spending lessons running up and down the fire escapes dodging teachers, preverbal children with SEN sitting in classrooms all day every day banging sticks on the table, students bringing games controllers in, setting up their phones as screens on the back table, putting their feet up and playing video games throughout the lesson, illiterate children not given any support in learning to read, instead, everything is read to them. Repeated arson attempts. Children asleep on the floor of the classrooms in lesson time, teacher spending the whole lesson locked in the disabled loo, refusing to come out. Blatant racism. The head didn't seem to notice any of this, and just sat in her office working on her other job, which was newspaper columns of some description. Exam results are poor, but even those are not reliable, cheating is rife and not challenged.

I was there 3 months before resigning. I was injured by flying furniture twice.

John Roan, I have not experienced it personally, but I knew it was in a state of civil war a few years back - locally I hear it is as bad, or worse that Tallis

O yeah, another special memory from Tallis -a child who physically assaulted their tutor being awarded tutee of the month, or something similar, I forget exactly what it was called.

Crikey, Tallis sounds… interesting.

I went from state school to Oxbridge, like your husband. The weird thing is all the poshos I met can get along with anyone. I don’t know how they manage it. Perhaps they have lessons.

This was our experience too, which is why my children left quite promptly.

It’s much better now under new leadership. This is the one I’d pick if I had to.

If u don't mind single sex and willing to look slightly further out, Trinity School has a school culture that emphasises social diversity (more than 50pc on some form of bursary or scholarship) and hard work. Buildings are not Hogwarts, but it has several rugby, hockey and other pitches. Music department is outstanding.

Trinity from SE3 is not straightforward?

Colfes is OK - lot of scholarships and bursaries and more down to earth than many independents - but not cheap if you're on full fees?

I should clarify we definitely want mixed and not Catholic. Preferably not too religious at all.

I will take a look at Colfes. I am interested in whether John Roan will vastly improve.

If you have an early primary then John roan should be in good shape by yr 7. It’s definitely on the up for sixth form : great results now (for the cohort and area). My kids are at school with kids who were pulled out of Tallis which tells me all I need to know.

Colfes would be great if you can afford it but nb whatever fees you see on the website will rise approx 5% per annum plus VAT added when Labour get in.

Where do your current primary school leavers go?

I gather a lot of the Kent grammars, plus the girls to Blackheath High etc

I'm just weighing up whether we decide to move for a school now whilst son is still young or commit to staying in the area where we've started a small tentative network and accept it might mean school fees 😱

Picking up on your earlier comment : grammar school entry not more stressful than independent school entry (the latter require an interview as well). Grammar school is tricky in se3 as we’re so far away the test results need to be really good; not enough to just pass and be deemed selective.

@Wishlist99 that may be true for the Kent grammars (which require higher scores if you're out of catchment) but for Bexley it just depends how many kids apply. Olaves also prioritise on score.

You don't have to be in the Top 180 (which means you get on regardless of distance) to get a Bexley place in SE3 - lots go to Chis & Sid / Townley / Beths from round near us.

Aside from the grammar issue I'm not keen on his bussing out every morning dvd would rather he's somewhere he can walk to and have a local network of friends... not sure if that's realistic.

Just wondering why Grey Coat was mentioned to me as a possibility (until they remembered I have a boy). If that's an option are there other excellent state schools in London which accept children from further afield? Mixed ones?

Sorry I'm just trying to learn about all this as FTM to a primary aged child.

Leigh Academy has a teeny catchment, so be careful putting too many eggs in that basket unless you are right on the doorstep. You’d need to be on the Royal Standard side of SE3 as catchment doesn’t reach to the village.

I don’t have a child there but went to the open evening last year and it was indeed civilised but it did not make me feel good. It was the only school I visited where nothing gave me the impression that school staff are actually proud of their students. I’m sure someone there is, but it just didn’t feel that way. I asked a few questions about student success in different areas and never got a student-centred answer, just a repeat of their Ofsted grading. (Meanwhile for all that’s been said about Tallis, they were really proud of student success - though they might be wishing they had more of those kinds of students and fewer of those involved in the incidents above.)

Interesting to see praise here for Roan. There’s been a lot of talk at our primary that one of the big ways they settled things at Roam was to limit student movement, so very little in the way of getting out of one’s chair basically, aside from PE. Can anyone speak to whether that is rumour or truth? It has been a concern at our primary as it’s really a very up and active school and it would be just another thing on the long list of adjustments kids have to make from primary to secondary.

If you are looking at Colfe’s, might as well look at St Dunstan’s too perhaps? The 54 bus goes there from SE3. They have put their fees up a fair bit this year though so I would plan ahead in case this would happen multiple times in secondary. A friend there now is concerned she may get priced out halfway through GCSEs, and no one wants that stress. But I’m sure that could happen at any independent between CoL and the VAT possibility, so it might be a widespread concern and it’s just the one friend in my circle saying it aloud.