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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

Original poster

School Appeals Services

27 replies

Kattherine · 29/04/2024 23:58

Hello,
does anyone have a good experience with school appeals services?
We were removed from our home, as a result of long term domestic abuse, and have been in temporary accommodation for over a year now. They use the hostel address as a home address obviously. I want my son to go to a school in the area we used to live. My daughter goes to a primary there and I work in there, we have all the support (friends) in the area… It is the only stability he has so I want him to stay within the community. I don’t know what my chances are but for his emotional wellbeing, after everything he has been through, I will do what I can not to make the situation even worse for him.
i was ready to use my credit card and pay £1250 that the appeals services charge. However, after reading some of the posts here I am not sure now whether that is worth it. Any insights will he greatly appreciated 🙏 Thank you

OP posts:
TeenDivided · 30/04/2024 07:32

I think you should save your money and ask the kind admissions experts on here if they can advise you instead. That money could be used as a deposit on rental accommodation for example.

To get you started, as well as the emotional stability, what else about the school might be particularly beneficial? e.g. Extra curricular options?

What is the chance of you getting permanent residence back in your old area? How far away is it? (Thinking if you can say this is only temporary it might help maybe?)

Are you sure it wouldn't be better to make friends in new area? How 'safe' will your DC be wandering around in old area (if your ex still lives there?)

blooskae · 30/04/2024 08:00

The appeals service you talk about will not be able to give you better advice than you can get here. Save your money.

Is there just one school in the area you used to live or more than one?

DillyDallyingAllDay · 30/04/2024 08:07

I'd suggest you save your money. It is very likely that the appeal board will look at your son's situation favourably.
Emotional wellbeing is taken seriously but you will also need other reasons as to why that specific school would be good for him. Maybe there's extra curricular activities that he's keen on, does his existing social circle go to the same school- have you potentially got any professionals who could write in support of keeping him in a environment he knows etc.

blooskae · 30/04/2024 08:12

"have you potentially got any professionals who could write in support of keeping him in a environment he knows etc."

This is crucial.

"Maybe there's extra curricular activities that he's keen on"

Don't rely on this as a substantive point - it is weak, so should only be a supporting argument.

blooskae · 30/04/2024 08:18

How far is the temporary hostel from your home area? Is the partner you were removed from the father of your children? What is his relationship with them? (Sorry for all the questions but it's all relevant).

TizerorFizz · 30/04/2024 08:35

@Kattherine Is there sibling priority in the admissions policy? There should also be exceptional social need in the policy too. This should be pretty high up. So you need to make the case for the second one. I’ve no experience of this but others might.

I have forgotten the names of posters - I’ll have a look.

Original poster
Kattherine · 30/04/2024 08:41

TeenDivided · 30/04/2024 07:32

I think you should save your money and ask the kind admissions experts on here if they can advise you instead. That money could be used as a deposit on rental accommodation for example.

To get you started, as well as the emotional stability, what else about the school might be particularly beneficial? e.g. Extra curricular options?

What is the chance of you getting permanent residence back in your old area? How far away is it? (Thinking if you can say this is only temporary it might help maybe?)

Are you sure it wouldn't be better to make friends in new area? How 'safe' will your DC be wandering around in old area (if your ex still lives there?)

Thank you so much for your reply. I would support him in making new friends in a nee area 100 %. But that’s the thing that we don’t really live there, just staying in a hostel sort of. I have no idea where we will be in September but should be within the borough as I work in a local school.

We are currently 4 miles away from where we used to live.

i will put down the reasons why this school in particular. It is a better school than the one he was offered.

Thank you.

OP posts:
Original poster
Kattherine · 30/04/2024 08:46

blooskae · 30/04/2024 08:00

The appeals service you talk about will not be able to give you better advice than you can get here. Save your money.

Is there just one school in the area you used to live or more than one?

Thank you. There are more. I appealed to two that were on our application - first two choices. But I stated in the comments (when accepting the school he was offered) that we would be happy to accept other schools as well (we are actually in catchment area for two of them).

OP posts:
Original poster
Kattherine · 30/04/2024 08:50

DillyDallyingAllDay · 30/04/2024 08:07

I'd suggest you save your money. It is very likely that the appeal board will look at your son's situation favourably.
Emotional wellbeing is taken seriously but you will also need other reasons as to why that specific school would be good for him. Maybe there's extra curricular activities that he's keen on, does his existing social circle go to the same school- have you potentially got any professionals who could write in support of keeping him in a environment he knows etc.

Thank you! Yes, I have a supporting letter from his current school. I also have one from the domestic abuse agency (however the lady didn’t seem to understand my case and the letter says I want him to be placed near our temporary accommodation… however, it is a proof of the abuse at least and hopefully I will be able to explain this).

OP posts:
blooskae · 30/04/2024 08:51

"But I stated in the comments (when accepting the school he was offered) that we would be happy to accept other schools as well (we are actually in catchment area for two of them)."

You need to contact your admissions department and ask to be put on the waiting list for the other schools. It's possible they mat not even be oversubscribed (in which case they should give you a place).

Original poster
Kattherine · 30/04/2024 08:53

blooskae · 30/04/2024 08:18

How far is the temporary hostel from your home area? Is the partner you were removed from the father of your children? What is his relationship with them? (Sorry for all the questions but it's all relevant).

It is over 4 miles away. Yes, he is their father and there are currently no legal arrangements (in process). He wasn’t allowed contact for some time but now he is and he usually has them twice a month or so. It’s very unpredictable, sometimes he wants them every week then no contact for a month…

OP posts:
Original poster
Kattherine · 30/04/2024 08:54

blooskae · 30/04/2024 08:51

"But I stated in the comments (when accepting the school he was offered) that we would be happy to accept other schools as well (we are actually in catchment area for two of them)."

You need to contact your admissions department and ask to be put on the waiting list for the other schools. It's possible they mat not even be oversubscribed (in which case they should give you a place).

So I should contact those school directly?

OP posts:
TeenDivided · 30/04/2024 08:55

You need to be able to expand on 'better' school.
It needs to be specific for your DC.

You can't use better Ofsted or GCSE results.

You could use for example
. a specific nurture scheme for vulnerable children
. your DC plays the xylophone and school runs a percussion group
. your DC has been doing German out of school as you have German relatives and school offers German (whereas allocated school doesn't)
. therapist for your DC has written a letter saying in their opinion DC needs to be in school with pre existing friends and this was catchment for your old location

drspouse · 30/04/2024 08:58

Is he entering primary or moving to secondary (or some other phase transfer)?

TizerorFizz · 30/04/2024 08:59

@PanelChair
Any advice?

blooskae · 30/04/2024 09:01

"So I should contact those school directly?"

Usually it is the local authority admissions department that you need to contact, but sometimes the schools. If not sure, contact both. (It's unlikely that anyone read the comments on your acceptance of a place, so you need to be pro-active).

Are both areas under the same local authority, or different local authorities?

PanelChair · 30/04/2024 09:21

I have withdrawn from appeals threads, because I feel I’ve said everything I can say on many, many threads over many, many years.

In this instance, I would say that I don’t know the company in question, but that is a very hefty fee. I doubt it will increase the chances of winning the appeal.

Some of the advice here is wide of the mark. It is not “very likely” that the appeal panel will look “favourably” at OP’s son’s situation. I’m sure the panel will be concerned about OP’s family’s experience, but they are obliged to consider whether the prejudice (detriment) to the child if they don’t get a place outweighs the prejudice to the school and the pupils already in it if they have to admit an additional pupil. Much therefore depends on the strength of the school’s case for not admitting.

As others have said, OP needs to assemble all the evidence she can for why this school is particularly suitable for her child and how he will be disadvantaged if he doesn’t get a place. That could relate to well-being, pastoral care, curriculum or anything else.

The letter from the domestic abuse agency doesn’t sound helpful; the panel will be looking for evidence from professionals or agencies which says that in their professional opinion the child needs a place in the appeal school and will be disadvantaged if they’re not admitted.

Original poster
Kattherine · 30/04/2024 11:46

TizerorFizz · 30/04/2024 08:35

@Kattherine Is there sibling priority in the admissions policy? There should also be exceptional social need in the policy too. This should be pretty high up. So you need to make the case for the second one. I’ve no experience of this but others might.

I have forgotten the names of posters - I’ll have a look.

Thank you. Exceptional social need is what I need to focus on. I will try to get some more evidence. Thank you.

OP posts:
Original poster
Kattherine · 30/04/2024 11:50

blooskae · 30/04/2024 09:01

"So I should contact those school directly?"

Usually it is the local authority admissions department that you need to contact, but sometimes the schools. If not sure, contact both. (It's unlikely that anyone read the comments on your acceptance of a place, so you need to be pro-active).

Are both areas under the same local authority, or different local authorities?

”It’s unlikely that anyone read the comments”! Thank you so much for this. And I’m here waiting if someone offers him a place at one of those schools. I will contact them 👍 Thank you.
One of the ones I appeal is different local authority. All the other ones are the same la we are under.

OP posts:
Original poster
Kattherine · 30/04/2024 11:51

PanelChair · 30/04/2024 09:21

I have withdrawn from appeals threads, because I feel I’ve said everything I can say on many, many threads over many, many years.

In this instance, I would say that I don’t know the company in question, but that is a very hefty fee. I doubt it will increase the chances of winning the appeal.

Some of the advice here is wide of the mark. It is not “very likely” that the appeal panel will look “favourably” at OP’s son’s situation. I’m sure the panel will be concerned about OP’s family’s experience, but they are obliged to consider whether the prejudice (detriment) to the child if they don’t get a place outweighs the prejudice to the school and the pupils already in it if they have to admit an additional pupil. Much therefore depends on the strength of the school’s case for not admitting.

As others have said, OP needs to assemble all the evidence she can for why this school is particularly suitable for her child and how he will be disadvantaged if he doesn’t get a place. That could relate to well-being, pastoral care, curriculum or anything else.

The letter from the domestic abuse agency doesn’t sound helpful; the panel will be looking for evidence from professionals or agencies which says that in their professional opinion the child needs a place in the appeal school and will be disadvantaged if they’re not admitted.

Thank you very much for all the information!

OP posts:
blooskae · 30/04/2024 12:07

Kattherine · 30/04/2024 11:46

Thank you. Exceptional social need is what I need to focus on. I will try to get some more evidence. Thank you.

Show quote history

As a school governor I chair our school's exceptional need panel, and I'm also the school's presenting officer for appeals. Make sure you check the admissions policies of each school to see if they have an exceptional need clause, and read any conditions carefully.

The bar for exceptional social need is generally higher than for appeal, not least because the school's exceptional need panel only have your documents in front of them, and can't ask you questions.

Check the clause wording carefully - every word is important. Ours is very stringent, but the wording of yours may be less so.

Original poster
Kattherine · 30/04/2024 12:12

blooskae · 30/04/2024 12:07

As a school governor I chair our school's exceptional need panel, and I'm also the school's presenting officer for appeals. Make sure you check the admissions policies of each school to see if they have an exceptional need clause, and read any conditions carefully.

The bar for exceptional social need is generally higher than for appeal, not least because the school's exceptional need panel only have your documents in front of them, and can't ask you questions.

Check the clause wording carefully - every word is important. Ours is very stringent, but the wording of yours may be less so.

Show quote history

Thank you so much. I will have a look into that.

OP posts:
TizerorFizz · 30/04/2024 12:42

Is exceptional social need grounds for appeal if it’s not been documented earlier?

prh47bridge · 30/04/2024 13:09

TizerorFizz · 30/04/2024 12:42

Is exceptional social need grounds for appeal if it’s not been documented earlier?

Yes.

A failure to document it earlier means the appellant can't argue that the decision to refuse entry was unreasonable, but they can still argue that their child's social needs mean they will be disadvantaged if not admitted.

thesandwich · 30/04/2024 13:15

Op you have had brilliant priceless advice on this thread from some real experts- @PanelChair @prh47bridge and @blooskae plus@TizerorFizz
please take it on board and save your money.

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