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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

Secondary School Appeals 2024

18 replies

Str3ss3dMum · 23/03/2024 08:47

I’ve sat and read through lots of posts and am feeling a bit hopeless so any advice would be great. We put 6 schools down, hoping to avoid the ‘terrible’ one nearby, but got it anyway. As much as I have my favourite, as does my daughter, I just want anything but the one we have been given which has an awful reputation for bullying, has constant supply teachers, parents pull their children out all the time, pupils don’t do well academically and just seems like the school that’s been forgotten. I’m going to appeal to out 1st choice school which is much more suited to her wants and interests (no1 choice specialisms are sports and performing arts, she’s danced since she was 4, been learning an instrument for 2 years, plays on school netball team). She’s done so well at primary school and is expected to get excellent SATs results, I’m just so worried it’s all been for nothing if she ends up at the school she’s been given.

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Str3ss3dMum · 23/03/2024 08:48

Oh I should also have said, daughters dad lives right next to the no1 choice and she spends about half her time there and will go there after school most nights as he works from home and I’m further away for work.

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prh47bridge · 23/03/2024 09:23

The fact that dad lives right next to your first choice is irrelevant for appeal. If you can legitimately use his address under the council's rules you should switch to it as it will move her up the waiting list.

Your points about your daughter's wants and interests are good. They are the kind of thing the appeal panel want to hear.

Remember that you are appealing for the school you want, not against the school you've got. Don't tell the panel how awful the allocated school is. Concentrate on showing the ways in which your daughter will miss out if she has to go there rather than to the school you want.

trubbleatmill · 23/03/2024 09:32

"pupils don’t do well academically and just seems like the school that’s been forgotten"

It hasn't been forgotten - it's just what happens in high population areas as a natural consequence of the preference system, social media and information sharing. If you are within easy travelling distance of 6 different schools, so are many other people. What your offered school needs is for a critical mass of local parents to get behind it and help it to improve its reputation. Unfortunately, it's more difficult than it used to be to do that (and it was never easy) due to the national school funding crisis.

What is the offered school's Ofsted rating and when was it last inspected? I'm curious because many schools in the same position were stymied by the previous Ofsted inspection framework which pegged the grading to results. The newer framework (used since Sept 2019) decouples the grading from results and looks at other 'Quality of Education' factors. It means that some so-called 'sink' schools that were actually very well led and managed were able to be re-graded as Good. But unfortunately it can take more than that to turn around local parent opinion, especially if the school had been RI for a long time. There is one near me that is very well led, and is starting to fill up some of its empty places, but it will take a few years for its social-media reputation to catch up with its reality, especially now that they can no longer afford to buy in marketing expertise.

Str3ss3dMum · 23/03/2024 09:40

trubbleatmill · 23/03/2024 09:32

"pupils don’t do well academically and just seems like the school that’s been forgotten"

It hasn't been forgotten - it's just what happens in high population areas as a natural consequence of the preference system, social media and information sharing. If you are within easy travelling distance of 6 different schools, so are many other people. What your offered school needs is for a critical mass of local parents to get behind it and help it to improve its reputation. Unfortunately, it's more difficult than it used to be to do that (and it was never easy) due to the national school funding crisis.

What is the offered school's Ofsted rating and when was it last inspected? I'm curious because many schools in the same position were stymied by the previous Ofsted inspection framework which pegged the grading to results. The newer framework (used since Sept 2019) decouples the grading from results and looks at other 'Quality of Education' factors. It means that some so-called 'sink' schools that were actually very well led and managed were able to be re-graded as Good. But unfortunately it can take more than that to turn around local parent opinion, especially if the school had been RI for a long time. There is one near me that is very well led, and is starting to fill up some of its empty places, but it will take a few years for its social-media reputation to catch up with its reality, especially now that they can no longer afford to buy in marketing expertise.

Edited

The ofsted rating is needs improvement which has been the case for many years apart form a short spell as good before the inspection late last year put it back to needs improvement.

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trubbleatmill · 23/03/2024 09:47

"specialisms are sports and performing arts"

It's unusual for schools to have formal specialisms these days because the DfE no longer funds them. Some schools still say they have specialisms but it's just a way of saying "this is something we think is important and want to do well at". It implies they will prioritise it in budget decisions, e.g. for staff recruitment, and may mean that it attracts families with children who have those interests. However, most schools do have sport and performing arts, so the fact that one school does it better than another isn't ever going to be a strong appeal argument, especially as your daughter clearly has opportunities to pursue those interests outside of school.

Str3ss3dMum · 23/03/2024 09:51

trubbleatmill · 23/03/2024 09:47

"specialisms are sports and performing arts"

It's unusual for schools to have formal specialisms these days because the DfE no longer funds them. Some schools still say they have specialisms but it's just a way of saying "this is something we think is important and want to do well at". It implies they will prioritise it in budget decisions, e.g. for staff recruitment, and may mean that it attracts families with children who have those interests. However, most schools do have sport and performing arts, so the fact that one school does it better than another isn't ever going to be a strong appeal argument, especially as your daughter clearly has opportunities to pursue those interests outside of school.

Edited

These are the reason which you can get into the school on aptitude testing, just for clarity on what I meant by that. They also have fantastic facilities in these areas that the school we have been given doesn’t.

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trubbleatmill · 23/03/2024 09:52

Str3ss3dMum · 23/03/2024 09:51

These are the reason which you can get into the school on aptitude testing, just for clarity on what I meant by that. They also have fantastic facilities in these areas that the school we have been given doesn’t.

Ah, ok, so did your daughter have an aptitude test? How did it go?

Str3ss3dMum · 23/03/2024 09:57

trubbleatmill · 23/03/2024 09:52

Ah, ok, so did your daughter have an aptitude test? How did it go?

She did yes, although she didn’t get in based on that.

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Str3ss3dMum · 23/03/2024 10:17

prh47bridge · 23/03/2024 09:23

The fact that dad lives right next to your first choice is irrelevant for appeal. If you can legitimately use his address under the council's rules you should switch to it as it will move her up the waiting list.

Your points about your daughter's wants and interests are good. They are the kind of thing the appeal panel want to hear.

Remember that you are appealing for the school you want, not against the school you've got. Don't tell the panel how awful the allocated school is. Concentrate on showing the ways in which your daughter will miss out if she has to go there rather than to the school you want.

I think I could only really legitimately use his address if she physically went to live there, unfortunately.

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eish · 23/03/2024 10:22

Is it a grammar if there is an aptitude test?

Str3ss3dMum · 23/03/2024 10:24

eish · 23/03/2024 10:22

Is it a grammar if there is an aptitude test?

It’s not a grammar school, no.

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prh47bridge · 23/03/2024 10:55

Str3ss3dMum · 23/03/2024 10:17

I think I could only really legitimately use his address if she physically went to live there, unfortunately.

Do check the rules for your LA. Some would allow you to use his address if she spends half her time there or she spends the majority of school nights there. Some allow separated parents to choose which address to use regardless of where the child spends most of their time.

trubbleatmill · 23/03/2024 10:55

eish · 23/03/2024 10:22

Is it a grammar if there is an aptitude test?

Eish, the national admissions code allows schools to select on aptitude (but not ability) to certain activities like music and sport. They don't have to be grammar schools - grammar schools select on academic ability/attainment (not aptitude).

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/school-admissions-code2

MarchingFrogs · 23/03/2024 14:48

Actually, partially selective schools can select up to the given percentage of pupils by either aptitude or ability, they just have to be careful to employ tests which select for the relevant one.

Something which some schools sail perilously close to the wind on (Officially selecting on sporting aptitude, but allowing the HOD to put parents off from getting their DC to try to demonstrate their aptitude by telling them that unless they were already playing sports competitively at a high level - thus demonstrating ability - there was no point, in the case of one I can think of), but I digress.

trubbleatmill · 23/03/2024 15:13

I suppose there could be an appeal angle if the aptitude test wasn't conducted in line with the admissions code. I don't know much about aptitude tests though.

trubbleatmill · 24/03/2024 11:17

@Str3ss3dMum one section of the admissions code that may be relevant is 1.9i. If the school with the aptitude test gathered any information about extra-curricular activities/experience on its supplementary form or at any time before making their selection (e.g. by asking questions verbally at the aptitude test, whether a formal interview or not) then you might be able to argue that they breached the code. If they did, then it could have biased them towards other candidates.

Secondary School Appeals 2024
trubbleatmill · 24/03/2024 11:28

The school's policy should also be very clear about how its waiting list operates with regard to the aptitude places. If an aptitude offer is declined, how do they re-offer it? e.g. Do they maintain a parallel waiting list for aptitude places based on a scoring system?

Secondary School Appeals 2024
Str3ss3dMum · 24/03/2024 17:35

@trubbleatmill thank you for this information, that’s really interesting and I’ll take that into consideration.

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