Permanent exclusion help

[MumnMore]

My son in Year 10 was permanently excluded last week! It’s expected and unexpected. Expected because they threatened it soon after behaviour issues started and unexpected because the behaviours are not disruptive or extreme.
does anyone have experience of attending a PDC (governor’s meeting) to review the exclusion?
Do I have to provide my report/evidence to the school prior to the meeting? Would be grateful to hear any experience of this meeting please x

You need to say what he did, how often, and who to.
And was he already on report?
And is he the only one?

You need to go through schools behaviour policy to look up their process as every schools will be different. For example where I work a student must have met the threshold for 15 sessions with a fixed term exclusion in a half term in order to go to panel for a permanent exclusion. Check yourselves whether your son has met the threshold criteria for a permanent exclusion.

It takes either

a) a long time of unacceptable behaviour to the point that neither the child or classmates are getting their proper education, and the people who work with the child are unable to do the job they've been employed to do, with no marked improvements following intervention and strategies being put in place by a lot of people (school, parents, outside agencies as appropriate)

Or

b) something brief but so catastrophically unacceptable that other people are being placed at risk

For permanent exclusion.

So, go back over what meetings have already happened, what has been said, and what has been put in place in the past.

You will need to be prepared to advocate for your son and to focus on his needs which you will feel weren't met. Because if they had been, the situation wouldn't be what it is now.

You may find though that the best solution for all concerned is a change of school/PRU.

It is incredibly difficult to permanently exclude a child with many criteria to meet. I think you are in denial about just how bad his behaviour is. I would start by making sure there is suitable provision for him next.

What are the behaviour issues?

Yes agree with others, it’s not easy to permanently exclude a child and it is harder than it was.

When I was last teaching in a school, I can think of students who, when they were in lessons, were so disruptive that the lesson was barely able to proceed – yet in at least one case, it took the student bringing a knife into school for them to be perm excluded.

I am not saying your DS did that – but I am afraid I find it impossible to believe he is going to be permanently excluded for behaviour that is “not disruptive”. I feel that you are downplaying this, and while I understand of course that you need to fight his corner, he may be better in a different environment. It’s not ideal in year 10 for sure.

Can you say what he has done?

Generally speaking it's difficult to exclude someone so I'd imagine they have all their ducks in a row. It might in your best interest to get them to agree to a managed move instead jf that was a option . If you're adamant you wish to fight this, look for examples where the school has not followed its own policy in relation to their treatment of your son. That may give you some leeway but it's unlikely I'm afraid .

I think there must have been a heck of a lot of bad behaviour you don't know about.

Bear in mind that logging behaviour and dealing with sanctions takes time, so with the best will in the world, not all bad behaviour is logged.

A child can't be permanently excluded without there having been a behaviour incident/s (single serious or persistent breaches of the behaviour policy), that there continuing in school is incompatible with the safety or education of other students and it being a last resort for the school.

The government meeting should consist of the school showing how those tests were met and being challenged on whether they considered alternatives to pex etc. There is a further appeal stage called an IRP which is about ensuring the governors met their scrutiny standards if you want to go down that route.

In the first place the head should explain all of this to you and it should be set out in the exclusion letter.

*their

I am definitely not in denial.
he has been excluded 3 times. Once for fighting but was attacked first and had never been involved in any violence before this. Once for repeated truanting a lesson and for not attending detentions.

He has never shouted or swore at a teacher. He behaves well in class. His problem is lateness/truanting and defiance (refusing to put school shoes on, refusing to wear blazer etc). I work in a school and I’ve never see a permanent exclusion for this type of behaviour especially when it’s only been a few months.

If this is the case, it’s unfair to permanently exclude. How have they done all they can if I haven’t been made fully aware of behaviour issues?

why is he refusing to wear school shoes ?

Is it the same lesson he is truanting ?

is it a very disappointed school . I see more and more harsh punishments for what should be classroom issues.

My Ds is ND but definitely had issues with teachers which once he created an issue didn’t ever seem resolvable as it was stalemate . Teacher was very much this is how my classroom runs - but it didn’t work for my Ds - therefore everyone was disrupted.

Did you receive the appropriate paperwork for all 3 exclusions.

No. They cannot exclude for not attending detention etc.

Defiance / not following instructions is also unlikely, unless he has put others in danger due to his actions. This is entirely possible in practical lessons such as science or design.

Either you are minimising what he has done, or you are not aware of whatever the latest incident that has led to exclusion was.

Or you have a completely inaccurate view of his behaviour in lessons.

Either way, the school should be and should have communicated with you. Are you sure you have been hearing what they have been telling you?

I’ve given more information in response to someone else. My son is really bright and does not disrupt the class. That’s one thing they’ve praised him for is his behaviour in lesson (when he eventually gets there). I don’t think there is enough for this to stand up! Hence why I’m trying to fight it.
Thanks for your comments 😊

How do you know how he acts in class?
You have literally no idea.

100%

An important question to ask yourself before you start a fight is “do I really want to win this?”

In this case your son’s headteacher (who is undoubtedly a very busy person) is willing to go through a load of hassle and paperwork and unpleasantness (and maybe a financial penalty) in order to not have your son in their school.

Does that sound like a place that your son can thrive in?

The rights and wrongs of the exclusion is almost irrelevant. What matters is where is the best place for your son to be. I am not sure that this is it.

1. Why did he leave his last school, OP?

1. You might be right about this exclusion not surviving appeal, if there have been no interventions put in place besides the exclusions and detentions you mention. You have to weigh whether appealing would be the right choice.

1. Honestly, I have a little trouble believing you on 2 because you come across as minimising his behaviour. Those are huge behaviour incidents. Most students wouldn't have one of them in 5 years at high school.

If he's refused to attend any sanctions until the point of being excluded there is very little the school can do with him. In 20 years at tough schools I've rarely seen behaviour like that.

Students truanting - even a single lesson, while still in the school building - is a real hassle. It's a serious safeguarding concern and at least one member of staff will be looking for them until they are found.

What was he doing while he was truanting?
What were the detentions for?
What did you do when school informed you that a) he had detention and b) he didn't go?

Is he regularly truanting lessons on the school site? If so, this is actually pretty serious as the school does not know where he is, and every single time a member of staff is probably being dispatched to try and find him. Is he trying to evade staff etc? They may argue that if this behaviour continues, then they cannot keep him safe in school.

Is there a particular incident that has triggered this, or has he met a threshold in terms of internal truancy? I would ask the school in writing to clarify what exactly has triggered the exclusion.

I know there are some schools where internal truancy is a pretty major problem, but equally if he is the only one/one of only a handful of student/the worst offender, I can see why a school would want to exclude for this. Where does he go when he truants?

I do wonder if there has been a specific issue when truanting which has triggered this, and perhaps made the school feel that they cannot guarantee his safety on site, and so they want him out?

Has there been any support put in place to try and address the truancy? Is it a particular subject/day/time of day?

Hmmm. These three incidents of exclusion wouldn't come even close to meeting the threshold for permanent exclusion. For a permanent exclusion based on long term disruptive behaviour you would need significantly more evidence.

We have, for example, been unable to permanently exclude one student who has has three exclusions this year alone- in addition to weekly internal isolations. She also truants, on average, 4 out of 5 lessons a day, while disrupting the majority of the 1 lesson she does attend. Similarly, we would love to permanently exclude another student whose behaviour is so severe he has brought fake knives to school and put the entire school into a lockdown. But we can't. A child bringing drugs in a few weeks ago only got a week of exclusion.

Unless you're in a private school, OP, this just can't be all the information.

State schools can, and do, exclude for bringing drugs into school.

Oh yes! And those vapes that have THC in.