Daughter not happy with choice

[mumoftwogirls2017]

We got offered the 2nd choice. I know the 2nd school is closer to us so I think that’s why. But she was crying her eyes out she wanted to go to the other one.
im not sure whether to appeal or not. It looks like they require a lot of information.
Im going to let her think about it. She gone to school so once talking to her friends she may change her mind.
I personally had reasons why I didn’t want 2nd choice but at the end day I guess it’s for her.
it’s so hard being a parent! 😒

I only applied for 1 school (last year) as it was the only one I was happy with that DD had a chance of getting in to. She didn't get a place there and we were offered our local school (you don't always get one miles away!) I had no intention of her going there and I was advised not to accept that place while I went to appeal. Despite not applying for this school or accepting the offered place they phoned/rung/came round multiple times! They told me my DD would not get a place at the school I applied for. I went to appeal and won! It's worth a shot if you have a reasonable argument.

I am glad you won your appeal, but it is bad advice to suggest you decline the offered place. Already having a place somewhere else does not affect the appeal. In fact the it can sometimes negatively impact the appeal if you have declined the place offered, as it looks like you are trying to force them to give you a place.

You should always accept the offered school unless you would genuinely homeschool instead, or have a private offer. You can hope it is not needed, and you will get a preferred place through appeal or waiting lists, but not everyone will and will need to fall back on the original offer.

I didn't say decline the place but I was advised not to accept the place as has been suggested on here.

It depends where she is on the waiting list as to if she's likely to get a place before September. The places are still allocated based on the admissions criteria so if someone else goes on the list who is higher up the criteria you move down the list. If the school already has more than the planned admission number in the school (which it might have if appeals are won) it will have to drop below that for anyone on the waiting list to be admitted. Therefore she could have to wait a very long time to get a place or not get one atall. In those circumstances it is worth going to appeal.

There's no actual difference? And it's spectacularly bad advice.

How is it spectacularly bad advice? It definitely contributed to me winning the appeal. And no one has won an appeal there for at least 10 years. The other school was still there if I wanted it.

It definitely contributed to me winning the appeal
No, it definitely didn't.

It won’t have contributed to you winning the appeal. Not having another school place doesn’t improve your chances at appeal. It’s bad advice because all it does is stop the person who is appealing from having a back up school to go to if their appeal doesn’t succeed.

yes it was. Your post starts with “I’m sure they don’t”.

@Tiredalwaystired - The words "I'm sure they don't" in @EduCated's post were clearly referring to your comment, "I’m also sure the person with a desk full of appeals doesn’t feel like one less appeal would make much difference", not the strength of OP's case.

As others have said, it definitely did not contribute to you winning your appeal. If anything, it may have weakened your case. It can look to the panel like you are trying to bully them by rejecting every school other than the one you want. That never goes down well. Even if they accept that you aren't trying to bully them, rejecting the offered school does not strengthen your case.

Not what they told me.

It did as it backed up a point I made. I was told it did contribute to me winning. I've not said to decline the offer and not have a back up school. I've clearly said I still had that school offer if I wanted it.

I haven't said anything about rejecting the offer. As I said the offer was there if I wanted it. The panel certainly didn't think I was bullying them!! How would that even work? You don't win an appeal because you don't have another school for your DC to go to. You have to home educate.

All I'm saying is in my case not accepting the place backed up my argument and the panel saw it as that. I asked for feedback as to why I won so I know. The offer was still there if I wanted it so I lost nothing.

I also won because of why the offered school was unsuitable. Again, something people get told on here doesn't happen. But the panel asked me specifically why the offered school was unsuitable.

@TotoroElla well done on successfully making the OPs post all about you

OP I hope your DD has come to terms with school 2, or you are on the wait list for school 1

@TotoroElla not rejecting is the same as accepting. So you followed the advice.

@mumoftwogirls2017 good luck with your appeal and waiting lists.

I didn't mean to make it about me. People are misunderstanding what I wrote and saying I'm wrong. I'm just trying to give advice to the OP that contributed to me winning my appeal. It might be different advice than others give but that is because it appears some panels do things differently. If I'd followed advice on here I'd not have had an argument as why the offered school wasn't suitable but I'm advising OP to make sure to have that argument prepared as they actually might get asked about it.

So why is everyone up in arms about me not accepting the place then?! 😂 However, according to the school who hounded me to accept the place it is not the same thing. The panel saw it as backing up my argument too but as I said the school offer was always there if I wanted it so win:win.

You either accept or reject your offer. By telling the OP not to accept their offer you are telling them to reject it. I think your confusion may be because in some LAs you don’t have to do anything when made an offer, and acceptance is automatically assumed. Was this the case for you? As you are saying that you still had your back up place then it sounds like you had accepted your offer. Are you thinking that “acceptance” is something else that means you come off waiting lists and give up your appeals or something? Accepting your offer just means that you have a back up school to go to if your appeal doesn’t succeed, and does NOT affect your position on waiting lists or chance of success in appeals.

No YOU are clearly misunderstanding how appeals and school acceptance work, and are therefore giving the OP and others who are seeking advice on appeals wrong and dangerous advice that could lead to them having no school at all.

Disagree with @PuttingDownRoots. Not accepting a place usually means the offer will be taken away, so it is the same as rejecting it. In England, it is highly unlikely that an offer will still be open when you get to appeal unless the school offered is undersubscribed.

If you are right that the panel saw it as backing up your argument, they were in serious need of retraining. If panels universally saw it this way, everyone could strengthen their appeal by not accepting the offered place, which would lead to chaos.

@TotoroElla what isn't clear on these threads is that some posters are actually the qualified legal bods who represent the applicant appealing or sit on the panel for the school, they do this year in year out in real life. They are therefore the experts in these matters. I recognise the names as this comes up year after year and have personally thanked @prh47bridge who gave me some advice years ago. So thank you again.

The advice is always to accept the school place you have been offered even if you never intend to place your child in that school. If anyone rejects a place then the LA has no responsibility to find you a school place because they found you one; they fulfilled their duty. They can therefore wash their hands of you. If you lose an appeal you have no school place for your child and then you need to find one. Schools local to you may all be full and potentially your child may end up only finding a school with places absolutely miles away. That is why you always accept the school place offered. There are waiting lists and appeals that go on from now so some movement in school places.

@mumoftwogirls2017 if your DD is still unhappy go on the waiting list for the first choice and get an appeal ready. Lots of advice on MN on how to do it, mainly coming down to what the first choice school can offer your child which is beneficial to them.

I think it appears different LAs do things differently (evidenced by poster saying not rejecting us the same as accepting.) You have to accept an offer. But you have time to do so. No it doesn't affect appeals or waiting lists. You go automatically onto the waiting lists of any schools you weren't offered. I was advised not to accept the school I was offered and glad I did that. However, as I've clearly said that offer was still there and I could accept it further down the line. I'm obviously not suggesting OP doesn't check this out for herself. I'm just giving advice in good faith based on my real life experience (which can be different to the theory!)

For someone who chose a school a drive away I really regretted it. We had a decent enough school in walking distance and I really wished we'd gone for that! The daily school runs were such a pain!!

Was the offered school undersubscribed, so still had places spare and therefore if you (or anyone else) had asked you could have been given a place without question? That’s the only scenario I can think of where you would still ‘have’ your place having not accepted the offer (but even then if the school filled its places with others who wanted them then they couldn’t ‘hold’ a place for you).

Unless this was the case I just don’t understand how the scenario you describe could work in practice, as they can’t hold a place for you that you haven’t accepted if there are people on the waiting list.