St James’ Senior Girls (Olympia) vs St Catherine’s (Twickenham)

[ItsMeHi48]

Looking for some points of view please. My DD has offers from St James’ Senior Girls and St Catherine’s, as well as WL for FHSS (which would be our first choice). Trying to decide between the two she has offers for, in case WL doesn’t convert to an offer. Both easy for us travel wise. St C has better facilities, St J has marginally stronger academics and I think is more academically selective. St C slightly bigger than St J but still relatively small. There’s probably not much to choose between them but I’m interested to hear what others might do in our position and if any current parents of either schools have perspectives to share. My DD is bright and capable but more average academically right now, I think she needs a bit of time to mature and blossom. She’s sociable and confident, will want somewhere she can pursue interests in art, science, and also to get involved in sports. Also pondering whether London location vs more suburban is better and if there’s some benefit to the St J connection and opportunities with the boys school in Ashford also. I do have some concerns re the meditation and vegetarianism at St J and wonder how that feels for students day to day. Any thoughts gratefully received!

Not much insight here but watching with interest: I don’t know much about St Cat’s but my DD also has an offer from St James girls. I spoke to a parent with two girls (16 and 18) currently there and she was full of praise. Said the small size meant each girl was treated as an individual and the teachers really knew them. Also loved the pastoral care. Academic wise, her daughters were gently pushed: youngest into computing and maths was given extra extension work. School also worked to make sure all girls got to know each other: constantly changing seating plans etc to break up cliques etc.

Hi, my DD is in St James year 8 (started in year 7).

I don't have any knowledge of St Catherine’s though and cannot help with comparing the two.

Regarding St James, we are happy with the school. Quality of teaching is good overall and in certain areas - classical and modern languages, history, science, music, exceptional in my opinion.

It's a small school, only a two form year group, and that has its own advantages and disadvantages. Teachers know all the girls and we found that helps in pastoral support. Friendship issues or any other problems are spotted and handled quickly. It is hard for someone naturally shy or less confident to step back and hide in the crowd; everyone is encouraged to participate in everything. But small size also means certain things are harder - for example forming orchestra with all the girls at right level of skills for the right instruments etc take longer. Also, for such a small school, it seems to do surprisingly well in some sports, like lacrosse, netball and football.

London location works for us and the girls qucikly become comfortable navigating central London, meeting up etc. I like that DD can manage her route in tube etc, and now a days meet up with her friends without any help from us.

Regarding the boys' school, there isn't a lot of interaction. There are few joint events, when the girls go to Ashford for a joint summer concert, or the boys come to London for a church service. But travel time between the two schools make joint events hard. There is bit more interaction in sixth form I believe.

About meditation and vegetarian lunch - I was (am still) a fan and one of the reasons we chose this school over few more high profile ones are its ethos (we also wanted a small school). I believe the quiet time (~ 5 mins pause) between lessons is useful and the vegetarian menu is a good thing. But, DD and her friends are emphatic that quiet time has no benefit and is in fact annoying. Some girls also did not like the veg menu starting year 7, but I hear fewer complaints now a days.

Happy to answer more specific questions if you have any.

There is also a Good School Guide review here if you haven't already read it https://www.goodschoolsguide.co.uk/schools/100107/st-james-senior-girls-school/E690976#sch_tabs-2

Thank you so much for the insights @sjsgparent really helpful 🙏🏻much appreciated

My DD went to St Catherine's, but left around 6 years ago so I'm afraid my experience isn't current. I think it was good for her. She's naturally quite shy and quiet, but had opportunities to do things like solo singing - in my biased opinion she's a lovely singer but I don't think she would ever have sung publicly in a larger school. The teachers all knew her well and she got on well with them, particularly when it came to GCSEs and above. She did well academically; they did push her, but not to the extent that it became over-pressured, and she went on to get a place on the university course of her choice. In fact, I took some pleasure in noting that her results were better than most at a selective school that wouldn't offer her a place when she was 11, though that may well have been because she didn't put them first in her preference list. Perhaps most significantly, she made some great friends there with whom she has kept up subsequently and they are all mutually really supportive.

Thank you for sharing your experience @Flamme wonderful to hear and congrats to your DD

I am afraid I don’t know St James but my daughter is in Year 8 at St Cats. She is academically bright but mildly dyslexic and we have found the school to be very positive. Teachers know all the girls, and there is also a lovely sense of the older ones looking out for those in lower years. Excellent opportunities to be involved in sport, music and drama because of the small size. There is really focus on developing the whole person and academics as one part of that which is very much our ethos.

Oh and my daughter says the food is excellent! The school has a Facebook group so if you are active there you can see lots of content of day to day activities.

Good luck in making your decision!

Thank you so much @kairi1 - super helpful and great to hear your daughter is happy there

My daughter left St Catherine's last year and we were extremely disappointed with the school, and especially disliked the new headteacher. In particular, the pastoral support was very poor. It seemed that they were more concerned about the image of the school, rather than the well-being of the girls, leading to my daughter being very anxious about going to school. For example, giving detentions for the wrong denier of tights, while ignoring clear mental health problems that some girls had. A significant portion of the teachers are very poor, with my daughter and many of her friends achieving strong GCSE grades by using textbooks to teach herself rather than learning anything in the classroom. The learning support is poor with a separate room not being provided for girl's with additional learning needs during the GCSE's. When handing in UCAS forms, the teachers are very slow to process them, leading to a late hand in which shouldn't be expected due to the low numbers of pupils in the sixth form. This explains why the majority of people leave after GCSE's - unlike they claim on their website. I also noticed a the sheer amount of bullying that occurred without intervention from the teachers. Perhaps it was just the time my daughter was there, as on the mums group chat, it seemed the majority of the mums unfortunately had the same negative experience. Out of a year group of 60 only 15 stayed on for sixth form, which says a lot. I am sorry this is so negative, but after my daughter suffering through secondary school, it is the truth I wish someone had told me. Many parents sharing their experiences may have daughters in younger years of the school, so have so far had positive experiences, similarly to my daughter, but unfortunately when the girls get older, they seem unable to provide any support, despite this being the most important part due to the exams. Although I am sure every all girls secondary school has problems, it is still something to consider.

Review here - https://london.muddystilettos.co.uk/kids/school-reviews/st-catherines-school-senior-sixth-form-twickenham/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR036JPr8zpp7JcuSCJIoC3SwsyTp1GDjyFFeWbNnTyFUxnii1YtuFmHrQU_aem_ZmFrZWR1bW15MTZieXRlcw

Thanks. We didn’t end up choosing either in the end as the WL place for FHSS converted to a firm offer so she’s off there in September and feeling excited about it all. I’m very glad to have the 11+ behind us!!

Anyone who would like feedback on St James Senior Girls School, please feel free to DM me. My DD was there for one term and unfortunately the school didn’t live up to the expectations you would expect from an independent school, and just a heads up they follow the national curriculum as of state school too.

Hey may I ask where you ended up choosing? We’re considering st Catherine’s and would love to here some feedback on it x

Hey can I ask where the majority of girls that go to the school come from, are they loc? Also it starts in year threee so wondering what schools they’re coming from xx

@HanGN , re where they are coming from, the St Catherine's girls are coming from local primary schools, the state primary school provision is so good and not full in the area that the school could not sustain a pre-prep school and chose to close it.
By joining from year 3 onwards parents can avoid the 11 plus.

Re where older girls come from, a mixture of local and areas along the train line to Strawberry Hill station ie north Sheen, Barnes or Shepperton etc plus access to Twickenham trains and bus

Thank you so much for your quick response. We’re trying to avoid the stress of the 11+ but worrying how it will be for when our daughter gets moved at year 3 from the state school. Is it very competitive to get in to for those joining in year 7?

have you found it a very religious school? How have you found it in general? Would love to hear any thoughts you have at all 😊

@HanGN , I'm not a parent but familiar with Twickenham schools. She will be fine coming from a state school because so is everyone else. They closed the pre prep because they couldn't fill the classes as there wasn't enough demand for all girls private pre prep. It's not competitive at 11 plus and sorry I can't comment on the religious element. The primary schools in Twickenham are very good, you won't find much difference between the primary schools and the prep schools apart from the 11plus preparation that you get in the prep schools.

Appreciate your response thank you. I’m struggling to find a school. I have a girl and a boy, 2 and 4, and would like them to go to a small nurturing school where it’s not a hot house and they can stay on throughout all the stages. Any ideas where can offer this? If not, I think at Catherine’s works for my daughter but no idea about smaller boys schools that flow through and aren’t hothouses x

Yes
Newland House or Twickenham Prep and then Radnor House when it starts at Year 5.

Not small but all through
Hampton court house
Ibstock Place
Harrodian - Barnes
Claremont Fan Court - Esher
Ewell Castle - Ewell
Downsend - further out in Surrey

Have you checked out the local primary schools too?

Radnor House now starts at Yrs 1/2 (it’s a very small combined class currently) and then individual year groups from Yr3 upwards. The prep is currently based in Richmond. Pupils then transfer to the senior school (currently opposite St Catherine’s) in Yr7. The prep and senior school are both co-ed.

Yes I had completely forgotten about Radnor Prep currently based in Richmond, OP it would work for you on the basis it is small.

Thanks have you heard good things about Radnor? Is it very competitive to join if you join at 11+?

have you heard anything about Orleans high school?

My DD is at Radnor Senior school and we are extremely happy with it. My DS will be joining in September. Level of competitiveness is driven by how many Yr7 places are filled by Dukes schools (this year it was a lot to harder to get in externally). I hear great things about Orleans as I know a lot of kids there but it has a very small catchment area and VAT seems to have impacted the catchment area on national offer day this year (ie smaller than last year). You have to live in the centre of Twick to be guaranteed a place.

@HanGN , Radnor is moving to a large site in Whitton when they are granted planning permission and the pre and prep school will move to the site in Twickenham from Richmond. This will have all happened by the time your dc are 11 so who knows what the admissions will be like.
Orleans Primary and Orleans Park are desirable schools where you need to live near by.
Education / schools are changing all the time, the impact of VAT on schools fees still has to feed through to admissions to state and private schools in Twickenham although the prep sector as a whole has been hit hard by the falling birth rate. New schools open for example Thomas's College in Richmond in September and single sex preps go co-ed like The Mall and Kings House.
You might do better to focus on a state primary school for your dd that is near your home address and not worry about schools when she is 11.

What about Hampton Court House school I just found this and have never heard of it before which is crazy!

Ibstock Place doesn't deal with racism, from our experience