Newstead vs JAGs

[teaandyarn]

My daughter has just been offered a place at JAGS and is awaiting the outcome of a Newstead place but it looks hopeful according to past results. There is a chance she could go onto the waiting list.

We can afford JAGS (household income currently £200k plus) but it will mean some sacrifices. Older son is in super selective grammar but we feel he didn’t get as much of a push as he would have in an independent school. Younger son is a good candidate for the same grammar school (bright and more motivated).

We were very disappointed by the run down Newstead facilities although girls I know seem to be happy and thriving there. Is it worth sending DD to JAGS for this reason? There also seemed to be fewer girls from minority backgrounds at JAGS, is it an inclusive environment which is tolerant of people’s religious practices?

Any advice would be appreciated.

I can't comment on Newstead. As my name change suggests, I'm a JAGS mum with a daughter in the secondary school.
We are delighted with JAGS. I cannot say enough good things about the culture. my daughter is becoming a wonderful young woman and JAGS are playing no small part in doing that. There is every opportunity at every turn. Excellence oozes out of everything so it's just the norm. Her confidence just grows and grows with every year that she's there. Her strength of character is harnessed, respected, honed, upheld. She has wonderful friends from a range of backgrounds. We are not a religious family but I know that girls of many faiths and cultures attend and are respected and there are specific societies/groups run by the girls to foster connections amongst girls from these backgrounds.
DH and I were saying last week that even if JAGS cost us everything we ever had it would be worth it just to see the change in her from age 11 to now.
Have you attended an Open Day at JAGS? What was your impression? Only you will know if the culture and feel is right for you and is worth the financial sacrifice.

Choose JAGS

Thank you JAGSmum that’s certainly a glowing endorsement! We’ve been a bit disappointed with the boys grammar in terms of development, it’s more a case of leaving them to it and troubleshooting after the fact, which has not been helpful. However I gather that the boys and girls schools are very different so we shouldn’t compare them.

I have attended an open day but it was nearly 2 years ago (my husband went along this year). But my initial impression was very good, it’s more a case of whether the financial outlay is justified in comparison to a grammar with similar results.

JAGS is outstanding with a wide range of nationalities and faiths.

DD spent 7 happy years at Newstead. Very diverse and supportive environment. Lots of clubs, green fields and tennis centre next door. Yes a bit run down but they funnel the money into the teachers. Good range of subjects. They have a new library and new music block and more planned. She had some amazing sixth form options but chose to stay at Newstead. Now very happy at Cambridge.

The two schools are geographically a way apart so is one more complicated to get to or was there one your DD preferred?

JAGS is a great school but I wouldn’t do it if you have 3 children and couldn’t afford the same for all 3. Moreover, grammar entry for your youngest might be even more competitive due to the VAT on private schools that may come in quite soon.
Having said that, I don’t know a single person who isn’t happy with St Olave’s so if your DS is there I don’t know how you will find Newstead.
The girls we know certainly get a lot of homework at Newstead. They are all doing well. We know at least 15 girls who are still there and a few at JAGS too. Obviously given the money JAGs have to spend on staff and extra curricular and pastoral it is going to be a better school than Newstead. But Newstead from what I hear does push the girls academically and sets lots of tests. However, it seems a lot of girls still switch to St Olave’s for Sixth Form because they get fed up of single sex (although both are mixed in the Sixth Form). There is definitely a bit of creaming off some of the best girls going on from what I hear.

Newstead is not an easy option, but it's very good. St Olave's is a C16 grammar school with a long history of achievement. I think it depends on where you live and how much you are prepared to spend.

Hi, we had the same option last year. I let my girl choose. She picked up Newstead, not Jags. She is very happy with Newstead and many nice girls there. Many homework and tests, but she improved a lot. She loves Newstead so many activities and clubs. A lot of talented girls there. Both schools are far from us. Jags is more complicated to travel there. Jags used to be my dream school for her, we tried 4+ (planned to move to Dulwich before) , but at 11+ we turned down the offer. My girl did not like the day she had a test, they left them on the playground without any information. Her test was super super easy, and it seemed very easy to get in. I tried to speak to their CFO before applying, but he never called me back. although emailed a few times to ask for a chat to understand better finance options (I am a finance person). The reception lady is very nice and helpful.
Anyway, I initially doubted her decision and worried about Newstead facilities. But now I know I made the right decision and trust my girl! I am very happy :) I have another one, I do not think we will apply Jags (far), but I will give her both Grammer and private options. Let her decide on what she saw and experienced.

Newstead still has a rep for bad pastoral care.

I tend to find most people who say that either didn’t have their child pass the test and so say it to reassure themselves the school their DD ended up at is better; or are are basing their information on rumours or very old information. However I would be interested to know where your current basis for saying this comes from?

@PettsWoodParadise I went there and said 'still'

Some connected topic in the past

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/secondary/3131342-Newstead-Wood-School-a-warning?page=1

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/secondary/4175144-JAGS-or-Newsteadwood?reply=106742772

This was a few years ago post and I am not sure if it was for a girl or if it was true. Anyway, I had the same worry last year. But my girl is in year 7, she is good. Both school and classmates are supportive. Jags had similar issues and negative reviews online a few years ago. As parents, schools have many emails and communication. They organise events and education for mental health. Many different field experts' speeches for both parents and students are similar to Jags. Newstead School is strict on attendance and cares what students doing, they have a points system. I had good communication with teachers and every department. They constantly improve either teaching or system which impressed me. However, grammar school is not easy and competitive, you need a self-motivated and hard-working child. By the way, my girl is very musical and artistic. But Newstead has many sports and music talents. I only can tell Jags from application and assessment experiences. I believe both are very good schools. Either is a good choice!

Here's another one

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/secondary/3926503-Newstead-Wood-advice-and-questions

I’m considering JAGS for my daughter. She’s only in year 3 currently, but I’m interested to know what level your daughters who passed the entrance exam working at when they were in primary school. And do most get tutored to pass the entrance exam? How does it compare in terms of difficultly with the 11+ exam for grammars?

Our daughter is at JAGS and loves it.
It’s very ethnically diverse (she is minority ethnic)

In what way would you say it is not an easy option? She has a decent score which her tutor said ‘virtually guaranteed’ entry, although not as high as some of her friends and she struggled with the exam prep to some extent, although she is very able in creative subjects like English.

We are almost exactly between the two schools so both should be an easy journey, either 20 mins direct train to Orpington or school bus to JAGS.

I have friends with children at Newstead and they have been happy with the pastoral care so I’m not too worried about that. However one of the reasons we are considering JAGS is that she is quite shy and we would like her to become an articulate and confident young woman, does Newstead also develop these characteristics well?

Newstead have a model UN for debating etc, drama, most teachers are good at sensitively encouraging the quiet ones to contribute. They have group projects to raise money for charities the girls pick and these involve business pitches of their ideas etc so plenty of varied opportunities to find the best way for them to grow in confidence and find their voice. Note my daughter left last year so this is based on latest understanding. Teachers are responsive if you have concerns, they were more responsive than the private school DD was at for junior school for example. Food is a bit meh and the food hall very busy but seems to unite the girls in a common moan! It isn't perfect but then DD had friends who transferred from private schools for sixth form and some of the issues they faced were very worrying so no school is perfect.

My girl has LAMDA lessons every week after Newstead school this includes public speaking and music theatre (You need to pay for this). They use the same tutor company as Eltham College. The public speaking test is on Feb 24 this year. They also have competitions and clubs. My girl is quiet, but she told me she has joined the vote to become the clubs and activities leader in her form. I was surprised by how she changed and she is not shy anymore! Also, she has to join the netball team (one of the teams) to compete in another form. Everyone has to take part as a PE requirement. She is not sporty, but I am very happy that the school pushed her to try anything she was not confident in. They had 12-13 Oxbridge offers this year (Although some left before 6th form to St Olave), but their A level 6th form is improving. If you compare selective independent (Jags is not top tier private) with super selective Grammer, I do not see the differences worth 25K a year (except if you have a bursary - Jags offers a lot (we do not qualify with investments) or large scholarships-Jags do not offer much). This I my opinion as a number person :) Distance is a key and your child feels of the school. She will study 7 years there!

I would choose Newstead without hesitation, and we live within walking distance of the Dulwich public schools. When we were looking at secondary schools we went to the JAGS open days in Years 5 and 6 and really didn't like the school, to the point where we didn't even apply in the end. The headteacher at the time was beyond dreadful, referring to girls with disabilities as having 'wobbly legs and floppy arms' and was clearly living on a different planet to other people. There was also something about the culture of the school and parent community that I really disliked. Several of my daughter's friends from her primary school went there and the ones she kept in touch with really weren't happy. By contrast, we thought Alleyns was a lovely school, much more down to earth, and with very high standards but a lovely atmosphere. We also liked Old Palace in Croydon and Bromley High, although travelling would have been awkward for us. My daughter was offered the maximum scholarships for Alleyns and Old Palace, but it would still have been a struggle for us to have afforded the fees. Her back up school was Prendergast, where she was offered one of the music places. But Newstead was always my daughter's first choice and she was overjoyed when she was offered a place. She got an excellent education at Newstead and we found the pastoral care was really good. The journey was a bit of a pain but the school's PTA organised coaches which picked up students from Newstead and St Olave's along three routes - one bus started from Crystal Palace and one from Blackheath, although I don't know if that's still the case. The facilities at the school were extremely good compared with most of the secondary schools I work with and we always found that the girls were encouraged rather than hothoused, and the amount of homework was never overwhelming. It was also my old school, although it was just one of many grammar schools in my day 😆😆

Newstead will undoubtedly develop your daughter in these areas. I don't think you could find many schools that are better than this!

I've just seen your post which mentions that you live halfway between Newstead and JAGS - have you looked at Bromley High? It really was very very impressive when we visited the school.

I forgot to mention Newstead has an amazing Orchester (pity we do not play Orchester instruments) and they just had an annual production of Oliver this year. New drama teacher is fantastic! The quality of the performance was close to the professional level (my girl performances outside the school on big stages-ROH). We have turned down music scholarships with another independent school. I do not see a huge gap with private schools. They are doing cooking DT this term which is very helpful for her to see how hard mumy is cooking and practical life skills. Newstead is a super selective grammar school |(not only academic) all round opportunities to develop your potential. I suggest you read school newsletters on the website, it is the best way to learn about any schools weekly. I did this when I selected schools.

I would be careful comparing selective schools.
Some guarantee places for their pupils that enter at age 4 and 7, whereas others don’t and pupils who don’t excel in the 11+ have to leave. Others only have entry points at 11 so no junior school pupils to commit to.
The latter two cohort are seemingly more selective and are more likely to have higher GCSE averages but the ethos of a school that is committed to its junior school pupils is better for the whole school IMO.