Picking/dropping GCSEs

[optionsquestions]

Dd is in Y8 and has been told they need to decide soon which subjects to drop. We have a quandary as she is predicted 7-9 for everything bar music, which she will drop. So far the list she wants to take (and *compulsory) is as follows:
*Maths
*Eng Lit
*Eng Lang
*Theology
Computer Science
French
Latin
Chemistry
Biology
Physics (school don't appear to do a triple science but do a double award)
History
Geography (2 humanities but she loves both and gets similar grades)
DT
Art
Drama

She currently wants to do a confusing mix of medicine, engineering and design. Amazing at computer science, maths, science but also very creative and picks up languages easily. We would ideally drop Theology but the school won't allow it from what we have been told by other parents. I personally think dropping Art and Drama and keeping them in some form of hobby/co-curricular capacity is the best way forward, but then she still has 13 subjects. She doesn't want to drop Latin as it is one of her highest scoring but enjoys French as we use it on holidays and is already dropping Spanish so feels she has dropped a language already.

Anyone have any advice?

How many options can she take?

That's a good question and so far the school haven't given much detail on that. I seem to remember between 9 and 11 is the average?

I did suggest we wait for the end of term report but she thinks she will need to pick sooner.

Art is very coursework heavy, so she shouldn't take it unless she's prepared for it to consume a lot of her free time. Drama is something she can continue with as an extracurricular interest.

When the school tell you more about the options process, that may simplify things, as some combinations may not be possible. For instance, if art, drama and DT are all in the same option block, two of them have to go.

Schools normally tell you the process and then allow a reasonable amount of time. There are often options evenings to tell you more about the courses, and sometimes each student has a meeting with a member of staff to talk through their choices. You don't need to come to a decision before they've even told you how it works.

Chemistry Biology Physics is '2 subjects' if doing combined.
Theology may be only short course which is a half GCSE.

So maths, 2xEnglish, 2xScience = 5
Theology = 0.5/1
Computer Science and DT = 2
History and/or Geography = 1 or 2
French and/or Latin = 1 or 2

Drop Drama and Art.

8/9/10 is more usual these days, 11 would be outside the norm.

Also are you sure this is a full options, as the trend has been towards a 2 year KS4.
Some schools do 'mini options' in y8 going into y9 which is about choosing the tech / creative arts / languages more than anything else much.

Don't be overwhelmed by the choice!! If she's reasonably academic then she should (and may even have to) pick English x 2, Maths, Science x 2/3, History, Geography & a language. You'll probably find there's only 1 choice left after that, particularly if RS is compulsory, so just pick whatever she likes best. Quite nice to have a creative or practical subject as a mix with all the other super-academic ones.

I'm not sure it is full options actually, but I do think they won't like her taking both History and Geography. I only took History and have no idea about Geography content or if one is held in better regard or more worthwhile with certain A'levels? I imagine the graphs in Geography are perceived as more maths based and History better for finding sources and curating information? I'm possibly massively over-simplifying. I keep seeing posts about Uni's looking at GCSE's more and am interested if humanities choice makes any difference there?

No one will care at uni application whether she did Geog or History at GCSE.
If she is more science oriented then Goeg might fit better.
What she should check is whether dropping something at GCSE prevents it being picked up for A level.

I am actually also a little confused with the science - if she wants to do all 3 would she have to take 2 as a double and 1 as a single? Might be a school question.

The dual award is approx 2/3rd of the content of each of the single science GCSEs.
It is the same depth as the single science GCSEs just misses a few topics out.

it is perfectly fine to do A level science on the dual award.

You get a double grade such as 8-7 or 6-6. They add up all the marks across the 6 papers and then draw the grade boundaries.

She either does 3 single sciences or does the dual award which is still the 3 subjects but a bit less of each. (Unless at an indie which may let her do just 2 of the single sciences. Doesn't tend to happen in state due to performance measures and timetabling.)

Dual award science is all three sciences combined into two GCSEs. Alternatively she could do each of the science subjects separately. It is usually compulsory to do one or the other and different schools have different systems for who does what - you would need to ask.

The terminology generally used on mumsnet doesn't describe the Science options very well.
The "double" science option covers all 3 Sciences Physics, Chemistry and biology and you obtain 2 GCSEs at the end of the course.
Choosing this option is a good way of freeing up space for another GCSE option and it's still possible to take Science A levels with this option.
You can also take 3 separate GCSEs in Chemistry, Physics and Biology which is what people on mumsnet mean by Triple science.

French and Latin together are a nice combination. I did both and they fit well together. Agree that Art is terribly time consuming. And you can pick up History or Geography A level without having done the GCSE first.

DD1 is making her choices now in Year 9. Feels a bit early for your child so worth clarifying with the school what's what. She has to choose 10 and for context is in an independent school.

The school have produced a short booklet setting out what is covered in the curricula and how it's examined, how much coursework is required etc. It's been useful as while Geography is one of her best subjects, she doesn't like the look of what they are covering and the History curricula looks more interesting to her right now. I've sent her off to get more info on what exactly the projects are for DT too.

She can only do 2 sciences or the combined science and has to do 2 or 1 combined. Yr9 Chemistry seems to have turned into mostly formulae and maths so I think she will make those choices easily enough. Again without having had a taster of what's in store this is harder for your daughter.

Lovely that your daughter is so strong academically but I can see why that creates a a quandary. Definitely worth looking for feedback from parents in the full throes at the moment. Also worth looking at the average grades achieved in certain subjects. If the school is small or the subject specialist you are also at risk of the capabilities of the relevant teacher to inspire.

As a parent to a child who is not so academically strong, I would consider whether having a subject or even two which are more for pleasure [Art, Music, Drama] might be pleasant relief plus an opportunity to have a bit done in advance. There's a tendency to focus on the subjects which are of most "value" to future life choices where pupils are capable and 10 highly academic subjects, tested only in exams is going to be stressful and exhausting. There is merit in doing something for the joy and pleasure of it.

Thanks @TreadSoftlyOnMyDreams - hopefully the school will do similar with the booklet, which sounds very helpful. Dd is also in a private school, so hopefully they'll be keeping us informed as and when we need to be. I'm hoping she has got the wrong end of the stick about having to choose so early!

Yes, initially she wanted to keep Art and Drama - she does LAMDA as an extra - but I agree about the Art coursework (I took it) and think she would get frustrated. She has a few extra curricular clubs revolving around Computer Science, Medicine and Self Defence and Fencing. I think in a year she might drop SD and do something more Art based to fill that gap and keep up with the LAMDA. Keeping DT seems to be her main goal with the creative side as they are doing graphics and marketing as well as the practical design. Luckily this school has a lot more in the way of clubs so she can keep a lot of hobbies going alongside the academics.

It's likely the school will offer a booklet explaining choices normally the options lessons are split into buckets and you choose one from each bucket to fit into the timetable. All students will also do PE even if they aren't doing a GCSE in it. It's likely she'll be encouraged to choose subjects to fulfill the Ebacc.

You may find that she can do Art or DT as in terms of assessment criteria they are now the same subject if the same exam board although obviously the content is different the same may/may not apply to MFL im not sure. At least this is what students were told at a local school who had chosen Textiles and Art

It's worth looking on the school website at the curriculum plan for the GCSE subjects to see what she will be studying and see what takes her fancy. Then look at the local college and potential university courses on UCAS to see the entry requirements and ensure you don't shoot yourself in the foot later on. A few years ago this happened to some sixth form students that did not pick Biology favouring Health and Social Care or similar instead and then wanting to go on to various medical pathways and not being able to without further access courses etc. GCSE choice is less important but it is worth working backwards.

Keeping DT seems to be her main goal with the creative side as they are doing graphics and marketing as well as the practical design.
OP you really need to check that the DT GCSE does cover graphics. dd did GCSE Product Design with a similar goal in mind and there was very little graphics involved which she found disappointing. Most of the marks were for making the product rather than the design.
If your dd is more interesting in making things then DT is the subject to do. If it's design then taking Art with a graphics style project may be more appropriate.

About timing - some independent schools will do preliminary choices/interest surveys early as a way of allowing them to set option blocks and plan sets.

If it isn't available on the website, the school should have a pdf or similar that they can send about the process & timeline for choosing options. I'd try to get that info before getting into discussions with your DD that go beyond "what subjects are you most looking forward to in GCSE?" or similar. There's no point trying to make decisions without the basic info.

@catndogslife thanks for this, something to check for sure. At the moment they are doing a lot of design for packaging and marketing for a real product as a competition and the winner gets their idea in a real shop with the product, so I wonder if she is thinking the same. We moved from a school that had Food Science and Textiles so this is her first experience of DT.

Spanish over Latin surely? Very similar, goes with French and far more useful? Not difficult either

@Userxyd she was doing better at Spanish in her last school but it was on a par with French (8's) but Latin she gets full marks most of the time, so really wants to keep it as feels it's an easy 9 for her.

I agree that one creative subject is a great idea and more than one probably not for an academically strong child, just from the workload point of view. (one of mine was thinking about music + art and while I tried to be supportive I encouraged her to find out more about art coursework and time requirements and was moderately relieved when she decided to stick with just music)

If she has the choice of doing just 2 separate sciences she needs to be careful (as alluded to above) - the one to not drop if there's a chance she might want to go into a science-related career, is chemistry. There are lots of doors that won't shut based on your GCSE choices (eg one of mine had a bit of a think about picking up DT at A level, contemplating engineering), but some might without chemistry.

I suppose I'm biased as I did Latin through to my final school exams (not UK), but I think Latin+ French is a great combo.

I'd hate to be back at school having to choose which subjects to discontinue :)
So many good choices, so little time ...

I don’t think you really have a quandary until you know the options process! She really needs to speak to her form tutor and understand how it works.

if you want to do medicine then surely you need to do chemistry and biology A level with physics/maths or possibly geography and I thought most schools won't let you do science A levels on double award Science? I could be wrong but at my dc school you can't do A level biology for example without a 7 in single biology?

Clever kids should do triple award science, imo, unless they're positive they don't want to to do science/engineering A levels/Uni.

I'm pretty sure that in most exam boards double award is Paper 1 only in each of the 3 subjects so 3 sciences whereas triple award is Paper 1 and Paper 2 in each science so 6 exams? and Paper 2 has the more advanced content - which you really need for A level.

Also in Y8/Y9 I don't think they can drop a science can they? all this might just be my dc school though ...

Fair dos although for life usefulness an 8 in Spanish would trump a 9 in Latin for me- take your point though.
Also agree with PP if she's thinking medicine or anything sciencey for A level then triple science GCSE for sure.
And as other PP said you'll need to check what her options are because it all depends on how they timetable it as to what combinations are possible x