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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

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Original poster

Why is every child entered for every exam even if they are going to get unclassified?

24 replies

fizzbuzz · 20/03/2008 15:59

Is this the same in every school? We are not allowed to withdraw any child from an exam even if they have completed no coursework (this is 60% in my subject, and always = unclassified in exam if not submitted)

It appears to be the same across the school and is really peeing everyone off. It is quite a recent thing, 5 years ago there was no problem with it. Have even spoken to union about who have said everyone is fed up of it.

Is it the same everywhere?

OP posts:

kritur · 20/03/2008 16:54

Yes, the policy is the same here (officially anyway ). As we're a double award subject generally we can normally get a grade out of them in Y10 so just don't highlight the fact we're withdrawing them/not entering them for Y11. These are the poor attenders, RHINOs (Really Here In Name Only) etc. I wouldn't care our school is trying to make sure we have 100% get at least 1 A-G but can't see that they're undermining this by bunging them in for exams they have no hope of passing. Better that they concentrate on 3 subjects with coursework etc than 9 and spread themselves too thinly I think.

roisin · 20/03/2008 17:03

Fizzbuzz - we do withdraw a few students from some exams, but only if they have no chance of anything other than unclassified. But if at all possible use crowbar to extract some manner of c/w from them, however feeble, so they have a chance of getting a G.

(What is your subject btw?)

Last year we had a group of students (about 12 I think) educated off-site in a 'unit' for behavioural reasons. It was great to have them not on site, and probably contributed to our best GCSE results ever (not that fab though!). But if a child leaves with 0 qualifications whatsoever (as all these students did) the school gets absolutely hammered on CVA. If all these students had got 5 Gs, even if that wasn't 'good progress' for them, overall our CVA would have looked OK. Because they left with zero our CVA looks absolutely appalling.

HTH

duchesse · 20/03/2008 17:07

They're not. Even very "good" schools tweak their stats by disallowing or heavily "encouraging" some children to miss some exams so as not to affect their league table ratings. Just one more nail in the coffin of league tables as far as I'm concerned.

duchesse · 20/03/2008 17:09

Probably particularly "good" schools.

Original poster

fizzbuzz · 20/03/2008 18:32

But I work in a "good" school! 85% A-C last year, although usually it ia somewhere in the late 70's.

I have 2 students who have done practically nothing, but am still being forced to enter them although they are almost certain to get unclassified!! What is the point? It costs money to put them in for an exam. Surely not being entered is better than a U for school stats??? Or is there something I don't know about here?

OP posts:

mumeeee · 20/03/2008 19:51

DD3 has not ben entered for RE or Welsh. She was only doing short course in these subjects. The Welsh teacher would not even consider entering any of her lower set class as she thinks won't pass. She didn't even let them do the mocks she just entered them all for entry level. RE teacher decided after mocks not to enter them after the mocks.

scaryteacher · 20/03/2008 20:40

It only takes between 6-9 marks to get a G for RE, so the mock must have been appalling! I never entered my students if they didn't bother in the mock, but I made them come to class and do the work. One such horror then turned up and insisted on being a late entry for the short course on the day of the exam and got a B! He'd evidently learned something between the mock and the exam.

Original poster

fizzbuzz · 20/03/2008 20:52

But we aren't allowed not to enter them as we "have to enter every child" as dictated by SMT. Is it coming from LEA?

OP posts:

scaryteacher · 20/03/2008 22:11

Our HoD was on sabbatical one year, and we took a command decision not to enter those who didn't work. We got the best results ever that year!

Original poster

fizzbuzz · 20/03/2008 22:17

Our HoD is not allowed any say, it is a SMT thing

OP posts:

Original poster

fizzbuzz · 20/03/2008 22:17

Our HoD is not allowed any say, it is a SMT thing

OP posts:

twinsetandpearls · 21/03/2008 16:20

I have just withdrawn those students who got a U or G in their mock if they were targetted for a d or above.

I think core subjects have to enter but options and RE don't.

CarGirl · 21/03/2008 16:22

the secondary schools around me prevent them taking gcse's that they think the students will not get a c or higher in!!!!!!!!!!

mumeeee · 21/03/2008 22:55

Scasyteacher. I don't actually know if the mocks were the reason that the RE teacher didn't enter DD3's class for the RE exam. when ever sthey asked if they were going to be entred for the exam she just kept saying I'm not sure. It was not until a couple of days ago when they were given thier exam timetables that they discovered they were not entered. In fact the RE teacher did not even tell them what mark they got for the mock. Oh and by the way there was a fire at their school last term and their RE books got burnt so they hdid not have them to revise with which is I think part of the reason that they were not entred.
My daugher would have tried the best she can. She is now doing 8 GCSE's which I think is alright for her.

elkiedee · 21/03/2008 23:36

Mixed feelings about this - I think it's wrong for schools to only enter those who are definitely going to pass exams to boost the stats. Those who do as CarGirl mentions. However, I think it would be fair enough to say that if coursework is a high percentage of the final grade, pupils have to have submitted it to be entered, and that they have to have attended a reasonable proportion of lessons.

I did 8 O-levels and got kicked out of what would have been a 9th in Domestic Science as a hopeless case early on. I'm not upset about not getting to pursue an O level tbh, but I think looking back I would have had 5 terms to learn how to pass the theory exam and I was written off on that a bit too early. Not sure I could have ever passed a cooking exam, but it would have been useful to do a non-exam course in learning to cook. I didn't need that 9th O level but the practical skills would have come in handy.

ScienceTeacher · 22/03/2008 07:08

If they do the course, they sit the exam in my school.

Original poster

fizzbuzz · 22/03/2008 08:27

I am just trying to find out if this is consistent across the country.

I have one pupil who has submitted no coursework (worth 60%) and got 6% in her mocks. I still have to enter her even though she is certainly going to get a U. It just seems a waste of time and money to enter her

OP posts:

roisin · 22/03/2008 08:43

.. and she probably won't turn up for the exams fizzbuzz!

It certainly seems a waste of time and money to me. I take it this is a core subject?

Roll on abolition of coursework!

Original poster

fizzbuzz · 22/03/2008 09:05

No, it's not even a core subject, which makes it even more senseless!

OP posts:

Blandmum · 22/03/2008 09:10

We take very small numbers of kids out of one or two exams if it is obvious that they are going to get a U and if they are disrupting the learning of the rest of the class.

We figure that they are better spending the time trying to puch up their other ghrades from Ds to Cs.

But these are very small numbers and hardly any child gets a U where I teach

Something that we also do is make them repeat the year 10 science if they fail to get a C first time round. That limits them to 1 GCSE in science, but better 1 C than 2 Es or Ds

Original poster

fizzbuzz · 22/03/2008 09:21

Hardly any child gets a U at my school either. BUT there are some, and school policy is EVEY child is entered for EVERY exam.

Is it a union issue do you think? The entire teaching staff are really pissed off with it. EG, 2 students have failed to hand in any coursework, although I know they have done a bit, they are deliberately "forgetting" it as it is unfinished. Deadline was a few weeks ago. Everything has been moderated and put in rank order. But the kids who are "forgetting" are not allowed to be sent home to collect it, so they will carry on forgetting it, and ultimately end up with a U. It's really senseless and makes me

OP posts:

alfiesbabe · 22/03/2008 11:03

Yes, normal practice I think.

twinsetandpearls · 22/03/2008 12:36

We only take kids out who clearly don;t give a shit and are disrupting the learning of others. I then have the dubious pleasure of teaching that class for the rest of the year.

happilyconfused · 23/03/2008 23:55

We withdraw the Us at our school. The only subjects that do not have that option are English and Maths. However with the really poor students you have to be quick to get your withdrawal application into the HOY before the other subjects.

..... and of course at this time of year we then have those treasures on a reduced timetable in order to minimise the disruption to the rest of the school.

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