Destroying Daughters life

[sef23]

Hi everyone, the title is not meant to be headline grabbing, its really what i feel im doing. This is a 1st world problem, i know theres a lot going on in the world and we are lucky to be alive and healthy. For years ive struggled with the childrens schooling. We are in WALES , DS & DD both in welsh school, made the incredible difficult decision to put son in Private English, he hated it, struggled with the conversion to english, but is now ok as he has always stayed in touch with his friends outside of school as the private school kids live all over the place and they do not socialise outside of school. Hes sort of accepted his fate.

DS on the other hand is way out of her depth, She was taken out of welsh in year 5 and struggled all year. Really struggled. The kids in year 5 operate about 2 years ahead. We were gonna put her back in Welsh in year 6 but then thought shes lost a year of welsh! and had one eye on secondary school and the local comprehensive is terrible. She is shouting screaming lashing out as she doesnt understand the predicament she is in. She called herslef the 'stupidest girl in the class' last year.

As again the private school girls dont meet up outside of school, and we still live in the same locality (small welsh village) all the local girls her old friend dont really want to know her anymore bar 1 or 2 as its a village the kids go out, meet up, yes - at 10 yrs old. Shes also missed their school trips etc and feels lonely, left out and doesnt have a best friend. We thought that she would have the best of both worlds. See s her old friends and gets a good education. She doesnt understand whats she learning in private and her teacher informed she is about 3 years behind!

What do i do??? put her back in her comfort spot being her old school? where now her welsh is back to basic. Leave her where she is? where she is at the bottom of her class? will she get better? will she catch up - yes with alot of external effort and daily tuition yes maybe.

I had her accepted after xmas, so start back Jan 8th. I didnt know what to do drove her mad with false hope and said to myself im gonna stick with the private school it will help her in the long run and put her back.

But this week all of her old friends are going cinema to watch mean girls and one of her old friends added her to a snapchat group and another girl said why, we dont want DS to go and it devastated her.

Do i put her education first or let her struggle for years with the hope she gets good grades at A level to become something somewhere eg pharmacy law dr, i mean thats why shes in private.

Do i listen to my gut and pull her out? do i put her in an english state primary and let her start all over again? make new friends again? do i leave her in private. Do i put her back in her welsh school?

Please help.

Thank you

Firstly I would have issues with any school never mind private who would tell your child they are so far behind.
Have they called you in? What's the action plan? Has she had any testing?
Assuming you are paying heavily for her schooling now, then your expectations should be higher.

Stop playing Hokey Cokey with their education. Pick a side and get on with it.

Get your daughter off to her current school and don't be so wet.

Socially, these things take time. Unfortunately for your daughter the gap will widen with the local kids so focus on one or two who are friendly.
Of course private school kids socialise outside of school. Have you arranged any outings, play dates, sleepovers?

Guys im still in the same situation. Ive collapsed u der the strain of trying to do whats right. Rest of her classmates had 70 plus in recent tests some with 90/100. DD had 40 per cent average. But she missed 2 weeks of that due to my dithering so is probabbly half behind would have maybe got 50 per cent with attendance. The school are asking me to sign her up for next year, my son is there as well and doing ok, my neice and nephew are flying as well there but younger, her welsh education and 2 year covid loss has destroyed her confidence, i had a girl who loved school lots of friends to now someone who feels really behind and lost and I just dont lnow what to do. Tmw she has to go school somehwere. Thing is her local secondary have no space as ive applied so late, if she goes local welsh school again tmw, but then cant get into the local secondary shes screwed as her private wont take her back.

Help. Pls any advice is welcome apart from name calling and saying im an idiot, i know i am.

I wouldn't send her back just for the friendship. She is 10 and when they move to high school even if with the same friendship group friends often change dramatically. Both mine went to local high school with a lot of their friends, non of their friends at high school are from primary. So although she maybe upset about it now its probably a non issue in the long run.

Sounds like I would be way more concerned about her being so far behind. I was 3 years behind in English at 10 but was found to be seriously dyslexic. Have you been and talked to the school to see what they think the issues are? Don't keep changing her school she needs to settle somewhere and you need to find out what the real problem is.

You didn’t answer the questions last time about what she wants.
So that would help.

Stop with the nonsense about pharmacy / medicine / law - she’s in primary! Give her a chance to breathe and find her interests - and remember that there are anyway huge numbers of state educated adults in those professions.

The most basic question here is would she (not you) prefer to continue in English or Welsh, with support to catch up in Welsh?

Is the state secondary you mention Welsh medium or English? It sounds like she’s final term of Y5 now, although I’m not sure as your posts aren’t very clear.

Are you a Welsh speaking household? It sounds like it from your son initially struggling with an English language school, but then that doesn’t fit with your daughter being behind in Welsh if you speak Welsh at home. Do her old friends speak Welsh out of school?

So back to that question other posters asked you before - what does she want to do?

If it’s return to her Welsh primary, what can you do to help her Welsh? Speak it at home, tutors?

One option, still with private. Over the summer term or holiday online tuition on Maths and English to be solid. Maybe there is a creative writing course nearby that can be another way to get more sociable with new kids. One to one can be done via online you get more tutors to choose.
You need to identify the weak topics and the ones she is strong in. Timetables 1 to 12 under minutes. English comprehension.
Check examninja.co.uk they have for the English curriculum year workbooks bundles, ask teachers which year is she working at and get a few from that year, the current year, and the next year. Also, look at 11+ thread and SATs, to get an idea. Ask the current school, for exemplary examples of work so you can see the difference is it grammar or spelling etc to focus.
Private schools kids do meet outside school but you need to find a few and make an effort especially during holidays time.
Sport camp?

You need to have a meeting with the school?

She's at 40. Why?
What is she struggling with?
Where have you identified she needs help?
What are you doing to support this?
How can I support this at home?

Also get her to have a friend over for tea or organise an outing or something. I know you say it's not really done as people are more spread out but honestly I'd be focussing on mental health and encouraging her to integrate in her current school.

“Thing is her local secondary have no space as ive applied so late, if she goes local welsh school again tmw, but then cant get into the local secondary shes screwed as her private wont take her back.”

So if you’ve made a late application, are you saying that she’s now going into summer term of Y6?
And you already know that she has no confirmed place at the local secondary?

1. Is the local secondary that is full Welsh medium or English?
2. what is her position on the waiting list?
3. have you asked them if they get much movement before the year starts, or during Y7? (asking all this because you need a realistic view of whether that school is an option)
4. what state secondary place has she been offered? Is it a viable choice? What language?

If you have an offer of a state place that she prefers to current private, then:

• if it’s Welsh medium, switch her back to old primary now, for the benefit of starting to return to Welsh. And sort out tutoring!
• if it’s English but other friends from old primary are going there, go back to Welsh primary now so she can prepare to move up with them

In the absence of good reasons like those above, do not spin her head with a change for one term! If she moves for a single term, it has to be because she wants to and because the school for that term leads into her secondary place.

What have you done to understand why she’s struggling at current private?

Is she due to move to secondary in September? If so, I think it would be wisest to keep her where she is for the summer term. Start afresh in September.

In the meantime, book a meeting with her teacher to establish what she is struggling with the most, and what support can they offer. And what extra support you can give her at home or buy in over the holidays.

So sending her back again to the Welsh school isn't an option. She's been moved three times so far and is only ten years old. There is no space at the local secondary school anyway, so stop even considering it and getting the poor girls hopes up. You need to stop with all the hand ringing. You made a choice, and that's it. Look at any after school clubs, activities in the area she can join. Get her to reach out on what's app to the girls that have been more keen on staying in touch. Get her a tutor to try and get her up to speed with her current classmates, but you need to be firm that this is the school she now attends and that's it

Keep her where she is. She needs stability and a certain future. Work with the school to get her the support to get on track. She will be getting a better education in the long run and the social reasons for going back to her old school just aren’t good enough when those old friends really don’t sound very pleasant!

For those wondering about the Welsh system - it is a totally different curriculum and they don’t teach reading or phonics until 7 I believe. Until then it is just learning through play. I work near the border and a colleague who lives on the Welsh side was asking about my DC the same age on the English side and the differences in what they were doing at school was huge.

Thanks everyone

Yes, she is i year 6 she wishes to go back to her old school.

Thats what i want as well as its just too hard in the private for her.

Yes i made a choice based on how hard things were for my son, who teachers thought was dyslexic in private - he wasnt it was just the welsh factor.

We are not welsh speaking. We live in a village where the local school was welsh.

I dont know what else to say. Ues i panic but every kid in that school leaves to something like medicine etc.

I dont see the point in paying 70k for next 7 years if shes not academic and struggling so much now if shes gonna het b and c's she can get that anywhere.

Thanks for your time mumsnetters xxxx i dont know if my intuition is saying leave her in private or what im feeling is fear as its the wrong decision.

welsh medium

“I dont see the point in paying 70k for next 7 years if shes not academic and struggling so much now if shes gonna het b and c's she can get that anywhere.”

Isn’t the point that if she’s capable of Bs and Cs, then the right school will support her to achieve that, but in the wrong school she’ll get Ds?

You don’t even know what grades she’s capable of, because you’re flinging her from school to school and language to language like a yo-yo, and it seems like you don’t even really know why she’s struggling.

So what state secondary school place have you actually got for her?
Where is she on the waiting list for your local secondary?

Your approach to this sounds utterly chaotic. Stop messing about talking about “intuition” and try talking to her teachers about FACTS!

OP she's 10. Forget about Bs & Cs. Forget about medicine or law. She's a child and constant change is causing her material harm. Let the poor girl settle.

Your problem is now, and she needs stability now, not to be shifted back and forth like a ping pong ball.

You aren't a welsh speaking household, there is no long term benefit to her learning or being taught in Welsh.

She is currently in a school where you know she will get a secondary place. She is with her brother. Contact the school and ask them their plan to support her and help her to catch up. Work with them on extra curriculars to support her socially.
She will make friends if she is there long enough.

At 10 writing her off as not a future doctor so not worth spending money on is bloody ridiculous. You moved her because you didn't feel the local high school could provide for her educationally, but now you'll move her back because if she's not going on to medicine or law it's a waste of cash? The bloody kid has been pulled every way. You've already said there is no place at the local high school, but if she's too thick for a medical or law degree at 10 you'll try to get her in? How about working with the school you're paying for to help get her up to speed instead of changing schools again.

Why are you messing around with their education and sending them to loads of different schools? A miserable child will not do well at school regardless of how amazing the school is on paper. Send her back to where she had friends and was happy. Private school will not guarantee a good career if she's miserable and so far behind. I went to one of the best unis in the country and have a career in law and I went to state school. Send her back and stop messing around with different schools.

It sounds like her attendance has been very poor. That, combined with a history of changing school, is probably the main factor to why she's not progressing.

If you keep changing her school, she'll never settle. Subconsciously she won't see the point in investing in friendships or trying to get to know her teacher, because deep down she knows you'll probably chop and change her school again.

I vote stay in the English school. I don't think it makes sense to go for a Welsh medium school if you don't speak Welsh at home.

I dont see the point in paying 70k for next 7 years if shes not academic and struggling so much now if shes gonna het b and c's she can get that anywhere.

Your poor daughter. Prioritise her mental health and send her back. I don't pay for private school for my daughter to have a career in medicine, but because she's happy and settled there and has good friends. If she was miserable I would listen to her. A miserable child will not do well at school (or even achieve B's/C's).

This. Go and talk to the school. There is no magic bullet here, she just needs support to catch up. Or she is perhaps profoundly dyslexic in which case I'd expect professionals to know some of the signs. You should perhaps just crack on and get her privately tested. It's a useful confidence boost if the testing shows her capabilities, but just that she needs to catch up. And if it shows she is dyslexic or has dyscalcula she will get a professional view of where she needs targeted support. It's not a generic - can't read/can't count test.

You need to get to the current PRIVATE school [STOP MESSING HER ABOUT] and look for 1:1 extra tuition for the summer term and make arrangements for summer tuition and probably through year 7 and 8 too. Rome wasn't built in a day.

I suggest that you discuss with your daughter and explain that on current testing she has unfortunately some work to do to catch up. That she is in the right place to do so and will get more support and smaller classes. I would tell her that she will stay where she is through Year 7 & 8 and then review.

For Year 9 on, when she starts her GCSE coursework you can take a view on whether or not the school is working for her and whether she should return to state to see out her school days.

She’s in year 6, so have you applied for a secondary school place, or was the intention to keep her in the private school, which you’re now reconsidering?

At ten years old, what is needed is a child who is learning and making progress at their level and to do that she needs to feel happy and secure.

She’s not happy though and part of the problem is that she’s insecure because she doesn’t know what’s happening as you’ve been so indecisive. If your reason for keeping her in a private school is because you believe that she’ll achieve high grades at GCSE, I think you’ll be disappointed. They’ve told you that she’s not achieving now. Whether that’s because of the frequent disruption or because she’s just not academic, it’s difficult to know, but if she understands that you don’t want to spend money on her if she isn’t going to fulfil your ambition of a career in medicine or law, I’m not surprised she’s all over the place, as are you.

Make a decision and stick to it
Accept that it’s too early to know whether she’s capable of a career in medicine or law and accept her for what she is.
If she’s behind, see what support there is in school or from a tutor to help her progress.
Talk to the school about the possibility of a learning difficulty and if that’s the case, push for support for that.
Make sure she knows that you want the best for her whether she’s able or not and don’t compare her to her brother.
Look at what she is good at, rather than what she isn’t. There are successful people who have careers in occupations other than medicine and law. They aren’t the be all and end all and it doesn’t matter what other pupils in the school go on to do.

I would do a late application for the local secondary school and find out where you are on the waiting list.

I'd also apply for any other secondary schools you could feasibly access.

I probably wouldn't move her school yet again for one term, but I would focus on trying to find a secondary place where you feel she will be happy and confident.

£70k will buy an awful lot of tutoring if she needs it.

Bloody hell I'm so glad you weren't my mum, don't write her off at 10. I was 3 years behind. You know what I went on to get a physics degree. It really annoys me when parents say this about their children. With the right help and support she may still acive academically.

Stop messing her around, if she hasn't got a state high school place then leave her in private. Go speak to the school and find out what the issues are and get extra tuition if need be (I had extra English and maths tuition).

You need to be supporting her and not keep swapping schools as this isn't going to help.

Stop moving her around.
ask the school to identify her weak areas. Get her tutors or tutor her yourself. Spend the summer holiday getting her caught up.

I'd imagine

I'd imagine the poor girl's head is spinning with all the chopping, changing and pressure.

Your comments about private school not being worth it if she is 'only' going to get Bs and Cs make me think that by sending her to what I assume is a comprehensive Welsh school you are consigning her to some sort of sin bin. Is that even true? How have you decided that she will achieve these grades by the way?

Where is she happiest? If it's neither you need to think about why that might be. 40% in comparison with peers getting 70 or over indicates there could be some sort of special educational need in the background. She's now school refusing, so your number one priority here is finding out what's going on and making school a less stressful place to be.

So much of this is about you and what you think is best and it should be about her.