How does 13+ work?

[Howdoes]

My husband and I only have experience of state schools, but realised recently that the best option for our DS is likely to be found in the independent sector. He won’t be ready for 11+ and a more nurturing environment for longer will benefit him.

Can any private school mums tell me more about prep school to age 13? Eg is it a bigger jump than moving at age 11? I know there are fewer places - does that mean children are expected to be exceptional? What is the dynamic like for year 7 and 8 with a smaller peer group? Is it typically only people preparing for famous public schools who stay on for 13+? Thats not the plan for us he’s bright but sensitive and the priority is his happiness now and in future.

We are in North London if that’s helpful info.

What is ur plan post 13+?

Lots of senior school has 13+ selection exam at the age of 10/11 (same as 11+ time) nowadays.

Exactly what I need to know. I’ve seen it described as a “pre test” in year 6 for 13+ so assumed that some did it in year 6 and some later?

copying again with a quote tweet so you’ll see it:

Exactly what I need to know. I’ve seen it described as a “pre test” in year 6 for 13+ so assumed that some did it in year 6 and some later? Is that not really a thing?

The Prep Schools I’m researching list 13+ destinations some of which look like they would work for him.

How the destination school selects is up to them. You'll need to read carefully the admissions pages of your shortlist of schools

The basic options are:

• competitive exam at 13+
• conditional offer system, whereby if your DC meets the conditions of their offer, they're in (unless destination school has mucked up its numbers and over-offered - very rare)

Conditional offers are often made on the basis of a pre-test in Y6 - which all applicants sit at the same time (I think Harrow might do it in Y7, but that's the only one I can think of off hand). Then there might be further selection based on any/all from interview, prep school reference, taster day.

At some point (depending on which schools you have offers from) you may have
to nominate a "first choice" school - ie you hold a single offer which your DC should comfortably meet (this allows schools to be more sure of their numbers and also convert some waiting list offer to offers). Then at 13+ there is the final confirmation (normally exam)

OP - some secondary independent schools have pupils sit their admissions test for 13+ when pupils are in year 6, i.e. same time as the 11+. If successful, pupils stay at their prep for two. more years. So this is an option really for preps that go until 13. So if you DC is now in year 6, they have missed this.

There are some schools that allow pupils who want to join in year 9, to sit the year before (i.e. when they are in year 8). But you have to research which ones these are.

Hope that helps.

A lot of private schools who have a normal intake at 11+ will also have a significant intake at 13+ because they will lose a quarter of their cohort for y9 to the big public boarding schools.

Their typical 13+ intake are the refugees from the state system who started at a comprehensive in y7 and have been bullied for putting in academic effort and let down by staff shortages etc, as well as those leaving prep schools who don't want to go to boarding schools.

You only need to worry about y6 pre-tests if you are going for the public boarding schools. The 13+ intake at a day school will just be in the preceding January but your prep school will help you identify suitable target schools and will prepare your DS to gain appropriate offers, that is the main function of a prep school.

Taking year 7/8 in prep is not uncommon. However if already year 6 you need to be having conversations about the secondary selection process, especially any late applications or for deferred 13+ places, and whether 18 months/two years will be sufficient to prepare your child. Ime at 13+ entry they need to hit the ground running, both academically and socially, if the main entry point is 11+ as groups, teams and clubs will be established and subjects for gcse options narrowed down.

The Prep Head will want the fees as many often leave at year 6 but that will only benefit your child if it gets them into the best secondary school for them. Ask how would they integrate them, what development opportunities can they offer, are they following a broad curriculum or taking CE in year 8? If they have a good relationship with the heads of destination schools they may be willing to influence the application process on your behalf.

That completely depends where you live.
Most of the private day schools around London do a pre test in y6 for 13+ entry and very few will have more than a handful leave for boarding schools then.

The CoEds day schools don't tend to have big 13+ entry so they will have exams later for occasional places at that time.

I've had 2 DC go through 13+. DS1 initially moved to senior school at 11+, but that turned out not to be a good fit so he went back to prep school, and took direct-entry 13+ exams in Y8. DS2 took 13+ pretests in Y6 and then CE in Y8.

We found the transition to senior school much smoother at 13+ than 11+. DC were more independent so travel to school, finding their way around a larger campus, organising their own extracurricular schedule etc were all much less of a challenge. We also found that both DC had outgrown their prep by the end of Y8 and were well and truly ready to move on, as were most of their friends. However, the 13+ process felt higher-stakes than 11+ because there wasn't the safety net of staying on at prep school if they didn't get a place at a school of choice.

13+ entrance processes vary from school to school. Some only do 13+ pretests, some do direct entry exams in Y7 or Y8, others do a mix of both. Some have their main entry at 11+ and then a smaller cohort join at 13+, others schools only start at 13+. We found that some schools advertised a 13+ intake on top of 11+, but in practice only admitted a tiny handful of students at 13+ and were not a realistic prospect unless your child was a scholarship candidate (and even then it was pretty much a lottery!). It's a good idea to quiz schools on entry numbers at 13+ before paying an application fee and putting your child through entrance exams.

Each entry process has its benefits and drawbacks. With direct entry via Y8 exams, you have more time to see how your DC develops and which school might be the best fit, but you don't have a senior school place until half-way through Y8 which can feel quite uncertain, especially if your DC is surrounded by classmates who've had conditional places via pretest since Y6. One plus is that CE becomes unnecessary (the prep school may still make them sit it, but it isn't crucial for the next stage).

Entry via Y6 pretest gives some security early on if your DC is offered a place at a school you like, but you can end up in limbo if offered more than one school or if you are on waiting lists. It can also be difficult to look ahead and be confident that the senior school you think will suit your 10/11-year-old will still be a good fit when they're a moody teenager! Common Entrance shouldn't be a big hurdle if your prep school goes to Y8 and is used to preparing pupils for CE, and there is often some leeway from senior schools because they know what a disaster it is for families to have a conditional place withdrawn so late in the process. DS2 had an unexpected blip in one CE subject but still had his conditional place confirmed.

Unless your child is very sociable, I'd recommend going for a school which either starts at Y9 or takes a large group at 13+ on top of 13+ entry - otherwise it can be hard to break into existing friendship groups in a group that's been together since Y7.

There are different types of 13+ entrance processes.

Most schools these days sit a computer-based ISEB test in Y6.

• ISEB in Y6 + Interview -- offer in Y6
• ISEB + Written test in Y7 + Interview -- offer in Y7
• No ISEB for entrance - Written test in Y7 -- offer in Y7
• Missed ISEB for whatever reason, so another chance to apply with a written test in core subjects in Y8

There will then be unconditional or conditional offers. Some schools offer conditionally based on sitting the Common Entrance Exam in Y8 (and ask for 60% or 70% marks depending on school). Some schools make an unconditional offer and then you just sit tight for 2 years.

Not all schools use the pre-test. Some will use their own written tests and interviews in Y7 and then make an offer - some schools will make these unconditional. Some schools will make scholarship offers off the back of pre-test scores, for others they will just be a small part of how the school reaches a decision.

All really helpful thank you. Lots to think about. We are currently in year 5 so this would be for next year with a view to 3 years at a prep before moving to year 9.

We had thought bright child (eg greater depth for most things at his state primary) would be good grounding for 11+ but it looks like expectations are much higher where we live with DC in preps/ tutored at least from year 4/5 (lots of practice and technique on top of being equally bright). He won’t suit the pressure at the moment but with a few years of this being more normalised I think he’d be fine. The non selective schools seem tiny and I worry about having a big enough pool to make friends.

For secondary we’re happy with something like Mill Hill I think.

Lots to think about. Thank you all.

OP, I think Y6 is a tricky year to enter a prep school unless most of the year group are definitely staying until Y8. The first term of Y6 and the first half of the second term are very focused on 11+ entrance exams, 13+ pretests and then senior school interviews, so depending on the prep, the atmosphere could feel quite pressured. Pupils who are leaving at the end of Y6 may be less invested in forming friendships with a new Y6 joiner, which could be difficult socially if a large proportion of the cohort tend to leave at 11+. Having said that, in my experience, a lot of prep Y7 and Y8 classes are quite boy-heavy as there tend to be more options for boys at 13+ so this may be less of an issue with a DS.

You could consider trying to move to a prep during Y5 so that friendships have time to develop before exam season kicks in. Alternatively, lots of preps have spaces available for Y7 because of 11+ leavers, so you may find you have a wider choice of prep options if you move for Y7.

Thank you that’s a really helpful on the reality of year 6 in a prep. It may be that the best option is a non selective secondary in year 7. It’s such a different world I’m discovering. I’d naively assumed there would more choice but perhaps not in north London…

Could you move them to a through junior/senior school in year 6. So they have time to settle and make friends before senior school. Some make them sit a selective test alongside external candidates but generally they would not accept him if unlikely to pass.

Do you have any recommendations for options for through schools worth considering?

For example Highgate is our closest independent, but the website says they are reluctant to offer occasional places in upper juniors unless you’re returning from abroad. I’m also not sure that would be the best fit for us either it does seem to have a very particular type of child that it looks for.

@Howdoes , I didn't intend to sound too pessimistic - I think in some ways there is almost too much choice in terms of the different possible routes to senior school entry, especially for boys. Not all preps are super-pressured in Y6, but even at my DC's

Another option to consider is finding an all-through school you like and applying to the prep for Y6. (or even late Y5 if they have spaces). You mentioned you might aim for somewhere like Mill HIll for seniors - it might be worth exploring whether a move to Belmont (their prep division) before Y7 could be an option.

Worth noting though that if you need a bursary or scholarship to bring fees within reach, these tend to only be available at the main entry points (i.e. 11+, 13+, 16+).

If you are in year 5, it is not too late for 11+ My dd only started prep end of May in year 5 because we did not realize until last minute that we would be doing the 11+ (we had always planned to send her to another school, but plans changed and she wanted to do 11+). She did well and got into the schools she applied to. It is possible. You could sign up to Atom learning and see how he does. I think it makes most sense to try for it now, as most 13+ you need to take the exam in year 6 anyway, and then you are stuck bc where does he go when he is done primary school? So makes sense to go for 11+.

Forgot to mention my dd was also at state.

It is the same in our area, SW London, with some of the schools being highly academic. You hear of dc being tutored from year 4 at prep schools. But do not let that scare you off! DD was at state school and only started prep end of year 5 (end of may). Someone recommended atom learning, so she did that a few times a week (nothing crazy) and had a group zoom tutoring session once a week. She did well for the 11+ and got into schools that I was told were highly academic and hard to get into (I was almost scared off from trying!!!). Anyway, dd wanted to go for it and she wanted to go for the more academic schools. If you dc is bright and motivated it is not too late.