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Secondary education

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Original poster

Just been on the news that grades for this year’s exams (GCSEs and A’levels) will ’take into account the problems caused by the pandemic’

25 replies

howonearthnow · 15/05/2023 07:09

I was under the impression that this year’s exam cohort were the first ones to go back to normal (as it had been pre pandemic) so surprised to hear this. What do they mean?

OP posts:
CrapBucket · 15/05/2023 07:13

I was surprised at that too, I think it is very poor reporting and not true in the slightest!

Shinyandnew1 · 15/05/2023 07:15

The BBC said something about some formulae being given eg in maths/physics and that the exams would be a bit more spaced apart than normal. I don’t think there’s much else in place in England!

00100001 · 15/05/2023 07:15

Surely it's just the usual moderation?

If the cohort got lower than expected, the results will be moderated. So instead of needing 70% for A, you'd get an A with 60%.

Happens every year

Didn't help that the grades were inflated when there were TAGs...

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 15/05/2023 07:16

You don’t think sitting A levels without having sat GCSEs is harder?

Valour · 15/05/2023 07:22

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 15/05/2023 07:16

You don’t think sitting A levels without having sat GCSEs is harder?

This! It's really hard for this year's cohort. GCSE is the time when a lot of pupils hone their studying skills, and they lost that opportunity. I'm reliably informed by people who work in education that they're having to do more lessons on exam techniques now, because pupils have missed out.

SusannaQ · 15/05/2023 07:27

Our school did bugger all during the pandemic, GCSE pupils were basically teaching themselves, no Zoom etc. So this year's A level students are missing a huge amount of foundation work. Local private schools had a full online curriculum, the usual gap between independant and state educated was even wider than normal.
We've been told there would be no leniency in this year's A levels.

Takoneko · 15/05/2023 07:29

They will take account other difficulties through norm referencing grades.
It’s likely that performance on these exams (in terms of marks achieved) will be significantly below what the 2019 cohort achieved because of the impact of the pandemic. Despite that, roughly the same number of students will get A*, A, B, 9, 8, 7 etc grades. Grade boundaries will be lower to account for the disruption.

What they can’t do in any meaningful way, and what makes the post-covid results less fair, is account for the unevenness in the impact of the pandemic. People who missed far more school, or who didn’t have chess to a computer for online learning, or who lived in home conditions that made studying near impossible get exactly the same allowance as those who had full access to online lessons, a quiet room with a desk, additional online tutoring and parents who encouraged them to study and made sure they had appropriate resources.

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 15/05/2023 07:31

Just looked this up on the BBC website and none of what they are discussing is news as such. The dates of the exams were known. The pinning to 2019 proportions of grades was known. The formula sheets were known about.

I worry that this reporting will make some students think there will be major changes, and I'm not sure that's very helpful.

cptartapp · 15/05/2023 07:33

This current year cohort 13 is the only year that was in the key school years between 10-13 when COVID kicked off, that are having no concessions made when it comes to A level exams. The previous three years rightly have, this year 13 should too, albeit not as drastic.
DS hadn't even finished his GCSE science syllabus when he began them at A level.
The last exams they sat were year 6 SATS. And they were the first poor sods to be faced with the new reformed version of those.

CrapBucket · 15/05/2023 07:34

Valour · 15/05/2023 07:22

This! It's really hard for this year's cohort. GCSE is the time when a lot of pupils hone their studying skills, and they lost that opportunity. I'm reliably informed by people who work in education that they're having to do more lessons on exam techniques now, because pupils have missed out.

Show quote history

I agree completely! I meant that the news is making it sound as though stuff is in place to compensate for the awful time Y13 has had, when in fact, there is nothing in place.

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 15/05/2023 07:35

Takoneko · 15/05/2023 07:29

They will take account other difficulties through norm referencing grades.
It’s likely that performance on these exams (in terms of marks achieved) will be significantly below what the 2019 cohort achieved because of the impact of the pandemic. Despite that, roughly the same number of students will get A*, A, B, 9, 8, 7 etc grades. Grade boundaries will be lower to account for the disruption.

What they can’t do in any meaningful way, and what makes the post-covid results less fair, is account for the unevenness in the impact of the pandemic. People who missed far more school, or who didn’t have chess to a computer for online learning, or who lived in home conditions that made studying near impossible get exactly the same allowance as those who had full access to online lessons, a quiet room with a desk, additional online tutoring and parents who encouraged them to study and made sure they had appropriate resources.

Tbf to some extent this is the same every year though.

The exams don't t take into account your teacher went off sick for months and the school couldn't hire a suitable replacement. They don't take into account that you broke your leg badly in y10 and missed weeks of school. They don't take into account that your parents took you out of school for 6 months and messed up your GCSE prep and so on.

They never take into account the people who have paid tutors and a quiet place to study Vs those who don't.

I do agree that covid made some of these differences more stark and hit some schools more than others (including last year) but it is normal that the exams don't take into account individual differences like this.

noblegiraffe · 15/05/2023 07:36

CrapBucket · 15/05/2023 07:34

I agree completely! I meant that the news is making it sound as though stuff is in place to compensate for the awful time Y13 has had, when in fact, there is nothing in place.

Show quote history

There is. They will get the same grade profile as a cohort as the 2019 cohort, despite being worse at their subjects. That's a pretty big concession.

Kazzyhoward · 15/05/2023 07:37

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 15/05/2023 07:16

You don’t think sitting A levels without having sat GCSEs is harder?

Same at Uni for students in final year who didn't sit their A levels and only did "online" exams in their first 2 years (20/21 and 21/22) which were a very different format. My son did a few "in person" exams last Summer (end year 2) but some of his flat mates didn't and they're now really struggling and stressed as exam season starts there today. DS feels well prepared as he did some last year (and did badly by his standards) so he knows what to expect. For a couple of his flatmates, the last exams they did in person were their GCSEs 5 years ago. The covid restrictions have screwed up so much.

It's entirely right that there's some leeway and adjustments made. Yes, we all know moderation (and other forms of grading boundary adjustments) are in place so that "the right" number of students get the pre-decided grades, but making the exam a bit easier too helps students reach their potential - a student who sees a "hard" paper may crash and burn and not even do all the bits they can whereas they may do very well on a paper that on first look appears do-able. A simpler paper is better for all to hit their top potential, even if the grade boundaries have to be higher to keep the right proportions in each level. No point at all making an exam paper harder than it needs to be to get the same end result.

Takoneko · 15/05/2023 08:00

Agree totally with @noblegiraffe. The norm-referencing against the 2019 grade profile is a significant concession. There is nothing to be gained from spreading the narrative that this year group are being disadvantaged. They aren’t. The usual number will pass even though they know less than pre-Covid cohorts. Going on about how unfair it all is just stresses the kids more. It’s as fair as it really can be.

fortyfifty · 15/05/2023 08:25

Having the GCSE exams spaces out more seems like a good concession. DD1 took them in 2019 and the timetable was brutal. Spanish in the morning, physics the same afternoon, English lit the next morning. I couldn't believe what we were doing to our 16 year olds. Even last year DD2s were a bit more spaced out, it made such a difference.

cptartapp · 15/05/2023 08:37

This cohort don't necessarily know less though. They've just had the pressure of having to learn more (if you include catch up material), in a shorter period of time.

noblegiraffe · 15/05/2023 08:52

This cohort don't necessarily know less though

It’s very unlikely that they will know as much as the 2019 cohort given both the impact of the pandemic (my Y11s cheerfully report having done nothing in Y9) and their national terrible attendance in Y11.

Just been on the news that grades for this year’s exams (GCSEs and A’levels) will ’take into account the problems caused by the pandemic’
CrapBucket · 15/05/2023 08:55

I see what you mean about knowing less and getting same grade as a 2019 student, thanks for explaining that (much better than the BBC did!)

Engineering is probably harder/affected differently then? It’s all a set of things they have to prove they know/can do, to get pass, merit, distinction etc. I can’t see how they can adjust anything there. It’s not an a level but it’s a level equivalent, seems like students who picked it would have been better doing an actual a level instead.

Kazzyhoward · 15/05/2023 10:47

Whether "Knowing less" matters will depend on the subject. If it's something like Maths or Science, then missing out a chunk of the syllabus will potentially damage further study and the student may have to catch up in their own time by self study. Not quite so detrimental if a particular topic is omitted from a humanity subject or a book omitted from Eng Lit.

TeenDivided · 15/05/2023 15:27

CrapBucket · 15/05/2023 08:55

I see what you mean about knowing less and getting same grade as a 2019 student, thanks for explaining that (much better than the BBC did!)

Engineering is probably harder/affected differently then? It’s all a set of things they have to prove they know/can do, to get pass, merit, distinction etc. I can’t see how they can adjust anything there. It’s not an a level but it’s a level equivalent, seems like students who picked it would have been better doing an actual a level instead.

If Engineering is a BTEC then the skills they need for the distinctions may be less well developed than in previous years so maybe similar to a skills based subject such as History?

I think it is the 'cumulative' subjects such as maths, sciences, MFL which might be more impacted still by the Covid years.

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 15/05/2023 17:53

CrapBucket · 15/05/2023 08:55

I see what you mean about knowing less and getting same grade as a 2019 student, thanks for explaining that (much better than the BBC did!)

Engineering is probably harder/affected differently then? It’s all a set of things they have to prove they know/can do, to get pass, merit, distinction etc. I can’t see how they can adjust anything there. It’s not an a level but it’s a level equivalent, seems like students who picked it would have been better doing an actual a level instead.

To be honest, I think most students will get a better grade out of a btec than an A-level. The chance to resub coursework and resit exams throughout the course is a big advantage.

2nd year btec students can also still access a "streamlined pass", which can be higher than a pass, if they've missed optional units due to absence.

SoTedious · 15/05/2023 19:37

In Wales this is recognised by a bit of advance information (but not much - more "areas to focus on but you should still revise the whole lot") - and by not going back to 2019 expectations, it's a halfway house this year between 2022 and 2019.

I don't really understand how this works because if everyone does badly, they would have fixed grade boundaries accordingly anyway. Maybe they are talking about the distribution curve of grades, so if 10% got an A in 2019 and 20% did in 2022 we will have 15% get an A this year. UMS adds a layer of pain when you are trying to understand wtf is going on.

LittleLegsKeepGoing · 15/05/2023 19:48

The teachers have been open with us about the level of leeway granted to this year's Yr11 cohort and GCSEs. There's general acknowledgement that missing huge chunks of yr10 because of lockdown rules (happened a lot in Wales) has affected the length of time the students have had to prepare. Especially in more practical subjects.

The leeway is pretty small though. In most subjects it's just giving a specific area of focus for a subject rather than maybe 3 or 4 potential areas of focus.

The marking will be the same, the grading will follow the same criteria.

I think it's the right level of intervention to be honest. I can't comment on the English system though. I don't know how badly your schools were affected by strict lockdowns once the original lockdown finished. The law in Wales was much stricter and longer in application.

That being said, I do feel for the yr13 children. Walking into A levels with virtually no exam experience can't be easy.

coronafiona · 15/05/2023 19:53

Good. It should be taken into account this year and next year as well. Strikes have also had an impact, it's not the kids fault.

CrapBucket · 16/05/2023 19:14

LittleLegsKeepGoing · 15/05/2023 19:48

The teachers have been open with us about the level of leeway granted to this year's Yr11 cohort and GCSEs. There's general acknowledgement that missing huge chunks of yr10 because of lockdown rules (happened a lot in Wales) has affected the length of time the students have had to prepare. Especially in more practical subjects.

The leeway is pretty small though. In most subjects it's just giving a specific area of focus for a subject rather than maybe 3 or 4 potential areas of focus.

The marking will be the same, the grading will follow the same criteria.

I think it's the right level of intervention to be honest. I can't comment on the English system though. I don't know how badly your schools were affected by strict lockdowns once the original lockdown finished. The law in Wales was much stricter and longer in application.

That being said, I do feel for the yr13 children. Walking into A levels with virtually no exam experience can't be easy.

My Y13 said today ‘I wonder what doing GCSEs is actually like’ in a kind of bemused/wondrous way - he’s doing A levels and his younger sibling is doing GCSES… so wierd. A lot of his GCSE results were from doing tests at home on his laptop with cameras on showing they weren’t Googling!!!

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