11+ tutoring and worries for DD with working memory issues

[Lizardlegs]

DD is in Y5 at a SW London prep school where they specially tell us not to tutor, that it won't help, etc however so many of her friends have tutors now! Some parents are open about it, others have asked the children not to say anything (obvs this doesn't work as the kids talk about it 🤪)

DD could definitely use some extra maths practice (esp as she has been diagnosed with working memory issues) but I don't know how I would find the right help and make sure the tutor teaches maths the same way they do at school.

It really feels like an arms race and it's making me sad and worried - I'm concerned that if I don't hothouse our lovely girl she won't get a place anywhere. She's had years of glowing reports about her effort and enthusiasm at school,but she is not a natural at taking tests. Her memory issues are enough to make maths and recall difficult, but as it's only one issue she probably won't quality for extra exam time.

She's had a wonderful experience at her prep school until now, and as I'm originally from another country I was very surprised when the kind, gentle atmosphere went hyper competitive in Y5. Hand-holding and any thoughts about tutoring etc very appreciated! We have an appointment with the SEN lead at school in a few weeks and hopefully will get some ideas from her, but I'd love to hear from parents who had a similar situation...

Go with the secondary suggestions your prep school makes, they know your dc and the surrounding secondaries. Make sure you have a couple of good back up schools that your dd will get an offer from. Across SW London there are secondary schools that cater for every academic level, it's a matter of being realistic and finding the right level for your dc. You can ask the SEN lead for suggestions.

SW London, girls and boys start tutoring via parents, grandparents or paid tutors from end of Year 4 unless 7+ which is earlier.
There are lots of tutors service but check it is not an issue of time. We found that our child didn’t get proper test timing and test techniques. So was dropping marks but not told how to practice to overcome this.
Does you child understand marking schemes and to move on and not get stuck on a question? Which part of maths is it fractions or areas etc so focus on these areas. Speed of timetable recall.
I would not take the your school secondary suggestion as the best source since if they gave glowing reports and only flag this at year 5 I wonder how on top of it they are and if they understand the London secondary schools entry. Check out schools open day, good school guide etc.
Also SEN, are they asking you to pay for this via their own referral?

Depends what you want the tutor for. If you get a dyslexia tutor, they'll be able to tutor her in study and exam skills that her school is unlikely to be able to teach her in, on the bespoke level her needs require.
Extra maths and English may confuse her if she has processing difficulties as kids like that tend to really get muddled if you give them too many methods. The best thing you can do is teach her exam techniques and do lots and lots of past papers. There's no shortcut when processing issues are a problem.

Find an app eg ixl.com that follows the national curriculum and uses the same teaching strategies.

If your DD has memory/processing issues there is no magic wand. Repetition, repetition, repetition is the only way. No one else can do it but her - so it’s a question of how much she herself wants to succeed.

You can push her gently and motivate her and help her when she’s stuck and provide access to relevant apps and videos that explain things in a processing-friendly way. So you’ll have to roll your sleeves up too. No teacher or tutor will ever care as much as you will.

But ultimately it’ll have to come from her and she needs to know this. And if she doesn’t want to be an academic high-flier it will be up to both of you to research other paths in life based on her strengths.

I speak from experience.

I wouldn’t tutor her at all. She’s at a good supportive school who should tell you which secondaries will suit her best. It would be madness to tutor her into a school that she isn’t suited to.

Hey OP I know this isn't about tutoring but exams aren't the be all and end all. My autistic DH never got beyond a C despite lots of tutoring, did a mostly coursework based degree at university and has a great career now.
PP will given ideas about tutoring but if she is not exam inclined don't despair...

@Lizardlegs I would get a tutor to assess your dd and give feedback. Do not stress out. Yes, there are many that get tutors from year 4, but its still possible to do well getting a tutor from end of year 5. I think a lot of parents either scare you with the talks of tutors or give you false hope with their too laid back approach. I believe in the middle ground. Make sure your dd is prepared, but do not prep like crazy. She should be keeping her normal activities, play dates etc.

It really doesn’t have to be an arms race. Have you settled on a good list of target schools? Depending on location you might well have a look at Sutton High, which has a lovely ethos and gets the best out of its girls, including those with dyslexia and processing/working memory issues, because it understands that doing things fast is not the most important thing in life!

I have a DD who was in a similar place with her learning in Y5 (albeit in the state sector). Her EP report showed a very “spiky” profile with particularly slow visual processing, and she does qualify for extra time. She is now in Y10 and at a lovely, supportive, not particularly selective school (not in SW London). She hasn’t needed tutoring and is on track for very decent GCSEs (projected grades 7-9 in 9 subjects) which will take her on to her next steps.

All of which has made me reflect on why we are so obsessed with doing things fast. Why do exams need to be so time-pressured? Why do we want children to push ahead of curriculum pace? Obviously for some children there is a need and hunger for a fast pace of learning, but for many others it is not right or necessary. Between Y5 and GCSEs in Y11 there is ample time to mature, develop, learn and have lots of fun along the way. If you get your destinations list right, you will find her the right school place which will suit her just as she is.

I absolutely guarantee you - out of the 2 SW/surrey preps told not to tutor - at least 80% of children were tutored. My eldest boy I had no idea until the all came out of the woodwork from the results of senior school - and giving recommendations of their tutors 😂 The girls school more transparent but still 80% are tutored at least one hour a week some 5/6 hrs minimum which are targeting ghs.

It's bonkers - don't trust people who aren't tutoring they probably are.

Competition is high - far too many children for spaces - good luck.

If everyone is being tutored you need to reach that level too .... madness. Creating a higher level to pass.

Thank you to everyone who has replied, it's much appreciated! For reference, our DD was diagnosed with her processing speed/working memory issues by an educational psychologist recommended by school after being informally assessed by my DH's colleague who is a dyslexia specialist.

My number one priority is for DD to keep being the happy, sparky person she is: she loves art, drama and music and is in two choirs and the school Orchestra. I'm not sure I want to put her through an 'arms race' scenario if it takes a toll on her MH and she ends up being at a secondary school where she struggles. I will probably wait until we've talked to the SEN advisor at school and then decide a way forward, but it's really useful to hear all of your perspectives.

@Lizardlegs , you should see which secondary schools offer the art, music and drama since not all gives the same opportunities to children. Ask for music programmes and see if extensive or only for those with grade 7 and above.
Tutor or extra worksheets at home shouldn’t be seen as an arm race just for 11+ it should be used as giving your DC a strong foundation for secondary schools. Maths is essential for other subjects such as biology, chemistry, physics. English for History, Geography etc. This would be a great time to assist your child so Year 7 is smooth process.

Make sure she has an EP report that is up to date as schools may allow her extra time

If you are SW London I would definitely take a look at SWPS in chertsey and st Catherine’s in twickenham. Both good schools, nurturing and good at getting the best out of each girl. I have friends with girls at both who have SEN and they are delighted . Also both schools strong In art and drama.
As PP says, listen to your school. The 11+ is difficult with a SEN child if you aren’t realistic about which schools are going to be interested in taking a SEN child , and really the aim is to find the right school for her.
And definitely tutor - everyone at our prep and our other local SW London preps was tutoring whether they admitted it or not ! we had a fabulous 11+ tutor who specialised in SEN for my eldest son and she was great.
good luck - be realistic about her school choices and it will be fine

Hi

Please can you PM the tutor recommendation? I've got a yr 4 sen child ASD who could do with a boost....

Thank you

Processing/working memory usually isn't a thing on its own. Is she dyslexic? Is ADHD a possibility?
DD had processing speed in the 3rd percentile and it really affected her maths. We had a tutor from year 4 and her school also gave her 1 to 1 coaching. It has made the world of difference to her confidence and she is now doing really well, We wont be targeting particularly tough schools at 11+ but we just wanted her to feel a bit more secure in her knowledge. She was completely lost in maths and that was affecting her cofidence everywhere else.

We knew that we didn't have time as a family to do the extra work needed (both work full time, DS with SEN too) but if you do have time, you dont need a tutor.

DD has to do maths in the holidays too. Just timestables on an app otherwise she simply forgets it all, It is tough, there are no shortcuts but it can be overcome.

I would also stress her other talents, in my DD's case that is drama and music and so we major on that stuff to give her a boost.

Thank you everyone for your responses, it's appreciated. I was at a school visit this morning and the head said this is the only system in the world that makes 10/11 year olds deal with exams! Also, it does seem bonkers that I may need to pay for a tutor on top of the already spendy school fees. Will still wait and see what school says re SEN: I know one of DD's friends (who also has SEN) has had tutoring arranged through school: I'd much rather be up front about it in the school environment.

There's lots of school systems where 10/11 year olds deal with exams. The schools are causing the vicious cycle. They only accept those who were very clearly tutored up to their eye balls. The 10 year olds with normal knowledge, who don't get tutored, don't get a place. Other parents hear about it and decide oh no, better tutor. It's interesting the heads are blaming the exams, when they themselves are fuelling the problem.

@Dodgeitornot Agree! Lots of overseas countries have exams or tests for 10/11 years old. Countries such as Korea, Singapore, USA etc have loads of exams and very transparent grading. I hope your Head is not saying this to make the situation better since it is not true.
I know London boys schools Heads that tracks kids since Year 3 with detailed guidance for parents at each stage. This manages expectations and also assisting more focus in specific areas with plenty of time for 11+ so it it not n intense rush.
Before Year 5, did your Head and teachers reports reflect a detailed picture for your review?

@Lizardlegs will u kindly pm me? I’d like to know which school is this ur referring to in such esteem, as I’m looking for my Dd in this area

SW London prep students without tutor defy belief