In Preparation for Appeal Panel Day

[Hye000]

So… like the title states… im attempting to mentally prepare myself for the day of the appeal. Im just wondering (& hoping im not the only one). Do you go in (Teams or face to face) with a written script maybe summarising what you have already said in your written appeal?? Is that what previous people have done?? Or do parents just wait for any questions posed to them from the presenting officer or panel and answer those. Are we expected to re-iterate what we already said… I just don’t know what’s expected and don’t want to end up being flustered if I’m expected to have a long speech prepared and end up in a tizz!!! 🫠 Send help!! 🤦🏽‍♀️

if any of this makes sense and anyone has experience or similar worries please

Thank you, useful points rather than some of the response I’ve been getting! I went to view the allocated school after allocation day and I questioned a lot of the things to compare to the preferred school and there were multiple things they did not have. The pastoral support are all also teaching staff unlike the preferred school who are on hand all day even during lessons for added support. They do not have a centre like the preferred school for those with additional needs. They have one dining facility that is one large room with one way in and one way out so she wouldn’t dare go in there when it’s full of kids she doesn’t know. The preferred school has a dining facility on each floor (3 floors) and they are open plan with no doors so she has better exposure to smells and having peer support she is more likely to eat. sadly this isn’t like most kids anxiety, the anxiety controls this eating disorder, most kids anxiety does not have the detrimental impact on them like this does on my daughter. My daughters anxiety takes away any ability to eat at all, she only eats 8 different foods, that’s it. I need to express to the panel the significant impact of the ED and anxiety isn’t like other kids. DD dietician feels strongly enough to attend the appeal (I didn’t ask her, she offered) so this should speak volumes.

We won our appeal, based on SEMH. We spoke about risk factors and balances of probabilities and how the risk factors to her of not attending this school were very significant (older brother had severe depression, school avoidance, and she had effectively been like a young carer, we showed research demonstrating her risk of similar SEMH was more than doubled compared to peers) whereas the risk factors to the school were (we argued) more minor - they had slightly over pan in every year, had a bulge class of 30 over pan in one year, and still get good GCSE grades, plus Ofsted reports didn't mention overcrowding, and the school chose to teach some low set classes in sets of 14-20, meaning high sets could be 31 or 32 at their own choice.

On the day I wrote out a statement and read it aloud. It took about 10 mins.

Out of interest
what are these extra curricular activities that you are going to raise in your appeal op?

This is very very useful! Thank you, sorry to be dumb… what’s SEMH stand for??

They have a trampoline on-site and use it as part of the PE lessons and also do gymnastics tournaments for extra curricular, my DD has competed in gymnastics since she was 3 years old and has competed Regionally. It is something that her dietician has recognised as being very good at increasing her appetite due to the volume of hours she practices, it is also something that will be beneficial for her transition as it’s an area she is confident in and see’s herself as an equal to her peers because it’s a place where her eating isn’t noticed. They also do other things that the allocated school doesn’t with regards to extra curricular

@AvaCallanach I googled SEMH sorry! did you give statistical figures included in your risk factors? I’m trying to show that like you, this isn’t an average child struggling with a transition and some anxiety. Those children will likely go on to do well at school and settle after a few weeks or months. DD is highly likely to deteriorate in her SEMH massively. The likelihood that she will struggle with the transition even if she wins her appeal is highly likely but will certainly have a lesser negative impact on her physical and mental health in comparison to her attending the allocated school

@Hye000 I've read the thread and am very glad that @prh47bridge and @PanelChair have corrected many of the errors.

One thing I would caution against is making any comparison to any needs that another child may have. You said upthread: "sadly this isn’t like most kids anxiety, the anxiety controls this eating disorder, most kids anxiety does not have the detrimental impact on them like this does on my daughter." Whilst I can understand the sentiment completely (I have a 2 children with EHCPs, both now in specialist education, and one with an ED that hospitalised her and still under a psychiatrist), it really isn't possible for you to know how other children are affected by anxiety, and the panel can't agree with you that 'most other kids won't be impacted by their anxiety' - anxiety is only anxiety if it has a detrimental impact.

However, you can argue this point just as successfully without comparing to other children. Just focus on the actual detriment it has on your DD.

Definitely don't read out your case. The panel will have read it already. In fact, when I sat on panels, we used to say "Is there anything that you'd like to say that isn't already covered in your appeal statement?" It's a perfect opportunity for you to share your concerns regarding rehospitalisation, the increase in anxiety that you've observed, etc.

@Lougle thank you very much for your input! I’m really grateful for positive advice that can help put DD’s case across in the best way possible. I will take that on board and definitely re-word the way I put across the case of anxiety as I want to make sure they are aware of the detriment being more complex and not being something they will necessarily get better over time. I don’t plan to re read my case as it’s about 5pages long! I’m going to make a few bullet points that emphasise the detriment and my main concerns

"I want to make sure they are aware of the detriment being more complex and not being something they will necessarily get better over time."

@Hye000 again, not to be picky, be careful with this. You could have a panel who take the view that if it won't get better over time, it doesn't matter which school she's in. You'd be better to approach it from an angle of "This is a complex disorder which is driven by anxiety. School A has the infrastructure to allow gradual exposure to the sensory input that food halls bring. School A also has areas that my child can go to if she can't cope with the food hall. School A has dedicated pastoral staff who can support my child during break times. My child will need consistent support to gradually build her resilience to the lunch time environment and school A are more equipped to support her."

@Lougle thank you, I think being in this situation and being so worried about the outcome my brain just isn’t able to careful word exactly what it is that I want to say and having the right impact so that they know I’m not just “laying it on thick”. This isn’t a case of her wanting this school, she genuinely needs this school and I’m so worried for her.

Just try to remember that the panel is neutral. They have no interest in preventing your DD from getting a place, just as they have no interest in awarding places without foundation. They just want to establish the facts and decide whether your DD's need for the place outweighs the school's detriment in having to take another child.

Have you considered applying for an Education Health and Care Needs Assessment?

@Lougle i do feel that she would benefit from an EHC plan but haven’t yet pursued it as she has been very fortunate in her primary school to have been well supported and it’s only been in the last two years that she received her diagnosis, we didn’t know what it was before then so she is in the early stages of treatment. I wish I had known years ago what I know now about this ED and I would have pushed for an EHCP sooner. I have also discussed with her dietician about an ASC assessment too. At the moment with the appeal and work and home life (I have just returned to work and uni following Mat leave), I cannot put 100% into pushing for those assessments as I don’t want to do the appeal half heartedly nor do I want to push for the assessments at a time when she is already under a long of strain with school allocation and SATS. But it’s something I will definitely be looking into this year

Yes we did include stats and a summary article with research references from a relevant website. So we weren't just saying "we think siblings of those with depression and anxiety are at risk", we had references that proved it.

This is the kind of thing we would have used (relevant screenshot and full article, with references)
https://anorexiafamily.com/meals-anxiety-school-eating-disorder/

Sorry, this isn't hugely relevant to your thread, but do be aware that NHS waiting times for ASC assessments in children are 2 years + in many areas of the country. Often there is no "pushing" that will get you up the waiting list, so it would be a good idea to get her on the waiting list ASAP.

This may sound like an exaggeration, but TBH you may need to get her on waiting lists now to get an assessment before she starts her GCSEs.

If she won't attend another school, I'd also suggest getting the school named on an ECHP for her- the longer you leave this, the longer she could be without a school she will attend if the appeal fails. Again, this is another thing that can take time to sort out.

I fully understand that you have a lot going on, but I would start the ball rolling on both of these ASAP.

Thank you, this article is really useful, I may even use it as it backs up a lot of the things I am worried about with the transition in general even if she gets the preferred school x

@Postapocalypticcowgirl thank you. I appreciate your advice and knowledge. I will contact the GP about the ASC assessment and speak to her dietician to ask her about the EHCP as like you say, there’s a long wait and I don’t want to wait until she is having problems at school before we get some support in place

Is that what you read out at the appeal? The article? Just wondering whether I should highlight the main parts and read them out and then summarise with a sentence saying something like “these are the main concerns for DD……..”

No we included articles of this type in our appeal submission "bundle" that the panel had before the meeting, and just referred to them in the thing I read out ("as indicated in the article submitted, the risks to DD are....")

Please don’t submit journal articles and the like. They’re really not helpful. The panel wants to see solid evidence of what your child needs, not a general discussion about children with eating disorders. The more you fill up the document bundle with journal articles, or the more time you spend at the hearing reading them out, the less space and time you have left for discussing the specifics of what your child needs from the preferred school and how they will be disadvantaged if they’re not admitted.

I dare say that parents who submitted articles have from time to time won appeals, but I very much doubt that the articles helped them do it. It’s more likely that they won because they had other, solid evidence of need, relevant and specific to their child.

I didn't read it out.

I will never know if it was helpful or not, as we never received a letter on reasons why our appeal was allowed from the panel. However we felt that it was important to back up our claim (that siblings of those with depression and anxiety are substantially more at risk themselves of depression and anxiety than the typical child) with some evidential trail. As described, I just said 'as the enclosed research shows, genetically, our child, as the sibling of a child with depression and anxiety, already has a two to three times greater chance of themselves developing depression and anxiety, plus....'

Respectfully, I do think that that backed up the claims I made more than me just making that claim.

I am thinking of several appeals I’ve been involved in, where parents have submitted journal articles, bits of journalism and the like. I stand by my view that they really don’t help, because they talk in a generalised way about children, not about the child whose appeal is being heard.

I agree with @PanelChair. The appeal panel wants to know specifically about your child's condition and how it affects them.

Statistics from journals don't help because they aren't specific. Don't include journals. Tbh @Hye000 I think you have a really good case and adding material such as journal articles will just dilute it.

You want your appeal document to be concise, with every bullet point adding to your case. It's about your child, not 'children with eating disorders'. Every child with an eating disorder is different. What matters is what your child needs.

I'll say upfront that I have very little knowledge in this area, but if this were me I'd be cautious about relying too heavily on the peer group as an argument, because to my mind that could theoretically come across as you expecting other children to be 'responsible' for supporting your daughter, which obviously isn't appropriate. Peer relationships change at secondary; there are no guarantees that her existing friendships will hold. I'd focus on the provision for additional needs and the dining arrangements, perhaps secondarily on the extra-curriculars.

Good luck.