Are these normal year 7 friendship problems?

[jaqueandjill]

This is a bit of an essay, I'm sorry. DD is in year 7 at an all girls school. For context, she is autistic - this may be relevant as I don't know whether the friendship problems she's been having are normal, or whether she is struggling with social communication and contributing to them. She has low support needs - she passed the 11 plus, travels to and from school independently and is very social - she likes having friends, is fun company and to my mind is a kind child.

When they started she quickly made a friend, I'll call her Jenny, that she spent break and lunch with everyday. There were no problems at all however Jenny was one of the few girls in the class who didn't have a phone, so DD couldn't chat with her outside of school. As the weeks went by DD was getting to know other people better and after the first half term, had drifted away from Jenny. I think this is probably fairly normal that the initial friends they make don't necessarily last - there was never a fallout between them and they get on still but not close.

By Xmas, DD now had a new best friend, Sarah. For the first couple of months all was great, we had her for tea etc and she seemed a lovely, polite girl and I was pleased for DD. Then DD started to get to know another girl from a different class, Anna. She pulled Anna into the fold so that they were now a threesome. Predictably, it didn't work. Sarah and Anna weren't as keen on each other as they were on DD and she started to feel pulled in different directions. Sarah started to get huffy with DD - we talked about this a lot, how Sarah was probably feeling pushed out and that it was good to have more than one friend but DD should make sure she makes time for them both.

Sarah wasn't happy though and started ignoring DD on and off and then was physically unkind. At this point DD felt she'd had enough - that she was entitled to have other friends - and decided to let the friendship with Sarah slide and concentrate on Anna.

Everything was great with Anna for a few weeks. Then, DD started to become friendly with another girl in her class, Claire. Just like before, she pulled Claire into the fold and it was a new threesome. I felt a bit wary of this but DD assured me Anna and Claire liked each other and all was good.

This lasted a couple of weeks until yesterday, when Anna got upset about something DD is adamant she didn't do, and told DD their friendship is over,

If you made it through all of that thank you! My question is, does this sound like normal year 7 friendship issues - maybe she's just encountered particularly possessive girls - or does it sound like DD is perhaps unintentionally making people feel left out or like they're being replaced? DD says she's entitled to have more than one friend which of course she is - I would prefer her to have several - but I wonder whether I could better support her.

Sounds normal to me and well done to your DD for making new friends. My DD is similar in that she is happy to welcome / include a new girl to make a group of 3. But unfortunately for her, the other two hit it off and she is left out! Has happened on a number of occasions. But it’s what it is. They are still navigating relationships. I listen to her when she is upset and sometimes I feel helpless and sad for her (recent birthday party that she wasn’t invited to - only girl in the wider friendship group not invited), but I stay out and try to give a neutral viewpoint.

Absolutely normal.

Well done to your dd for navigating this situation so well. Friendships, especially at this age are difficult. They fall in and fall out again.

I worked as a teacher in a girls' school for several years and had a tutor group from year 7. This all sounds totally normal. I couldn't keep up with their fallouts and make ups and felt I was comforting a different girl every lunchtime for a while. It settles down in year 9 in my experience.

Ah thank you, that's so reassuring. We never had any of this at primary because she had the same group of friends the whole way through and they never fell out. It's so hard to know what is typical and when she might need additional guidance.

Sounds very normal

I'm surprised others are saying this is normal. In my experience (DD now in Y11), most children are part of bigger friendship groups (say 5 or 6 girls/boys) in secondary school rather than these "best friend" type relationships with just one other child. We had issues with best friends and dysfunctional threesomes in Y3 or Y4 primary school but not at secondary school. I'm not saying your DD is doing anything wrong - she seems to be quite rightly saying it is fine to have more than just one friend - but she has been very unlucky (in my experience) to find 3 girls who all were so possessive and only wanted one friend.

urgh, totally normal. Still dealing with it in year 8. Luckily it’s my third and it does settle by the mid - end of year 9. It’s painful.

Totally normal, lots of swaps and changes and girls being very sensitive or grumpy. Hope it settles down soon...year 7 was worse than year 8 for us

I’d say perfectly normal. Some kids don’t want to be part of a larger group and prefer 1/2 close friends.
My DC are part of large friendship groups, but don’t have a ‘best friend’ as such. Other kids in the year have friendship groups of 2/3. But that only works if the ‘possessive’ friendship works for those involved. It’s horses for courses.
Often the groups of 2 and 3s do start to hang out with the bigger groups as time goes on, even if it’s not all the time.
Year 7 sees the shake up of old primary friendships and it can take a while to settle as everyone it trying to find their place.

@Nowfeeltheneedtopost I think you were quite lucky or had a very extroverted DD. Quite often the quiet and sensitive girls end up in 3s or 2s, not in the big groups. It often includes 2 from primary and 1 new one. 1 from primary and 1 new one get on, the 3rd doesn't. The 2 from primary were besties from nursery and it causes no end to arguments.
It's very normal and it sounds like OPs daughter is navigating this very well. A lot of girls with autism have really amazing empathy skills and are predictable so they attract quiet girls that often have issues with self esteem, so that can also be what's happening.
It doesn't really end until end of y9 sadly, although in my experience y7 and y9 tend to be the worst.

Can you talk to the form teacher? Or head of year? It's in their interest that the girls get on well and it's in their power to instil a culture of everyone's included. School could promote friendship groups that are bigger than 2 girls.

I went to an all girls school (about 15 years ago, for context) and this sounds very familiar. No idea if it's worse/better in all girls as obviously that was my only experience. It started slightly later for me, maybe year 8, then year 9 was dreadful as boyfriends started to creep in and that caused more drama, then year 10 it settled down again.

The best thing I did was walk away in year 9 when the drama got horrible, and make other friends. I ended up back with the original group in time, but things never felt as "end of the world" after that as I had plenty of other people I could spend time with.

I was in a group of 4 and the "pairs" were CONSTANTLY switching, led by the two more pushy girls deciding who was their best friend that week. All totally ridiculous looking back but she's doing the right thing in terms of making friends, not worrying too much about the minor things (I just went with it when pairs changed - I liked all of them after all!), and refusing to be controlled by anyone.

It doesn't sound like she's doing anything to cause or exacerbate the situations, which sounds like what you're concerned about. Obviously can only comment based on the info you've shared!

Very very normal. I wish you both luck 😁 it sounds like she is doing quite well really, it is all about learning how to navigate these situations.

Thank you for the replies, you've made me feel a lot better.

The latest friend I mentioned, Claire, has come over today because of the strike and it's nice to be able to see/hear DD interact with her - she's being her usual funny, uncomplicated self.

Normal with my ye8 and her mates since starting high

That's really patronising. No idea why you feel in a position to dismiss my DD's experience as "lucky" or because she was "very extroverted". Don't you think I might have acknowledged that if that was the case? Why does your experience trump mine? Your suggestion of these typical groups of two from primary and one from "new" bears no relation to my experience of my DD joining a secondary school with 240 in the year and taking from about 25 different primary schools. OP also made no reference to primary school friends in her post.

OP - as I said, your DD sounds as if she is navigating friendship situation well so you are clearly doing everything right in supporting her.

@Nowfeeltheneedtopost Not sure why you're jumping at my throat. How am I being patronising exactly? What experience am I dismissing? I never even mentioned my DDs experience, not sure what I'm meant to be trumping. This is just what I noticed working in schools and it aligns with 99% of the other posts. You never said anything negative about your DDs secondary school experience in your post. If she had a drama free 5 years than yes, she was lucky. I'm slightly confused by your angry response tbh.

Yes DD definitely prefers interaction with one or two others rather than in a larger group - she finds it easier I think. It's her birthday coming up and we were suggesting things she could do if she invited a few people (there are other girls she gets on with in class that she could conceivably invite to something) but she said she would hate it and would rather just have somebody for a sleepover.

I think it's fairly normal, but the common denominator in all this is your DD. Whilst she is entitled to have friends of her choice, she does sound a bit 'easy come easy go' and maybe is bruising her friends a little without meaning to.
I think it's not unusual in yr 7 but if she keeps having a new bestie every few weeks it's more likely to be her choices rather than general social milieu - I hope that makes sense? I'm not judging her, just saying she's maybe more of a social butterfly. A couple of my DD's friends were more like this in years 7/8 and had lots of 'friends'but only really settled into a fairly static group from yr9 (and still friends now in yr11)

Yes that makes sense and is what I'm worried about really. On the one hand I know that in year 7 they are getting to know each other and figure out who suits them best (this is a school where they have come from dozens of different primaries, so most of them have started knowing a couple of others at most) but on the other hand I worry that perhaps she's a bit fickle without meaning to be.

Tbh most Y7s are fickle and it doesn't sound like she's excluding the other girls for the new ones, just that the integration isn't going so well. She may not be picking up on queues where one is being mean etc so may not realise why they don't like each other. Eg Sarah was being a bitch to Jenny but your DD may not have noticed and Jenny took offence that your DD was still hanging out with someone that was being mean to her.
The other thing to be mindful of is that ND kids tend to attract other ND kids. Very often we would see one of two issues with girls with ASD. They were either quite possessive and struggled with changes in the group dynamic, or they were oblivious to someone being hurt in their group unless it was broken down to them. It's very possible your DD is friends with girls like this who just need a bit of support.
Communication with girls is so nuances and complex, a lot of girls with ASD struggle with this, however COVID has meant lots of NT girls do as well. Does your DDs school run any friendship groups? My DDs school ran a friendship Lego club especially for ASD girls, it was ran by a SALT and they taught them how to navigate situations like this. I know other schools around us are doing this for all kids now, as their social skills have been massively effected by lockdowns.

Sounds familiar to DD's experience (year 7, all girls' school). DD was like Jenny from your story (but with a phone, just old style dumb brick phone). DD's former bestie from the first term has now moved on to her fifth or sixth bestie, I think.

DD herself is fine, thankfully, she was slightly upset for a day or two maybe, but made new friends quickly and has moved on to a larger friend group where the network is bit more stable than one-to-one friendship. She is on friendly terms with her first bestie too, though wouldn't invite her in birthday party apparently.

But the former-bestie has inadvertently caused some hurt later on in the chain. One of the girls she was very close to for a short while felt hurt and abandoned and didn't accept easily when her friend moved on. This has caused much drama and heartache in the year group and it's still an ongoing issue in the world of year 7s there.

It's probably worth discussing with your DD the hurt she may cause unintentionally if the pattern continues for another two years before everything settles down as other posters mention.

@Dodgeitornot interestingly I have wondered about ND in both Sarah and Anna. I really don't want to make armchair diagnoses but when I've met Sarah there's been some traits I thought were quite familiar. Would be undiagnosed though if anything as DD shared that she was autistic but Sarah didn't share similar. Anna has fidget toys in class and a 6th form peer mentor apparently so there's quite possibly something there too.

I'm not sure about friendship clubs - there's a million different lunch clubs, I'll have to take a look. I'm also going to ask DD whether she thinks a peer mentor for herself could be helpful.

Dd is in Scottish equivalent of Y7 and omfg it is constant bloody drama or she said this and she said that and this person doesn't like that person anymore. It drives me insane. Some of the girls seem to be very possessive - eg Dd was at a party at the weekend with us as I'm friends with the dad. Their daughter is in dd's friend group and the children and parents of a few others in that group were there too (because the PARENTS are also friendly). Quite a few weren't there from the group because don't know parents etc and one girl in particular has taken offence at this and been unkind all week leading up to it.

@anonuser89 good to hear your DD has found her group. I didn't like the thought of the Jenny situation - there was no drama but DD moved on all of a sudden really. I think Jenny was ok though, she had other friends alongside DD and she's stayed with them.
To be fair though apart from that, she's just wanted to be friends with 2 at once rather than leaving one for the next.