School Appeals advice

[OxenZB]

Hi, so I got my son’s high school choice today and it was our 2nd choice and I want some advice on appealing this. The first choice school is about the same distances but works better with my working pattern and travel time when dropping older child off too, means I’m not running about in circles. The first choice school also supplies every pupil with a laptop with will massive help my son with his writing and spelling and other educational support. He will not get this equipment at his given school. I can drop my son at the door to our first choice and I can not at the given school. Everyday he says he hates school and has a belly ache and then poops, I help him with this by offering reassurance and cuddles at the gate, which I’m sure will change at high school as it will do nothing for his street cred! Lol. His attendance is pretty much 100% because of my assurance and if I’m not at least dropping him in a school car park, he may struggle. His probably borderline autistic/dyslexic (primary school said high risk for dyslexic) but never followed up and recently I was told I had to take him to the GP to be diagnosed. His very bright and isn’t stupid at all, his issue is only putting it on paper…

Also my daughters school has earlier and late finishes that mean I have to wait for over an hour on two days of the week if he goes to the school his been given. However the school his been given is next door to my daughters, one’s a girls school and ones a boys school. You would think based on distance it would be better or finish at the same times, but it doesn’t. I don’t have any issue with the school his been given.

I prefer mixed sexed schools and not same but my daughter is happy. However the first choice school is also on my way to work and I won’t have to hang about waiting and no finishing early or lates to worry about.

It’s mainly the laptop support that swung this school for me.

I have accepted the given school as I would rather him go here than any other school, I have added him to the waitlist to our first choice school and I need to work on the worded to get how I’m feeling across.

I would be so grateful for any help or advice, thanks in advance. And thanks for reading to the bottom too… x x

Unfortunately you can only appeal the plane if you believe the authority hasn't followed its admissions criteria and has refused your child a place at a school in error - essentially, that you know there are children who have been offered a place who came further down the admissions policy list than your child.

That’s not right for secondary admissions. I’m sure one of the admissions experts will be along shortly.

I’m no expert but none of that sounds like a grounds for appeal , if you do go down the appeal route don’t go on about convenience for you dropping off / collecting etc as it’s not relevant and detracts from the actual reasons .

Some of the excellent mumsnetters who have more knowledge will I'm sure be along soon.

You've done the right thing in accepting your 2nd choice place and putting your ds on the waiting list for your 1st choice school.

Secondary admissions work differently to primary in that at appeal, you only have to show that the benefit to your ds being accepted at school 1 outweighs the detriment to the other pupils of having one too many children in class. Your focus should be on what school 1 can offer that your child needs nothing about how school 2 isn't as good etc

Your ease of dropping your children off at school won't be taken into account.

As others have said, this advice is wrong. This is the case for infant class size appeals, but for secondary school appeals you need to prove that the detriment to your child in not attending the school is greater than the school's detriment in accepting an extra pupil. This doesn't necessarily mean that there has been an error in applying the admissions criteria.

That is not correct.

One ground for appeal would be maladministration, if there was an error, but there are other grounds for appeal.

OP, you would need to show that the detriment to him not attending is greater than the detriment to the school of taking another child.

Transport issues are largely irrelevant - a secondary child would generally be expected to get themselves to school. If the journey is over 3 miles, they should be eligible for free transport, though that is normally a bus pass.

The laptop isn't really relevant either - that is something you could supply, if you felt it would be helpful. Without a diagnosis, it will be hard to argue anything about his needs based on the possible dyslexia/autism.

Are there any subjects or clubs that the school offer that suit his needs? Say chess club, if he is a whizz at chess?

As above, you need to demonstrate greater prejudice to your son of him not attending the first choice school than there would be to the school of admitting an extra pupil.

Your difficulties in getting him there will not be relevant. His learning and medical needs will only be relevant if this first choice school is for some reason the only one that could meet his needs, which sounds unlikely.

You have mainly derailed your needs for your ds gaining entry to the school. Many parents will be I. Similar situations and relying on childminders and after school clubs or having to change working patterns.

You need to appeal on the grounds that your son would be more disadvantaged by going to the given school than gaining access to first choice school as additional number (added on above offered spaces)

Disregard the advice from Milkand2sugarsplease, which is only true for infant class size appeals.

You haven’t so far mentioned anything which sounds like a winning argument for an appeal. The panel will expect nearly all year 7 pupils to be able to get themselves to school. If your child has medical or social needs which mean you have to escort them, the panel will expect to see evidence from (say) their paediatrician confirming that.

You need to make the appeal about what your child needs, not what you as a parent want. Are there other things about the preferred school which make it more suitable for your child and better able to meet their needs?

Hi all, thanks for everyone’s replies, much appreciated.

I live on a country lane and no buses or even a foot path, not safe for a child to walk. I understand this isn’t my first priority though. I would move if I could.

My first reason is his educational needs, his always been behide and he struggles with going to school daily. His current school help support that, his not stupid or thick he just needs help in communicating what’s in his head to paper. I think people are quick to label these days and taking him to the GP for a diagnoses sets the wrong impression. If it was more serious case then i
my opinion would differ but we all have to follow our mummy instincts. (That’s my outlook and not base on anyone’s comments on here)

By him going to this school he will get the patience and support he needs along with the laptop which will help him be independent and learn, his writing is very bad and this will remove a barrier for him. It’s not that he can’t do it, he just needs support in helping him do it. By going to the given school I worry he will not get this support and he will be labelled a naughty child, as such.

There are many after school clubs that interest him here too.

I work for NHS, changing hours isn’t an option, I can’t afford laptop and his given school would not allow him to take one regardless if I could supply. Can’t afford childcare either. Earn just enough not to get child credits and we live quite modestly, don’t smoke or have monthly subscriptions or spend any money unless on things we need or do as a family, birthdays, Xmas etc…

You appeal on the basis of your son’s needs and this particular school as set out above, and you take your chances with the panel. If you can gather supporting evidence from his primary school about the additional support they’ve given him, that will help. Whether it’s enough to swing a panel is hard to say - I’ve seen all sorts get through and all sorts be turned away!

Regardless of the appeal, it sounds like you should push for a diagnosis. If he has an EHCP, then one thing it might well include is being able to use a laptop.

If you want to use the laptop as a reason for appeal you'll need to evidence why this is.

If he needs a laptop, have you got evidence from a relevant professional stating this? Also if there is an evidenced need, does your LA supply them? (I know that in the past my LA did that - don't know if all did, or if they still do) You need to find this out because there's no point in mentioning a laptop in the appeal if laptops can be supplied to all who need them anyhow.

As there is no safe walking route, your DC will be eligible for school transport, irrespective of distance, so that isn't going to be an appeal winning argument either.

Have you got evidence of the type of support your DS needs? Parental assertion will not count for much unless supported by a suitable professional, and which includes what types of support are required. Once you have that, you can start building a case on those points - eg appealed for school has nurture groups (or other specified interventions) which particularly benefit your DS and current offered school does not.

I think you should ask to speak to the SENCO of school #2 about the difficulties your son is having currently, and explore how they would be able to support him.
You say is he being supported at his primary school - what does that support look like? Arrangements that are in place at primary should be transferred to secondary as part of their transition. Even if use of a laptop is not standard at the school, there will almost always be exceptions for those with e.g. hypermobility / dyspraxia / processing difficulties who will be much more able to achieve their potential with access to a computer.

His challenges are not at all uncommon - and despite your comment about “too quick to label”, actually a diagnosis (especially if that leads to an EHCP) is what helps get that proper support in place. He needs don’t go away because he isn’t “labelled”.

Unfortunately in your case I think getting him some kind of diagnosis would help as you saying these things are not as powerful an argument as a Dr having documented them and having an actual diagnosis as the people hearing the appeals will know that people will stretch the truth etc to back up their appeal .

It would help your appeal if you could provide evidence of the support your child currently receives at primary school, confirmation from the offered school that they could not provide the same or similar (and would not provide a laptop) and confirmation from the preferred school that they could provide it, including a laptop. Email exchanges with the Sencos would be enough here.

Also highlight the after school clubs he wants to join. If they connect to things he already does (say, he plays a minority sport and this is the only school that offers it), so much the better.

Advice needed. I have had an appeal for my son mid year transfer to attend a secondary school 0.4 miles from our home on medical and social grounds. Lots of evidence supplied but didn’t feel listened to at all. Never the less I was told I would receive the outcome within 5 school days via email. We are now on day 8 and nothing. I emailed the clerk who emailed back saying … We are waiting for the letters to get checked and analysed, to make sure all information is accurate.
I am not sure how long this will take.

I find this very stressful but without being negative I presume this means it has been dismissed and they are ensuring they have written it all accurately so I can’t challenge? Anyone had any experience in this sort of response?

@Schoolmum12

When was the appeal? It must have been right at the start of term - has school really been back 8 full school days post appeal as of end Friday?

The code says 5 school days, as you were told, but can go over with "good reason". Possibly it being the immediate start of term has meant something has been delayed, but it's not acceptable if it has been 8 full school days already. I would try call on Monday and make the point that you need to know asap for uniform etc.

A full decision letter either way needs to explain the reasoning for the decision, it won't be just a yes or no (unless you were told specifically you would get a short holding letter with the decision asap, my LA do that).

The appeal was last Monday but the whole process for mid year transfer started in June went to the governors first based on medical and social they rejected it so went to appeal panel submitted in July but ran over school holiday period so appeal wasn’t held until Monday 4 September. I was told 5 school days which should have been by Monday 11 but didn’t hear anything I emailed yesterday no response and again today to which I received the response above. Such an anxious time waiting to hear your child’s fate! I just wondered if them taking so long and saying the data was been checked and analysed what that actually means as I thought the panel take evidence make a decision and you receive an outcome with the reasons what would they need to check other than the evidence which surely they have done?

Possibly waiting for the chair of the panel to review the letter to make sure they are happy with what the clerk has written. I can't think of anything else that should be going on.