1 waitlist offer for London Indie 11+, any positive stories?

[berry1212]

Hi,

My DD is on a waitlist for 1 school, got firm 'nos' from two other London independent secondary schools and a scholarship for our back up school (which is fairly easy to get into). Was anyone in this position in the last few years and got offered a waitlist place?

Looking for some positive vibes and reassurance. It's a middle tier school academically and our first choice.

I feel like we could have helped her prep more. Our approach was light tutoring (twice a month = 2 hours tutor time), practice exam papers in between + atom. She started prep 5 months before the exams. We also decided not to tell her how much work to do per week or sit with her to go through questions (she would troubleshoot incorrect answers with online videos or during her tutor time). This was intentional so she could take ownership as well as come out of the other end of exam prep with some useful study skills for secondary school. I am now questioning if we did her a disservice with the highly competitive nature of secondary school applications in London!

We are going to be doing this again for our younger daughter in a few years so would also love tips on how others balanced a sensible amount of prep with getting firm offers for children who are academically in the middle. It feels like children who are either over-tutored or naturally at the top academically get the firm offers - what happens to everyone else?!

@berry1212 , you don't need to line up tutors but you do need to be realistic about the "rigour" of a mid tier academic private secondary in London. Your dd is on the WL so they do believe she is at the level to gain a place but once she is there the ultimate aim is to get a great set of GCSE's at the end of 5 years. All schools put pupils on paths to achieve this and there is a fair amount of repetition and spoon feeding due to the way GCSE's are structured.

Also if you get the WL place you need to fill in the paperwork and make the deposit often within hours of getting the offer so you must be certain in your mind

@redrobin75 she would do well at the school. I just wouldn’t want to put her in a place where everyone around her is being heavily tutored to keep up.

I guess at this stage I am also trying to understand how I could approach the 11+ process better next time.

I understand what you mean about rigour - I have personal experience having attended a top school as a child who was academically in the middle. We were all spoon fed super well to achieve high results in our CSYS / advanced highers (scottish system). But there wasn’t much extra tutoring - I had a chemistry tutor a few months prior to an exam once. Have things changed or are schools relying on home tutoring as well?

i actually think the rigour benefits the academically middle children the most. I certainly wouldn’t have done as well without this privilege!

@berry1212 , you don't need to tutor during secondary but I would move your younger dd to a prep school or an all through school during KS2 so you don't end up in this situation again. The good news for your younger dd is that the birth rate is falling and due to the move out of London many prep schools aren't full so there should be a reduced number of dc chasing places in 4 years time (the possibly of VAT on fees will also be clearer then).

@berry1212 please don’t think like that - your DD is on The wait list because she has met the standard & your wait list school still thinks she will thrive there . I know countless kids who got in on wait list who then smashed it at the WL school ( my DD included ) . Don’t forget those who have been to prep schools ( esp the really pushy ones) might have prepped to within an inch of their lives . Your DD still made the standard without doing that . Once the playing field is levelled and they all get the same teaching there is every chance she could fly . To illustrate my point DD was at state school ( so not prep ) - the 11+ paper she didn’t do quite so well in was maths- 7 years later she has just started at Oxbridge doing a very maths heavy degree ( and she wasn’t the only waitlister !) . The schools will cover everything you need to know. I really don’t think tutoring is necessary - at the offer school she made the grade , and at WL school she missed it a bit . She will be fine whatever you choose .

@NYE2023 lovely to hear that about your daughter. Maths can become so much more interesting at secondary school level too. I am very pro more women in stem as someone who has made their career out of that path too.

@redrobin75 i will have to think about the younger ones schooling (I have a son in reception too). Their school gets some kids who join from pushy preps to recover so it makes me a little wary. But different things work for different kids and families. I want them to be happy learning which they are and excited about school, which they are too. An all through school is a very appealing idea atm! :)

Really? A child at an alternative education ethos school who has had minimal tutoring, but has succeeded against children who have gone through extensive prep and years of tutoring, would need extra support to catch up with the students who succeeded due to high level of input?

@Shelefttheweb She hasn't succeeded against other children....she got rejected from all her schools bar one where she was waitlisted. The school place they are holding is for a nonselective school.

She got waitlisted - are you suggesting all applicants got waitlisted?

I don’t think every applicant would be waitlisted - that would mean close to a thousand for some schools.

I agree with the other posters - call admissions and tell them it is your first choice and you would accept it as soon as it is offered! Definitely a birth rate boom this year and also people hold on to multiple places until the last minute and don't always let schools know they just let the deadline lapse- the waitlists are usually small, my DS got an confirmed offer and a waitlist offer and I emailed the waitlist offer and advised we had accepted the confirmed (first choice) offer, so there is movement this way too.

If you identify any gaps I would start a little help in y4, this is what i did 2nd time round... DS1 we started 11+ prep in the start of y5, tutor identified a gap in maths so I had to do a lot of work with him to fill this and do the 11+ prep... with DS2 I started English tutoring in y4 as i knew he needed help with this, I then increased tutoring to include maths in y5, his term time and weekly tutoring sessions were relatively short 30-40 mins and he did some work most days to prepare including atom learning and past papers. You always feel you could have done a little more but they are kids and 11+ is tough on them.

They were at state not preps I should add

Schools massively over offer. My dd's school had to put an extra class in as more accepted than they were anticipating. They can't do that every year though. Anecdotally in my MC area many more are going private post the covid shit show.

@LIZS yes same, extra year 7 hardly took any at year 9.

Last year my son was WL at 2 schools. He didn't get offers from either. Luckily he had a firm offer from our first choice (traditionally the hardest to get into). Such a lottery.

I appreciate the realism, encouragement and tips. Starting some prep at the of year 4 / beginning of year 5 is what I will aim for next time.

I found our tutor extremely helpful as she had years of exam prep experience so could help us identify what to work on and set our expectations (she told us that our approach is light!) - my daughter didn't do much English prep as she is years ahead for her age and both her school and tutor recognised this, so all the focus was on maths. I think getting the tutor earlier would have been a good idea!

@heldup it does feel like a bit of a lottery and that's why I started to think we should have applied to a few more schools this time.

I've emailed the school and will follow up with a call next week

@berry1212 I personally would call this week rather than next week . If a place comes up they will need to decide who they are going to offer it too ( sometimes they even make multiple offers for the same waitlist place ). I think one can convey far more passion in a phone call than in an email . If you want that place then I would call. Others will have called and some prep schools also call on behalf of their pupils to make their case .

different schools seem to do waitlists differently - some put most candidates on the waitlist even in the knowledge that some will be so far down they might as well have got a straight no . some have a very small waitlist that they know will be enough for their needs. By speaking to the school you will get a much better steer on where DD are. They will also likely tell you something like Eg - a candidate on this position of the waitlist in last year , past few years etc would or would not get a place . They will tell you more than you will get in an email . At this point you just need to tell them you are very keen for a place ( if that’s what you and your DD want ). I am certain for my DD it was me calling that swung it ( actually it was my second call - the first time was on offers day when I asked for feedback and indication of where on the list DD was ).

@berry1212 are you able to say where your offers are at and where the waitlist is?
a few people on here have been on these boards for a number of years (three for me) and might be able to give you more specific insight as to which lists have moved in the past and/or whether you should accept the two you have?

We are on WL for all the schools we applied: GHS/G&L/LEH. Any thoughts would be much appreciated.

Call them tomorrow!

Wait lists are not equal in all schools - some schools put all/large numbers on the waitlist, some have a strict ranking some will tell you most won’t, others never plan to go to waitlist and if under by a few they find they fill up over time eg a family with 3 or so 4 girls moving from abroad.

My advice find a backup school (use head of your prep school for advice it’s in their interest your kid goes to a good school) if you don’t have one, if you have a prep school head they can be much more effective in gaining a waitlist place than a parent calling admissions. Last of all call at the start of the autumn term sometimes children just don’t turn up on the first day of term. Be prepared to move fast - deposits, uniform etc.

Good luck but be realistic and make sure your kids don’t feel like they have failed.

@Taptap2 , great points. Kindly note not all head of prep are that proactive or able to do this. We did 13+ and secondary schools feedback included head of preps they used to dealing with and our school not listed. We noted the difference in responses time and information flow..or lack off from our head.

I've been meaning to update that my DD got the waitlist offer for her preferred school a week ago, with a scholarship! Apparently she was at the top of the waitlist with a scholarship offer attached. What a long few months... thanks for all the encouragement on here and hope everyone got their places too.

Congratulations!! I'm glad to hear that.