Sixth form interviews - only students they want for external applicants?

[Shinyredbicycle]

That sounds like a daft question, but does anyone know how sixth forms organise their interviews?

If children are predicted grades that are within the range they ask for, but aren't stellar, do they stand a chance of being interviewed/being given a conditional offer?

My dd didn't get her SATS results, moved school in Y10 so her predicted grades are a bit of a random computer algorithm mish-mash. She moved schools because of severe, unmanaged bullying, and hasn't applied to sixth forms where these girls might be going.

So she's limited her sixth form choices, and unless she gets interviews won't have one to go to.

TIA

Different schools and colleges will have different processes. I do admissions for a large sixth form of a popular state school and we don't interview applicants. We do give out far more conditional offers than we have places as we will offer places to nearly all applicants whose predicted grades are high enough, knowing that some will not achieve those and others will choose to go elsewhere. There is always lots of moving around and changing minds on results day. Even on results day we often end up enrolling students who weren't initially offered a place but exceeded their predictions.

Thanks. Dd found out this evening that her friend, who went to an international school and has already done some GCSEs and has very high predictions, has been offered an interview, so I'm panicking a bit.

The prospectus says that they may interview regarding course choices, so I don't know if it's that. Or whether if they don't offer an interview, they're not taking your application any further sort of thing, like a job.

I can't believe we're in this situation - a bright kid who's never put a foot wrong at school may not have a sixth form to go to.

What do people do in these circumstances?

She stopped going to school for a month at the beginning of Y10 and, with ups an downs, she's done well.

You’d really need to ask the school because each one is so different. But if they say they interview on course choices it’s likely to be that, and if the student is international it could be related to that too - checking they fully understand the UK quals they’re doing etc

Different schools have different procedures but generally if you are in an area with 6th form colleges there are spaces for everyone but most will go to the colleges if their own school doesn't have a sixth form. My dd only applied in the July as she changed her mind what course she wanted to do (and thus which college) it wasn't a problem. Others apply after they receive GCSEs because they are better than predicted

Thanks both, that's very reassuring. This whole process has already been so stressful, I just want her to get a conditional offer for this school which I think will suit her so that she knows what she needs to work for and hopefully move on from all the shit of the last few years.

DD did a 6th form meeting tonight and the head of 6th form actually mentioned that it is illegal for a state school to interview applicants.

They do however have 15 min guidance meetings on A level choices/ predicted grades/mock results etc to see if the DC are making sensible choices.

My DD is applying for 6th forms, and is nearly 17 in Y 11, having repeated Y10 after spending 13 months in a Camhs inpatient unit suffering from anorexia and other MH issues. She currently attends a special provision school with no 6th form. Her predicted grades are not stellar but meet the requirements for 6th form and she has been offered interviews/ guidance sessions at all of the schools she applied for and has one offer already. So I wouldn’t worry- we were really unsure if my DD would be accepted anywhere and it is looking as though she will be ok.

Is it a state school or private? State schools with sixth forms have to follow the National Admissions Code, but Sixth Form Colleges and private schools don't.

If they do have to follow the code then they should be giving conditional offers to all applicants, without interview. All internal applicants who meet the minimum grades are entitled to a place, but external applicants who meet the grades will also be subject to oversubscription criteria (e.g. on distance). This means that external applicants with conditional offers to oversubscribed schools aren't guaranteed a place, even if they meet the grades, because it depends who turns up on registration day and whether they're higher priority than you.

It's state. Thank you - that's very reassuring. I can't find the info about how they organise over-subscription.

Do LAs publish a 'how places were offered' document for sixth forms like they do for primary and secondary, does anyone know?

It's heartbreaking that she absolutely refuses to apply to local, decent sixth forms because the girls involved in the bullying might be there. I can understand it, but I hate the fact that she's the one limiting her options while the bullies continue to whatever they want.

You can also appeal at sixth form, if not offered a place. I think you'd have a fairly strong case.

Thanks - I did wonder about appeals.

one of the schools DD applied for straight out said interviewing applicants for a state school was illegal. They might have a chat /guidance meeting about subject combinations but none of the 3 she has applied to do interviews.

I think you are stressing about this too much.

Yes, I am, I agree, and I do now understand that about state schools and interviews. As I've said on my other thread, I think nearly two years of supporting dd through unmanaged bullying, school refusal, anxiety and PTSD type symptoms when she started the process of applying for sixth forms is catching up with me.

Dd has always been one of those children who is very intense and demanding at home although an angel in school, and I honestly never thought that I'd had any serious problems with her regarding school.

The news that her friend has received a conditional offer has reignited her anxiety and mine (which I'm obviously hiding from dd, hence writing long posts on MN!).

Try not to worry. It could just be down to what the school's processes are. But just to be sure, I would, personally, just email the school and ask, politely, where your DD's application is in the process.

I do admissions for a state Sixth Form. We interview all external applicants - generally after they have their mock results - so we can chat through their subject choices and predicted results. This is twofold...one (and mostly) for the benefit of the students - to ensure they are choosing subjects their mocks suggest would be a good fit (ie not saying they want to do further maths when max they will get is a 5) /to make sure they have a good mix of subjects/getting them to think about it etc. We do not decide on offers based on either the application form, or the interview, if they are a yes or a no - that is down to results in August.

In addition it is a bit of a "test" of their commitment to the school. Have they just shoved in an application with no intention of joining - in which case they are unlikely to turn up to the interview. This gives us a clearer idea of likely class sizes in Sept (we get 300 applications for 150 places). If all of the chemistry applicants turn up for an interview, yes, we should plan for 2 chemistry classes. If only 60% do...we should probably be timetabling for 1 class, not 2.
I also send out conditional offers. Ours go out before the interview to be honest. And timing wise - it is just admin based. I tend to send them every week/couple of weeks, depending on how many new applicants I have. So way more in Nov/Dec as I have loads of applications each week. Less frequently at the moment.

And to be honest, a conditional offer means (pretty much) nothing. All it is saying is if you meet the entry requirements on results day and that course is running/has space...we will offer you a firm place. If someone applied a few weeks before your daughter - they may have got their letter a few weeks earlier.

As to what to do about a Sixth Form place come Sept? To be safe:

1. Make sure she focuses on her GCSEs. Get the results and more doors are open to her.
2. Apply for several places. It is OK to have her favourite - but make sure you have a back up/Plan B now, just in case. And make one of these a Plan C just in case Aug is a "shit, GCSE results are bombed....I can still get in here to do this course." She may not want this ideally - but if she gets bad results at least this will be mitigated by not having to work out Plan C on results day.
3. On/immediately after results day you can always phone around/email around schools she would like to go to to see if they have spaces.
4. It is still worth doing this in the first week or two of Sept as well as there is a fair bit of movement still during the first fortnight.
5. You say she is not applying for where the bullies are going...how does she know they are going there? Maybe apply for her old/bullies school too...she doesn't have to accept a place...but if, say, the worst 2 bullies bomb their GSCEs and don't go there, would it be an option? Are the bullies her only reason for not going?

Thank you BrowniesnotBlondies - I am focusing on number one on your list.

Dd's whole thing about not going where the children involved in bullying will be going hasn't been particularly rational - it's been fuelled by anxiety. I was encouraging 'just in case' applications to keep her options open, went to open evenings with her etc, but every point of contact (eg the school asking for a reference, predicted grades, inviting to interview etc) was incredibly traumatic for her and she just disengaged.

It's been really difficult tbh.

Can you do the "Let's just apply, if you have a Plan B, you won't need it" kind of psychology. "Plan B interview will be really good practice."

Unless the place is 99% guaranteed (which it sounds like it isn't if it is oversubscribed/she is external) then I would say she needs a Plan B. Hopefully she will not need it. But it will make the build up to results day much easier.

BrowniesnotBlondies believe me, I have tried that until I am blue in the face. We've had months of it.

Does this mean she's quite far away from the sixth form?

Oversubscription criteria will usually use distance- so it could be an issue. If you contact the school/college, they will be able to explain though.

If they're oversubscribed, they will need to wait until after the closing date to make offers.

Do be aware you can appeal for admissions, but not subject choices- so if they let her in on appeal, but her A-level choices were "full", she might be offered alternative courses.

Interviews aren't part of the admissions process- but they can be a chance to chat through unusual A-level combinations or perhaps advise applicants if their A-level choices don't look to be a good match for their predicted grades.

Sixth forms are allowed to be selective, too. Is there a plan B if she doesn't get the right grades?

Are there no other sixth forms out of area that she might consider?

Would she consider an apprenticeship etc as a plan B?

No, we're not far from this sixth form but it's not one of the sixth forms that children around here usually apply for.

The over-subscription criteria is about whether they need to fill places in particular subjects rather than distance or exams results.

I just went for a walk with her and she's in decent spirits, so that's good.

Sorry, I'm not quite clear what you're saying about the oversubscription criteria.

Basically- the only way she can be refused a place is if the sixth form is full beyond the number of students they can accommodate. Obviously places available on courses will be taken to account BUT eventually there are criteria that come into place which have to be fair/consistent across all students.

If this doesn't apply, then they have to offer a conditional offer, and there's nothing to worry about.

It's a strange oversubscription criteria. Talk of random allocation and children being offered places on the basis of available places in particular subjects etc. A school governor who kindly looked at it on another post reckons it might be unlawful, which is a whole other issue.

I was encouraging her to do the sensible thing of submitting applications to a range of schools so that she'd have options, but she was in such a state that she just battened down the hatches and refused to.

She was saying earlier that perhaps this hadn't been the best idea and at some point she's going to have to make some sort of decision, but the months of stress and anxiety have taken their toll on both of us and the thought of months more to come feels a bit overwhelming tbh.

Thanks for posting. It has helped me to get it out on MN.

OP, I feel for you, we were in a not dissimilar position a year ago with DD1, to the point that it was far from clear that she would actually take her GCSES.

She chose which sixth form she wanted to go to, it wouldn't have been my choice but it works for her and she is much better in herself.

Thanks teelizzy. I'm glad that your dd has come through it all.

Dd has been in a much better place for the last couple of days. I'm just focusing on getting her through her exams.