ADVICE please GCSE languages!!

[bishbashbosh78]

DD is soon to pick GCSE options for languages and will need to choose to drop a language. Pretty sure she will stick with German but then has either Latin or French to choose from.

She enjoys Latin and French equally and very similar (high grade). She generally has a good memory for vocabulary; not sure that has any bearing on which would be the best choice and which would be harder to achieve highly in for GCSE?

if She’s good at the vocab learning, it depends on how much she likes them. Tell her to toss a coin - heads For latin, tails for French.

then see if she’s disappointed in the outcome…

Thanks. Just wondered whether there were some advantages having e.g. German/Latin or German/French in terms of cross over, grammar etc.

And is there a lot more 'content' in one than the other?

Not much crossover between Latin and German

Nor in French and German

The crossover is between French and Latin 😁

For GCSE I'd go with the best teacher. So whoever is much lived/gets great results/engages the kids... is the language I'd choose

If you enjoy language learning, the actual teacher is more important than the language, as all languages are fun to learn

In your shoes, I'd prefer French to Latin as it is a living language you can watch movies, songs etc. Latin maybe only if she wants to do law if medicine

Hmm I would go for French if she genuinely has no preference. Living language, you can go and visit places and speak French.

How is she on speaking OP? I am not familiar with the content of GCSE Latin (! tho I did do the O Level) but obv speaking will not be a factor, and it is 25% of the GCSE in French. But if she hates it then I guess Latin would be the shout. I loved Latin O level but I do think French has more immediate relevance today (I did French and German as well btw).

There is not much crossover between those options; as @HowDoYouOwnDisorder says, it's more Latin and French. The crossover there IS, is with the GCSE exams, which for French and German are identical in terms of structure and pretty similar in terms of content and topics. SO that is a win actually - if you know that for GCSE German you need to include three opinions and reasons in your speaking, well, hey! that's true for French too.

I did Latin French and German, and I've now got a child doing all three as well, and I disagree slightly about crossover. In terms of word derivation there's much more crossover between Latin and French, but Latin and German have lots of grammatical similarities (eg three genders and the whole concept of word order, and case endings), so I actually think they make a really symbiotic pair. DS definitely sees Latin and German as the more intrinsically similar (and finds them both significantly easier than French, because of the way his mind works rather than because they're actually easier).

I think it depends more on what you think your daughter's likely to want to do later. If you think she's more of a linguist, then I'd definitely choose French, so she's got the option of a combined MFL degree. If she's more history/humanities, then I'd go for Latin, as it has more of that aspect (esp if you have the option of Latin and/or Class Civ for A level). If she's a STEM girl (or you just don't know), then just go with whichever she fancies - they're both great options.

DS did Latin and German at GCSE. He could have done Spanish or French but he wasn't a 'flowery' (his word) languages person at all so didn't much enjoy a year of Spanish in Y9 and didn't investigate French having done a bit at primary school, whereas Latin and German totally suited the way his mind works. He is now in his second year of a MFL degree.

French and German keeps more options open. Latin is useful for Latin and Ancient History. Joint MFL degree with two languages you have studied to A level is easier than the second one being ab initio. French and German puts you on par with the Swiss! So advantageous.

Thanks, all. Great advice.

DS did all three. I think he enjoyed Latin more than French- there literature component is quite significant and he really enjoyed translating and analysing proper texts (they did Virgil and Tacitus).

The content and purpose of MFL vs ancient languages is different. Whilst both have a goal of learning vocabulary and understand a foreign tongue, MFL focus on the practical use of everyday language whereas with Latin there is more on ancient literature, values and society through the study of original texts.

DS did German and Latin, and is now doing a MFL degree. He is thinking of going in to MFL teaching and is now kicking himself he doesn't have French which is a requirement for most MFL PGCE courses, but at GCSE level he was thinking of doing a History degree and only decided on MFL after GCSEs. You can never cover all eventualities so she might as well do what she likes best.

If you do Latin, there is no oral. Does she have a view on that part of a language exam?

French is by far the most useful so I would suggest she definitely chooses that. If she is thinking of studying languages at university it would be best to do French and German. I did Latin and haven't found it that useful but if she can do that as well than it is a skill that few people have these days. It depends if she has space for it on the timetable. My two had to do 10 GCSEs to do two languages and I wouldn't recommend doing more than that.

@mimbleandlittlemy he can take French ab initio at lots of unis. Tho Spanish would also be useful

What languages is he doing? Sheffield will take you with German and Spanish, or with one of the two plus Russian, Chinese, Japanese, or Urdu.

Grammar wise German and Latin works better together. French is obviously a living language and more interesting for day-to-day life with holidays and maybe work.

I would query the teachers what is covered in the lessons and also, what opportunities are for trips. DD definitely lacked the joys of hearing the language during an exchange as Covid meant they never got the opportunity. She did Spanish but for various reasons we didn't manage a trip to Spain for our holiday.
And as someone who is bi-lingual in English/German she knows how different it is to be in an envrionment to hear the language instead of just having lessons.

She had Latin for a term as an extra lesson and enjoyed the logic of it and the relation to ancient history, something she enjoys anyway.

@mimbleandlittlemy sorry I misread - thought your ds was thinking of an MFL degree, not doing one now!

Still tho, when i trained, most MFLers on the course only had one good language and then another that they were rapidly mugging up. I had degree in one and A Level in another and was easily the best on the course at my second language.

I did all 3! (I did Latin GCSE with my A levels). Latin is great as it really helps English (advanced vocab has so many Latin roots.. good for writing, journalism, law etc) and Latin is a good complement to History. Personally I would choose it as it is more 'different' to German and therefore helps more other subjects. But if your DD really loves speaking languages then it's not the best choice.

@bishbashbosh78 It is far easier to do a MFL degree if you have two MFL A levels. You need the GCSEs first to do this. Latin is a side show for MFL. It doesn’t matter which MFLs you do. German A level is not popular and universities are keen to have students who study German. DD did two MFL A levels snd the same two at uni. It’s a means to an end. It’s a case of getting a job eventually. So the actual MFLs don’t really matter.