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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

Original poster

National GCSE Performance data now published!

30 replies

demimore · 20/10/2022 10:08

You can look up your school's 2022 GCSE results and see how they compare with others in your area and nationally here: www.gov.uk/school-performance-tables

(Though it keeps crashing - lots of people trying to do the same!) 🙂

OP posts:
PuttingDownRoots · 20/10/2022 13:36

Thanks. My DDs school had said they had had their best results ever and it looks like they are outperforming other local schools.

Original poster
demimore · 20/10/2022 15:34

PuttingDownRoots · 20/10/2022 13:36

Thanks. My DDs school had said they had had their best results ever and it looks like they are outperforming other local schools.

Yep, lots of schools got their "best results ever" this year, at least partly because the results were pegged halfway between 2019 results and the inflated 2021 Teacher Assessed Grades (TAGs). So it's good to see how different schools' results compare with each other, and nationally.

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Sazzlesw2 · 20/10/2022 17:08

Thanks, confirms that we are putting the schools in the right order for us.

Original poster
demimore · 21/10/2022 05:09

Interesting the data release didn't generate much news coverage. There are articles in Schools Week and FE News but not much else. Normally it makes some mainstream headlines. Of course, all eyes were on Downing Street yesterday, not the DfE! The DfE are downplaying the release, because comparing schools post-pandemic is sensitive. They've renamed the website from "Compare Schools" to "Find and check performance", and you can now only check schools individually rather than being given a ranked list.

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LouisCatorze · 21/10/2022 17:31

I noticed that the Ofsted status of some schools hasn't been updated (tut tut to whoever is in charge of the website). It's good in a way that they've included the 'caveat' about not comparing schools, as the variation in 'teaching provision' across schools during the first and indeed second lockdown (when they were in Year 10) was considerable.

Original poster
demimore · 21/10/2022 21:11

For anyone good with spreadsheets you can actually download all the national or local authority data from here and then rank it to your heart's content.

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Muchtoomuchtodo · 21/10/2022 21:17

Only for English schools obviously as education is a devolved matter

PalindromemordnilaP · 21/10/2022 23:29

It's annoying that you no longer seem to be able to create a 'my schools' list.

Surely if a school has worse results than another, due to providing inadequate provision during the pandemic when compared to other schools of a similar pupil makeup, that's reasonable to compare?

Original poster
demimore · 22/10/2022 07:11

Muchtoomuchtodo · 21/10/2022 21:17

Only for English schools obviously as education is a devolved matter

Yes, my links are to the performance stats for England. There are equivalent school performance websites for Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, but I don't know if they have 2022 data yet.

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CrapBucket · 22/10/2022 07:18

I hate performance tables. Most important issue for me is - is how is the kids mental and physical health, secondly - how likely are they to get whatever they need to do the next level of education? (Which is never going to be that they need 10 grade 9s)

Original poster
demimore · 22/10/2022 08:15

CrapBucket · 22/10/2022 07:18

I hate performance tables. Most important issue for me is - is how is the kids mental and physical health, secondly - how likely are they to get whatever they need to do the next level of education? (Which is never going to be that they need 10 grade 9s)

Arguably, the most important GCSE measure is Progress 8, because it shows how schools are adding value. The tables have lots of other measures in them though There isn't one for mental health, but there is one for attendance, which may tell you something.

In my kids' school there is a big focus on wellbeing, because they know children can only learn at their best if they're happy.

OP posts:
Original poster
demimore · 22/10/2022 08:17

The performance tables also show destinations of school leavers.

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LouisCatorze · 22/10/2022 08:38

Surely if a school has worse results than another, due to providing inadequate provision during the pandemic when compared to other schools of a similar pupil makeup, that's reasonable to compare? Not sure that would necessarily work. DD was at an Ofsted (recent) 'outstanding school'. Provision for teaching/learning was terrible during the first lockdown (granted it did pick up in the second one). Meanwhile the neighbouring school with a 'good' but generally more highly regarded locally was doing online teaching from the off.

I don't think you can assume anything (without knowing first-hand) re which schools did well by their young people and which performed less well during the lockdowns.

Original poster
demimore · 22/10/2022 13:38

LouisCatorze · 22/10/2022 08:38

Surely if a school has worse results than another, due to providing inadequate provision during the pandemic when compared to other schools of a similar pupil makeup, that's reasonable to compare? Not sure that would necessarily work. DD was at an Ofsted (recent) 'outstanding school'. Provision for teaching/learning was terrible during the first lockdown (granted it did pick up in the second one). Meanwhile the neighbouring school with a 'good' but generally more highly regarded locally was doing online teaching from the off.

I don't think you can assume anything (without knowing first-hand) re which schools did well by their young people and which performed less well during the lockdowns.

Have you compared the results of the two schools? If your observations are correct then the 'Good' school should have a better 2022 Progress 8 score than the 'Outstanding' School. And that shouldn't be a surprise, because since 2021, Ofsted grades are no longer correlated to performance data. Now they are based on things like curriculum quality, staff & student wellbeing, and safeguarding - i.e. the things that many parents (like @CrapBucket above) prefer. It will take a while for all schools to be re-graded under the new Ofsted framework, but many schools that were previously RI or Outstanding are being regraded as Good. (The proportion of Outstanding schools is being deliberately reduced, to make sure they are worthy of the literal meaning of the label).

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Boomboom22 · 22/10/2022 13:40

Thanks for this. My top two are very similar but 1st choice has better p8 scores and better ofsted. 2nd is much easier to get to. And 1st involves pick up from station or a walk across fields which isn't great. Argh!

PuttingDownRoots · 22/10/2022 13:51

Boomboom22 · 22/10/2022 13:40

Thanks for this. My top two are very similar but 1st choice has better p8 scores and better ofsted. 2nd is much easier to get to. And 1st involves pick up from station or a walk across fields which isn't great. Argh!

How much better? If P8 scores are positive I personally wouldn't discount the easier to get to school on that basis. The school we decided against was -0.4 and the school we chose was + 0.7. We didn't chose based on that though, it just confirmed we have hopefully made a good choice (as shes in Yr7 now and likes it!)

TheColorIndigo · 22/10/2022 14:15

Progress 8 also depends on how much parents invest in their child's learning. My friend's daughter was pictured on their website as having the best progress 8 score in her school a few years ago - she had tutors in four subjects.

Original poster
demimore · 22/10/2022 14:38

TheColorIndigo · 22/10/2022 14:15

Progress 8 also depends on how much parents invest in their child's learning. My friend's daughter was pictured on their website as having the best progress 8 score in her school a few years ago - she had tutors in four subjects.

There may be a grain of truth in that, but very few families can afford 4 tutors so that example is probably an outlier.

Parents do need to take lots of different things into account when choosing schools, but so do teachers. I think its worth trying to look at a school from the perspective of an excellent teacher, in a subject with shortages of teachers (maths, sciences, languages, music, etc) who could choose to work almost anywhere, and think "Would I want to work there?".

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PatChaunceysFruitCake · 22/10/2022 16:37

Arghhhh. This data became available the day after we submitted our application. 😬

Our first choice school has produced data exactly as we'd expected with a p8 score of +0.56. It's out of catchment though. We'd have got a place in any one of the last five years but the catchment is shrinking year on year and it was tight last year.

Our (well, DD chose it as 2nd choice) is our catchment school. We felt it was improving following a move from RI to good and a new head who seems full of enthusiasm. Really disappointed to see a P8 score of -0.27.

The third choice school has a P8 of +0.3. DD liked it but it's tricky to get to and it's 50/50 whether we'd get a place.

The LA website says we can email and change the preference order before deadline of 31.10.22. Feel really conflicted because DD is happy with the order we've selected.

I don't know whether to leave it as it is and rely on hoping she gets a place at the first choice and putting appeal points together in case she doesn't. Equally, if she does get allocated the second choice perhaps I should remember I did feel it was improving rapidly and the children in year 11 had only benefited from one year with the new head.

Grateful for any thoughts.

Middledazedted · 22/10/2022 16:42

Progress 8 ans attendance is meaningless without local knowledge. Attendance at a school can be influenced by all sorts of elements from a local traveller population to accept wave of managed move students. It’s more useful for statistically similar schools but we are a long way from all schools sharing similar profiles.

Middledazedted · 22/10/2022 16:46

PatChaucey… I would go by how you felt the school was first and foremost. My two nearest are very different. One is +.2 and the other -3. The first has great attendance and the second doesn’t. This is for local reasons that won’t change. Look at how well pupils with good attendance do and they outperform the first school. It’s also more inclusive with more SEN pupils and better pastoral care so easily, in my opinion, a better school.

uk2020 · 22/10/2022 16:48

demimore · 22/10/2022 08:15

Arguably, the most important GCSE measure is Progress 8, because it shows how schools are adding value. The tables have lots of other measures in them though There isn't one for mental health, but there is one for attendance, which may tell you something.

In my kids' school there is a big focus on wellbeing, because they know children can only learn at their best if they're happy.

Show quote history

I think P8 is an important number but I was not sure if it is the most important. If a school takes in a ton of underperforming pupils with however OK potential, it should be very easy for the school to "add value".

PatChaunceysFruitCake · 22/10/2022 16:59

Middledazedted · 22/10/2022 16:46

PatChaucey… I would go by how you felt the school was first and foremost. My two nearest are very different. One is +.2 and the other -3. The first has great attendance and the second doesn’t. This is for local reasons that won’t change. Look at how well pupils with good attendance do and they outperform the first school. It’s also more inclusive with more SEN pupils and better pastoral care so easily, in my opinion, a better school.

I think you're probably right and we should leave things as they are. Hopefully we will get our first choice anyway.

I just wish the scores were closer so I didn't have this doubt in my mind and could focus on the fact we were happy with #2 when we looked round. We also know lots of people who have children there and are happy with it.

Original poster
demimore · 23/10/2022 18:36

PatChaunceysFruitCake · 22/10/2022 16:37

Arghhhh. This data became available the day after we submitted our application. 😬

Our first choice school has produced data exactly as we'd expected with a p8 score of +0.56. It's out of catchment though. We'd have got a place in any one of the last five years but the catchment is shrinking year on year and it was tight last year.

Our (well, DD chose it as 2nd choice) is our catchment school. We felt it was improving following a move from RI to good and a new head who seems full of enthusiasm. Really disappointed to see a P8 score of -0.27.

The third choice school has a P8 of +0.3. DD liked it but it's tricky to get to and it's 50/50 whether we'd get a place.

The LA website says we can email and change the preference order before deadline of 31.10.22. Feel really conflicted because DD is happy with the order we've selected.

I don't know whether to leave it as it is and rely on hoping she gets a place at the first choice and putting appeal points together in case she doesn't. Equally, if she does get allocated the second choice perhaps I should remember I did feel it was improving rapidly and the children in year 11 had only benefited from one year with the new head.

Grateful for any thoughts.

When did your second choice school get their Good rating? If it was 2021+ then the grading isn't correlated to results. I don't think the major changes to the inspection framework have been communicated well to parents.The inspection handbook is here: www.gov.uk/government/publications/school-inspection-handbook-eif/school-inspection-handbook

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PatChaunceysFruitCake · 23/10/2022 19:52

@demimore, it was summer 2022 so would have been assessed under the new framework. In all fairness, it wasn't just Ofsted that made us feel the second choice is an improving school. There have been a number of other changes which seem sensible.