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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

Original poster

My D has been denied an automatic transition from junior to senior

84 replies

bird77 · 01/02/2022 22:35

Hello, I was wondering if anyone can help. My D has been asked to leave the junior school where she only joined in Year 5 after an initial assessment.The school now thinks her grades are not high enough for their senior.She is devastated-we all are -and I don't know if simply accept the school's decision or to fight for her place.Did anyone have a similar experience?

OP posts:
AngelicaElizaAndPeggy · 02/02/2022 12:44

So, your daughter was bright enough to get in and has since dipped?
I'd be asking serious questions of the teaching and support she's had so far, especially since you've been paying for it.

This really annoys me about private schools - they claim to get outstanding results but no wonder when they only retain the ones who are pretty much guaranteed to get good results! 🙄

Your poor daughter. It sounds like a horrible place and you're probs best out of it.

HasaDigaEebowai · 02/02/2022 12:51

The problem is that lots of kids are tutored to get in but then the tutoring stops and they really struggle to keep up. At my dcs school children are asked to leave fairly regularly if they can’t keep up. Ds2 struggles a bit because he has some specific learning disabilities and it’s so tough on him being towards the bottom in everything. If he was at a non selective school it would have been way better for his confidence levels because there would have been a greater spread of abilities. With hindsight it wasn’t the best choice for him but he’s been there since age 4 (now doing GCSEs). If the school say it’s the wrong environment for her it probably is and so the best thing to do is just focus efforts on finding a new school.

Original poster
bird77 · 02/02/2022 13:27

@Peanutgurgle thank you.The headteacher apologized to me but she does not want to change the outcome.My D finished Year 5 making good progress being on national average.We were not told initially by the school that they want all the students to be significantly above national average.

OP posts:
Clymene · 02/02/2022 13:30

[quote bird77]@Peanutgurgle thank you.The headteacher apologized to me but she does not want to change the outcome.My D finished Year 5 making good progress being on national average.We were not told initially by the school that they want all the students to be significantly above national average.[/quote]
God what an absolutely dreadful situation to put you in. I'd be furious and insist they find your DD somewhere else now your options have been narrowed considerably

LIZS · 02/02/2022 13:34

I think it is the timing which is the real issue. As it is now too late for assessments at other senior schools unless they make an exception - will current head assist in negotiating this? Presumably any offer of a transfer place depended on the standard of the external candidates but you should have been advised earlier if she was borderline. Is she even waitlisted?

LIZS · 02/02/2022 13:35

I think it is the timing which is the real issue. As it is now too late for assessments at alternative senior schools unless they make an exception - will current head assist in negotiating this? Presumably any offer of a transfer place depended on the standard of the external candidates but you should have been advised earlier if she was borderline. Is she even waitlisted?

Methren · 02/02/2022 14:05

That is really shabby behaviour by the school.

While they are perfectly within their rights to make transfer to the senior school conditional on achieving a certain academic standard, common decency would dictate that they should have communicated this decision to you at the end of Year 5, so that you had a chance to consider alternative options for Year 7 in plenty of time.

Telling you at this point in Year 6, when state secondary school application deadlines are long past and most private senior schools are in the final stages of their admissions process and about to make offers, is incredibly cavalier.

@bird77, in your shoes I would consider applying to co-ed prep schools which finish in Year 8. Many co-ed preps lose most of their girls at the end of Year 6 and so have spaces for new joiners. A good prep will help you explore other options for senior school - there are still schools which run 13+ admissions in Year 7 or Year 8.

Another option would be to wait until the dust has settled from 11+ offers and then contact schools you think might be a good fit to see whether they have any unfilled places or if your DD could be assessed as a late applicant.

Difficult though it is at the moment, I suspect in the long run your current school has done you a favour - your DD is better off out of there if this is the way they treat pupils in need of some extra support.

Mummy195 · 02/02/2022 14:06

[quote bird77]@Peanutgurgle thank you.The headteacher apologized to me but she does not want to change the outcome.My D finished Year 5 making good progress being on national average.We were not told initially by the school that they want all the students to be significantly above national average.[/quote]
So many things here.

When you say she cannot go on to the senior school, is that in y7 or y9? Most schools consider 13+ as the Senior school.

Are you in London or somewhere you can say, so people can come up with suggestions? I presume it's co-ed?

You say your DS is devastated, is that her being embarrassed or she really liked the school? Was the school keeping you up to date with her progress, they seem to have made their conclusions quickly. Did she come in from state or a prep? If state, she may just have adjustment issues, if prep, can you take her back there till the 13+ stage.

If she is in yr 6, they did leave it till late and should advise you where to go from here. It's just too late now to apply for 11+, results are coming out soon (though for non selective, she has options). For 13+ she should still have time for day schools.

I would not want to keep her at this school. Good luck for you and your DD.

x

pikapikapukachu · 02/02/2022 19:12

Have the school left you in a position where your daughter will be without a year 7 school place now? If so, I'd be furious and would be trying to get some come back from the school. Of course they're within their rights to ask your daughter to leave as she doesn't meet their standards for senior school, but surely there has to be a process in place to prevent this situation??

HomeHomeInTheRange · 02/02/2022 19:17

I bet they had a place they needed to fill and needed to keep their income up, because presumably Yr5 isn’t a major admissions point?

AnnaMagnani · 02/02/2022 19:18

If the school says it is for the best for her to leave, believe them.

I went to a selective private secondary that allowed all their primary girls automatic entry to the secondary. It was very very obvious that most of them were not of the same ability as those of us who had come in by the secondary entrance exam.

It led to a pretty horrible school experience for them of struggling to keep up in a school all about academics and all of them coming to the conclusion they were 'thick'. When in reality they were perfectly bright but just in the wrong school.

BrieAndChilli · 02/02/2022 20:03

It’s the not telling you until this point! It might be worth speaking to the council about putting in a late application. The problem will be that you will be allocated a place after all the on time ones have been processed. Unless you have applied as a back up already?!

Mandofan · 02/02/2022 20:15

To be honest you should have gotten her a tutor if they told you the terms and you knew she was below the national average. The timing sucks though

Luna9 · 02/02/2022 20:18

I wouldn’t be very impressed with this school. Happy to take the fees for 2 years when they knew from the beginning your dd is not up to their academic standards. And letting you know this late in the state school application process; once they knew they can fill up the places with more academic children.

No way I would like my child to be in a place like this.

Your daughter will be better off in a state school with a more diverse and not selective academic intake.

Hope you find a school where she will be happy.

Scaffoldhell · 02/02/2022 21:26

Absolutely appalling! No school should have taken a student in year 5 that they weren’t confident of giving a secondary place to - that’s half the reason people join in year 5! I would put in a complaint to the ISA - they should have told you this in September 2021 so you could apply to other schools. I wouldn’t want my daughter there after their behaviour but a complaint to stop them
Doing it to someone else is well worth it. Also a formal complaint to the school governors - check your contract as well. Ours says we would be told at the end of year 5 if there was no secondary place so they may be in breach . Either way push the head now to find your daughter a place by pulling in their contacts.
Would you mindn PM’ing me the name of school if you are In London

RedskyThisNight · 02/02/2022 22:00

@Mandofan

To be honest you should have gotten her a tutor if they told you the terms and you knew she was below the national average. The timing sucks though
So OP should pay for private school AND pay for a tutor? That's bonkers.
HSHorror · 02/02/2022 22:37

I left under similar situation. Imo though as the youngest in the year you cant really tell at 11+ as its heavy on English, I was better at maths and science.
However if it's a selective school then sorry but it's pretty obvious its going to be well above national average.
Im not even sure my dc would get in and they are 2 years ahead.

AlexanderArnold · 02/02/2022 22:48

Yr 5 entry is wildly competitive at our super selective private. Lots of parents leave it until then to move from state, and there are usually only one or two places.

Not moving up can be about academics, but it can also be about other things. If it's the type of school that expects everyone to be involved in events - matches, plays, concerts etc - and she's not keen it just won't be a good fit.

That said, they made a mistake accepting her for one reason or another, and they need to pull out the stops now to find her an alternative if you have missed the usual deadlines.

Mandofan · 02/02/2022 23:01

@RedskyThisNight yes if she’s serious about her child remaining in the school. She knew her daughter’s abilities and what would happen if she lagged behind. She did nothing and this is the result. I imagine her daughter is devastated. Many parents pay for tutors whilst their kids are in private education

massiveblob · 02/02/2022 23:32

[quote bird77]@Peanutgurgle thank you.The headteacher apologized to me but she does not want to change the outcome.My D finished Year 5 making good progress being on national average.We were not told initially by the school that they want all the students to be significantly above national average.[/quote]
But parents are paying £££ to be way above average. Bail.
Embrace state schools maybe which give a great all round education in life too

massiveblob · 02/02/2022 23:36

@bird77

Yes it is a private school.Doesn't have the reputation to be that academic either.To be honest, I don't really want to stay there and yes my fear is she will struggle in the senior school but I don't know if in the state school she will do any better.
If a not very academic private is saying she isn't cutting the grade then they obviously aren't going to take your money as they don't think she'll improve their grades. But she's only young and so much can change. Save your cash
RedskyThisNight · 03/02/2022 07:49

[quote Mandofan]@RedskyThisNight yes if she’s serious about her child remaining in the school. She knew her daughter’s abilities and what would happen if she lagged behind. She did nothing and this is the result. I imagine her daughter is devastated. Many parents pay for tutors whilst their kids are in private education[/quote]
There's something very wrong with paying for private education (presumably because you think it is better) and then paying for more education on top so that your child can access the supposedly better private education ...

itsgettingweird · 03/02/2022 08:02

@Mandofan

To be honest you should have gotten her a tutor if they told you the terms and you knew she was below the national average. The timing sucks though
Seriously? She's paying already for a private education. It shouldn't require tutors.

The thing is with selective schools - as you pointed out - is that they want all students above national average. Not all pupils will be (hence the clue in average!). Some students won't ever be tutors or not.

Have you asked the HT about any other private schools they would recommend as a better fit for D? They should have some ideas.
The other option is to go state and use the money to fund tutors for maths and English. Just remember this can help improve grades but pupils can still only achieve what they can achieve academically - however hard they work.

annaseal · 03/02/2022 08:09

@bird77 hopefully you have already started looking for alternatives. Best of luck to you and your DD. I hope something good will work out

Quitelikeacatslife · 03/02/2022 08:10

You'd be best off taking their advice, there is a lots of academic pressure in a selective private school, my son can absorb it no problem but my daughter would have hated that and she has thrived at state. Have a look round and find the right school.