Independent secondaries In Herts.

[Milly717]

Hello,

Hope I could hear some opinions on the independent secondaries in Herts. We live in St. Albans and so far visited St. Columba's, STAHS and Sherrardswood. This spring we will go to the open days of Queenswood, St. Margaret's, Abbot's Hill and RMS and we will revisit St. Columba’s. I'd also like to visit Aldenham (no open day announced yet) and possibly Berkhamsted Girls (open day in September). Out of these which ones would you recommend and why please?

My daughter is academically average in some areas and slightly above average in others. She loves history, enjoys maths and is very much into sports and dance. She loves to engage in extra curricular activities and give new things a go. For personal reasons, it would be a bonus if either of these schools offered German however it's not necessary.

I can't see her in STAHS, as even though the facilities looked ok, I didn't get the right vibe from the school. It seems too pushy where a sensitive girl like mine, who sometimes lacks confidence and needs encouragement, wouldn't thrive. If it's true that they only accept the most academic girls, she likely wouldn't get in anyway and even if she did I would probably not want to put her through the ordeal of always trying to be at the top or feeling worse. I believe there is more to a school than pure academics.

Sherrardswood seemed a bit too small and lacking great facilities. I'm not sure I could justify paying the fee just for smaller class sizes and more individual approach vs state school but compromise on the facilities.

St. Columba's is our nearest school to which she could walk - a massive bonus! Being in the city, the sports facilities didn't seem to be as great, which puts me off slightly. Also, as they have only recently started enrolling girls, they seem to be lacking girl friendly subjects such as textiles, dancing or food technology and my daughter pointed out that they are very much into basketball whereas she loves tennis, swimming, gymnastics dancing and would like to try lacrosse. Otherwise it seemed like a lovely school with great science labs and an overall good vibe to it. I wonder if they're going to become a bit more girl friendly by introducing new subjects to their curriculum and extra curricular offering.

As I mentioned above, I've not had a chance to visit the other schools yet. Based on my research I may not like Berkhamstead Girls if I didn't like STAHS. I'm very much looking forward to visiting the other schools. Ideally I would narrow it down to 3-4 schools to not make her sit too many exams/ interviews but to also give her a fair chance of securing a place in one of them.

Thank you

I think you will like St Margaret’s when you see it (have you signed up for the February open day?). They have excellent art including textiles, a sprung-floor dance studio and food tech among many other things. Languages at GCSE are French, Spanish, German, Chinese, Latin. No lacrosse, I don’t think.

Most importantly (to us when we chose it): the vibe is warm, inclusive, kind. Everyone we met was lovely and we could see our child happy there, with space to grow and flourish.

There is a very recent Good Schools Guide review - PM me if you are interested in seeing it. Actually there are two, one each for the Junior School and the Senior School.

Thank you very much! Yes we are going to the open day at St. Margaret's on 5th Feb. Really looking forward to it.

What I forgot to add earlier, my daughter also likes music, she plays clarinet and would definitely want to continue so a school with good music provision would be nice.

Queenswood without hesitation. Their sport and dance are fabulous (offering scholarships in both) and their co curricular programme is extensive - here’s the spring term programme

www.queenswood.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/Co-curricular-timetable-Spring-2022.pdf

It’s a school that gets results without the stress or being a hot house. They do select but it’s only really girls of average ability and above so not too taxing to get a place. They are also very supportive of SEN issues like dyslexia, dyscalculia etc. Their results are fantastic considering they are not ridiculously selective.

A school that very much works around the individual child as opposed to creating a “product”.

The fees are more expensive but you are paying for a boarding school environment even if you’re a day girl. Days are long (just after 8am until 6pm every day) but packed full. The door to door transportation makes everything very easy. Lots of girls use the flexi boarding and stay one or two nights a week - huge amounts of fun. Pastoral care is brilliant.

Thank you. Queenswood indeed looks lovely. Very much looking forward to visiting.

Abbots Hill is not an aggressively pushy academic school, it's more nurturing in that aspect. It's a lovely setting, nice facilities and did well over lockdowns.

Your daughter sounds similar to my son. We visited Berkhamsted, St Columbas, Aldenham, Sherrardswood, St Albans and Haileybury.

We applied to St A, Berkhamsted and Haileybury and he had offers to the second 2. We discounted St Columbas due to religion and facilities and Aldenham due to travel. Sherrardswood is lovely but just didn't seem worth it.

@boysmuminherts

Your daughter sounds similar to my son. We visited Berkhamsted, St Columbas, Aldenham, Sherrardswood, St Albans and Haileybury.

We applied to St A, Berkhamsted and Haileybury and he had offers to the second 2. We discounted St Columbas due to religion and facilities and Aldenham due to travel. Sherrardswood is lovely but just didn't seem worth it.

Thank you. I couldn't agree more about Sherrardswood which is a shame really.

At the moment I'm very much looking forward to seeing St. Margaret's, Queenswood, Abbot's Hill and RMS (not heard much about it unfortunately).

I wonder how hard the entrance exams are to any of these? Is there anywhere I can see what the pass marks are for English and Maths. My daughter's Maths skills are really good so not too worried here, but when it comes to her English, she does struggle a little bit with punctuation and spelling which her teachers say is quite normal at her age, but it makes me a bit worried nevertheless.

How oversubscribed are these schools does anybody know? The head of St Columba's said they are getting 4 applications per place on average. Wonder how it compares to the other schools.

Thank you

“Oversubscribed” is a bit of a dubious word. Of course they have far more children apply than there are places but most children will apply to between 2 and 4 schools in the area. So whilst there might be four applications for every place, realistically only a quarter to a third really WANT that place and the rest are just using it as a backup in case they don’t get another school.

I don’t know of a single girl to not get an offer from Abbots Hill. I only know of one girl to not get an offer from RMS. Berkhamsted has this bonkers system of offering only to those who do extremely well in the entrance tests a place first off with everyone else going on a waiting list. Once the offers from STAHS, Habs girls and NLCS come out (and they turn Berko down) the list moves. It then moves again once the Bucks 11+ places are offered. I know people who had to wait until April to get an offer (bottom sets at primary school) but they got a place in the end.

St Columba’s is getting more popular due to a lack of coed schools in the area, and I see the same happening with St Margaret’s.

Queenswood has to “compete” against not only STAHS, NLCS, Habs but also DAO and the north London schools like Channing and South Hampstead High. They are becoming increasingly oversubscribed though as parents realise that actually they don’t want a pressurised environment for their daughter, they just want them to achieve their personal best. For the last few years they have had a waiting list but the entrance exam is designed to select those of average ability and above. I wouldn’t be too worried about the entrance exams for any of the schools you mention. Herts parents aren’t into the whole intensive tuition thing you get in London.

@Zodlebud Thank you very much. Loads of valid and extremely helpful points.

My daughter has her eyes set on Queenswood at the moment. She's excited to see the other ones too, but from watching the virtual tours and after studying the extra curricular options, she seems to favour Q. May well change after she gets to see them of course.

Another thumbs up for Queenswood!
A word of caution re: Abbott’s Hill, does not have its own sixth form! Most of the girls move on to St George’s harpenden, a boarding and day state school (terrific school). So bear that in mind.

I think pupils look up to a 6th form. They see them as role models and get to see the best drama, music and sport from them. I wouldn’t pay for a school with no 6th form. If would feel like a bit of the school was missing and the ethos would be different.

Mine went to Q. There is so much to do and it’s vibrant. Exam results have not been quite so good as they used to be 10 years ago but they have slightly repositioned themselves in the market. Sadly some parents think brighter DDs won’t thrive there. I feel that’s wrong but the dynamic has altered.

@boysmuminherts

Your daughter sounds similar to my son. We visited Berkhamsted, St Columbas, Aldenham, Sherrardswood, St Albans and Haileybury.

We applied to St A, Berkhamsted and Haileybury and he had offers to the second 2. We discounted St Columbas due to religion and facilities and Aldenham due to travel. Sherrardswood is lovely but just didn't seem worth it.

@boysmuminherts which school did you go for?

@Snoopsnoggysnog
Not decided yet!!!! Probably Haileybury.

@boysmuminherts would love to PM you some time if that’s ok with you.

Sorry to hijack your thread OP

You need to look at Value Added for grades. not just results overall. If a school only takes in pupils that score 80%+ on entrance tests etc, the Pupil is always going to get high grades, and the School therefore will get high grades. Theres no added value. Your child may not be supported/pushed etc

Queenswood can get your child (on average) an entire grade higher than expected against their cohort. Look at this article for example

"More than half of all students who sat exams in a wide range of subjects, including Mathematics, French, Spanish, Music, Art and Drama, achieved at least two grades higher than predicted by baseline tests."

That would depend on how good the baseline tests are. Music, Art and drama are difficult to assess. Some pupils will have done no MFLs or very basic introductory lessons. However as DDs went to Q I do respect the school but sometimes don’t accept PR without data attached and a lot more info!

We have yet to visit RMS, Aldenham and Berkhamsted Girls from our list.

From what we've seen so far Queenswood is our definite number 1. Seems like a truly amazing school and a perfect fit for my daughter.

We are still keeping St. Columba’s as a backup option as it's a our nearest school, seems to be very nurturing, with loads of happy kids and she enjoyed her taster day there a lot. It's of course not able to compete with Q in terms of facilities but it does have many good aspects to it.

I feel like I should choose another 1-2 options to be on the safe side but will wait until I see the last 3 schools from my list.

So far we are definitely not choosing STAHS or Sherrardswood. I wasn't really sold on Abbot's Hill either. St. Margaret's seemed nice but I'm not sure I would choose it over St. Columba's if I'm honest.

Thank you everyone for contributing. Any more suggestions, opinions are welcome and greatly appreciated.

We are currently considering accepting a place at Queenswood for our daughter but weren’t as impressed with the school following the tour (it was very much ‘what do you want to see’ rather than ‘let me show you how great our school is) The facilities are great but some of the students definitely seemed less engaged in the lessons than in the other school we looked at.
My daughter is bright and has been offered an academic scholarship with her place at Q, but I’m just not sure if Q is more about the PR than the substance. Any advice welcome!

When DD1 left it was pretty academic at the top of any cohort. 2 Principals back there was a big effort to up GCSE and A level grades. They did. Lots of girls went to RG universities and, in my DD1s cohort, have done very well since.

However the next head was more interested in a finishing school atmosphere. Out went the notion of supporting bright girls to be leaders of the future and in came the idea that you were most valued for parental money and having little to say. Some strong girls have come out of that system but in DD2’s year, well over 50% of girls left for other 6th forms. (60 down to 26). So they have had to rebuild. Exam results haven’t recovered yet. League table position definitely hasn’t. Even dedicated Q supporters (@Zodlebud) think their brighter DD should go somewhere more academic. This is turning the clock back to pre 2000 and it’s a huge shame.

DD was a 6th form scholar. The school really could do with attracting more high flying girls. However if people won’t send bright DDs there, what can they do? When my DD1 went, it had very similar results as our local girls grammar. It doesn’t now.

I would interrogate results. Does your DD have to be educated with everyone else being the same? I didn’t know how bright DD was when she went snd she came from a state school. I just knew her 11 plus Bucks result.

We didn’t choose it based on facilities. We chose based on size, personal attention for pupils, lots of clubs, boarding ethos and, at the time, an outstanding head snd deputy. Plus their school exchange programme which both my DDs did. Other parents love the drama and sport. It’s getting back to what it should be. I think the current Principal is liked. However the altar of money is very worshipped.

This is very useful insight, thank you! We want a school that will challenge our maths/science focused child and won’t stifle creativity. Our daughter likes gymnastics but doesn’t play team sports, although she’s happy to join in this isn’t something we desperately need in a school. I want a school with genuine interest in helpful students progress and encouraging them to challenge themselves. Re your final comment, we aren’t monied and wouldn’t want money to be important to her.

Can I ask, does being a scholar actually mean anything of value? Will it be a positive thing for our daughter or is it just a label?

No. Scholarships there don’t have a monetary value. She just had to go through hoops to get it. I won’t bore you with the issues after that bug I do know the current Principal has promoted a different ethos.

They used to have fund raising events and some of these are invitation only. So big money talked. The wealthy were actively courted!

Did being a scholar give your DD a different experience in any way?

Does anybody know if there is an option to learn German at Queenswood? I could swear that the girl who was our guide this morning said she was learning Spanish and German but having looked everywhere on their website I can't find a word about German...

@TizerorFizz The Q of today is very different to the one from when your daughters were there (reading your posts I don’t think you were there since Mrs Cameron has joined?). Over 50% of girls come from state school. Of course there is money there, but the same can surely be said of any private school? They are certainly not a school courting the monied for extra funding. All girls (and parents) are equal.

I have also read posts from “Zodlebud” and I don’t think she says it’s not good enough for her academic daughter - she’s just looking for other options as right now Q is the only school they like and surely they need to apply to more than one school?

@RuralHertsMum I would actually be really impressed by a school that asked us what we wanted to see. It shows that they want to show you how they can meet the specific needs and interests of YOUR daughter. What’s the point in showing off the flashy new sports centre and amazing theatre if they are of no interest and you’d rather see the science labs? It also shows they are strong all round and not just showing you the best bits.

I have a daughter there at the moment. I have already sent you a DM about scholarships and my experience of the school. I can tell you that the academic scholars in my DDs year turned down places at STAHS, Habs girls, NLCS and DAO to go there. Music scholar was on Grade 8 in Year 6. Drama scholars have worked professionally in the West End and in feature films. Sports scholars are on England pathways. Scholarships are not won easily and the girls in receipt of them are given further enrichment in their specialism, as well as support for any supporting coaching etc outside school. If you are looking for significant fee discounts or to be put on a pedestal then you won’t get it there. Scholars are respected by their peers for their talents, but are humble, thankful and give back. You would have received information as to what the scholarship adds to your DDs academic life with your offer letter.