Computer Science A level or BTEC IT?

[Titanium2013]

I’ve started another thread about applying to more than one sixth form, but now I’ve looked further than our nearest 6th form, I’m finding only one offers computer science (which was recommended by his careers advisor). The others do BTEC I.T instead. Do you think this would be a step down or are they equally valued? The pressure to make the right choices is unbelievable! I wish the schools would advise more.

Is he studying CS at GCSE? What grade is he predicted?

What does he want to do with it?

I recruit IT staff often. I would prefer staff with BTEC or apprenticeship NVQs than A Levels for staff coming directly into an IT role.

You can still go to university with BTEC good grades so choices are still open, but again a degree apprenticeship would be preferable to an ordinary degree

Maths A level is the key one if he's aiming at selective universities. If aiming at lower tariff then not so important and BTEC ok.

Thanks everyone. He is at a low performing academy which still has computers from 15 years ago so they haven’t run any IT based GCSEs except for a basic one for those who struggle with other subjects as the computers cannot cope with the demands. So he won’t have any IT qualifications, but he is predicted an 8 in his maths and 7s in his combined science. He loves computing, has a subscription to Computer Active and is often following their guides to change his system etc. When he told the careers advisor she suggested computer science would be a good fit for him, particularly as he either wants to go into a career in IT or using maths/science. The only sixth form to offer it have said his other grades will be enough to get onto the computer science course. But, if he takes BTEC IT it means we can be more choosy with which sixth form he opts for.

Think we need to do a bit more research into it.

You need to have a look at his uni choices and a) what they want for entry and b) what sort of career does he want?

Computers from 15 years ago are not a problem for computer science GCSE, it can be taught without a computer at all.

CS is a science and has nothing to do with changing systems, installing new sound cards etc. I say this so he isn't selecting the wrong course for him.

CS has a fair amount of coding but is a lot to do with logic gates, converting numbers to Hex, Octal and binary and back again.

About 50% is theory, you learn how a CPU works.

Does he do any programming?

If he is looking at BTEC the qualification is made up of a number of units, and these vary by provider. Usually they vary because of the teaching staff available and the skills set. Some universities want specific units to be studied eg in Health and Social care a BTEC will get you on to a nursing degree but must include 'Anatomy and physiology', if it doesn't then the uni will ask for an A level in Biology or similar.

qualifications.pearson.com/content/dam/pdf/BTEC-Nationals/Information-Technology/2016/specification-and-sample-assessments/specification-pearson-btec-level-3-national-extended-diploma-in-information-technology.pdf

The other thing with BTEC is the current government are trying to scrap them, this was discussed in parliament this week, it has been put on hold, thankfully.

The government want to introduce 'T Levels', now as far as I can tell a T Level will be useful to go from education to the workplace but will not get you into uni.

Personally I think the T Level will go the way of the GNVQ and the AVCE.

Both BTEC and A Levels have been around a long time and both are respected

Thank you @sashh. I think the issue is that he’s been told that he should take CS, but we’d never even heard of it before as an option! He does like coding and loves to know how the computers work. He’s hot on things like cyber security etc. But, I’m thinking that a BTEC in ICT may match his interests more. My worry is that by choosing 2 A levels and then a BTEC he might be affecting his future options. As he has no idea yet what he wants to do as a career, we’re trying to make sure his choices are good ones. Maths A level is a must as he is predicted an 8 at gcse and loves the subject. Would a BTEC be as good as an A level in terms of credits for UCAS?

If he wants to do Computer Science at University then he needs Maths A level, he doesn't need CS A level (because so few schools/colleges offer it).

Some universities will accept the Btec in IT but most of the good ones prefer a Btec with a mathematical element such as Computing or Engineering.

I didn't realise it was the 1 A level equivalent (extended certificate) you were talking of. In which case as long as he has the maths A level he should be fine. What is his other subject choice.

Try to work backwards, although this may seem daunting to be looking at university stuff it is a good idea to find out what universities want.

He may not know which course he wants to do but at this stage they can usually rule out a huge number ie, no to music or English but yes to where his interests lie such as maths, sciences, computer science.

They will list their entry requirements, bear in mind that these are the minimums and for the top performing universities those applying may be applying with grades that exceed the minimum. Some courses prefer the applicant to have further maths although they cannot state that as not all sixth forms offer it but a lot of applicants for maths based courses (computer science) will have it.

Ds1 has just started uni this year to study computer science and Ds2 is in year 11. Although it may seem early, get your son to save a document somewhere where he lists all the of the things he does computer science/IT/Computer wise now so that he can reference stuff later on his personal statement.

If he's taking 2 A Levels then I'd probably go towards A Level CS because the chances of getting the correct 'options' in the 1 A Level equivalent BTEC are low.

But, he needs to be somewhere he is happy, so go for VI form / FE college first.

As he is good with maths and enjoys coding he is CS A Level material.

What is his 3rd choice likely to be? CS and maths are great for a computing / computer science degree but if he is not set on that then his 3rd subject will broaden his horizons.

Slightly unconventional advice here, but head for a library or a good book shop, take the A Level and BTEC text books and have your DS look through them.

Oh something for him to try

sciencedemos.org.uk/logic_gates.php

I'd tell him to start with two inputs, an 'AND' gate and an LED output as a simple starter, if he can develop a simple circuit to add two inputs he will probably enjoy CS.

In fact he may be able to use it to complete some A Level questions

pmt.physicsandmathstutor.com/download/Computer-Science/A-level/Topic-Qs/AQA/06-Fundamentals-of-Computer-Systems/6.4.%20Logic%20Gates%20QP.pdf

Most BTECs are 3 A level equivalents. A triple distinction is equivalent to 3 A* A levels in UCAS points.

One of my DS scored that in his BTEC. He is now on a digital degree apprenticeship with a large financial company on a good salary (a no debt for the degree)

I think BTECs are a better way in to digital if that's where he wants to go.

@GoldenBlue

Most BTECs are 3 A level equivalents. A triple distinction is equivalent to 3 A* A levels in UCAS points.

One of my DS scored that in his BTEC. He is now on a digital degree apprenticeship with a large financial company on a good salary (a no debt for the degree)

I think BTECs are a better way in to digital if that's where he wants to go.

Not all or even most BTECs are 3 A Level equivalent and the OP is talking about 2 A Levels and a BTEC so it can't be that.

And I'm not knocking BTEC, I've taught it for quite a few years but in a different subject (even though my PGCE is computing).

Apologies I wasn't aware that there were BTECs that weren't at least 2 A levels but all IT ones I've seen in recent years have been 3 A Level equivalents.

So, his third option for A level is either psychology or physics. Obviously physics and maths often go hand in hand but he loves psychology. But again, not all our local 6th forms are offering psychology.

@sashh I can’t thank you enough for the help you’ve given. I will show him this thread later and have a look at the links you’ve attached.

Thank you everyone, food for thought! Xx

@Titanium2013

I’ve started another thread about applying to more than one sixth form, but now I’ve looked further than our nearest 6th form, I’m finding only one offers computer science (which was recommended by his careers advisor). The others do BTEC I.T instead. Do you think this would be a step down or are they equally valued? The pressure to make the right choices is unbelievable! I wish the schools would advise more.

IT is not the same as computer science.

Do the A-level if possible.

One thing to understand is that Computer Science is all about problem solving, eg finding an IT solution to a real-life consumer need.

If your DS has the tenacity to do whatever it take to solve a problem, he should not shy away from CS A-level.

My DD is in the second year of her degree in CS. Her A-levels were CS, Maths and Physics.

This is a timely thread. I hope you don't mind me adding to it OP. I am trying to work out what option would be best fit for my DD. CS A level or It extended diploma btec in It. She's a creative problem solver who enjoys working collaboratively on projects.She has had an aptitude for coding since primary school but doesn't currently do any outside of what is expected in the CS gcse.

She is inspired by women who promote computing as a career but they haven't always taken a direct or traditional route to get there. Is there a careers site or something for computing type careers and profiles and recommended routes in?

My DD could do maths A level (she'll get 7 or 8 in GCSE) alongside an IT Btec. If she did CS A level and maths A level, her other A level choice world be a humanities subject, so she's never going to be chasing a CS degree at a top university.

@Bookmarket

The British Computer Society (BCS) and the IET - the Institution of Engineering and Technology are the bodies that professional computer scientists and engineers can join. They will almost certainly be promoting women in these careers. (There might be others I am not aware of). They register students for progression to Chartered Engineer status. Something to consider? You do not have to attend a top university to profess in this field of work but computing without maths is virtually impossible I would have thought.

Thanks.

Good to know about the maths and it is something to consider. I need to find out if it is going to be more demanding to do 3 A levels, including maths or an extended BTEC with the addition of maths A level.

Physics, Maths and either CS or the Btec is probably the best combination.

I recruit IT staff often and would definitely prefer people with the BTEC over A Levels.

Nowadays IT degrees aren't the best route into an IT career and apprenticeships are a faster and more effective route in.

If you child is choosing a degree ensure it is practically focused, ideally with work for a real customer at some point in the syllabus. Otherwise when they leave their degree they are in the same position as someone coming straight out of school due to the lack of practical experience.

Big organisations such as banks bring in staff on digital apprenticeships now and the pay during the study years is excellent. Many result in a degree qualification and no debt.

e.g. careers.dwp.gov.uk/our-teams/dwp-digital-apprenticeships/
Salary of over £20k whilst studying

I think that sometimes people here are pushing traditional A Level and University routes that were relevant when we were young but don't relate to the job market at the moment

This is great advice. Thank you.

Once again OP - sorry for the hijack.

I think there is still a role for Chartered Engineers in computer engineering. Different routes are always welcome.

@Bookmarket No problem at all! Its a confusing time. We want to guide our children but we aren’t equipped with the knowledge needed.

I know A levels are the more traditional route, but when your ds has zero idea of what career to pursue I think it’s best to just continue with A levels in the subjects he enjoys. This way he will get 2 more years to focus in on career options while gaining credits to uni or a degree apprenticeship. We have a careers Fayre at school next week (covid permitting) and so we may know more then.