Applying to grammar school after the main entry at 11+?

[Mynamegone]

Does anyone have experience of this and know whether many places come up after the main September start?
We didn’t apply for 11+ this term , but would like to next year or the following and wondering whether it’s much harder.
Thanks for any advice

You'd be reliant on someone leaving so you'd need to ask the school how often that happens. Cant imagine many people giving up the place after the stress of 11+ but there may be the odd one due to relocation etc

One child didn’t turn up in Sept in DS’s class last year but that space was immediately filled by someone on the waiting list.

curious as to why you didn't do the 11+? most grammars only have 16+ and 11+ as entry points with hardly any spots available outside that?

Even the areas that run a 12+, as has already been said require someone to leave for there to be a place on offer.

In our area, there is an opportunity to apply after the main cohort. There does seem to be a reasonable amount of movement - certainly relocation and then a few who can't cope with the demands and go to a more supportive private option etc.

Having said that, the assessment process seems to be very difficult. The school produces stats from the number of children who take the assessment in summer of yr 7/8 etc and there is often 20+ children with only 1 or 2 passing each year. What it doesn't tell you is how many of those children are people like your DD who didn't take the test at all in Yr 6, compared to how many are girls that failed in Yr 6 (or Yr 7 etc) and are having another attempt.

My son started in the New Year after we moved just before Christmas in Yr 7 . We were just lucky they had a vacancy!

My son is at a superselective grammar and they've just had two new starters in Y9...they have to do a qualifying test for entry, but it is possible.

It really depends on the individual school.
The grammars in my area maintain waiting lists for years. Very occasionally places come up, but no guarantee whatsoever. I had a Y11 pupil a few years ago who had sat 11+ but not gained a place, who was told by their mother that they would be leaving as soon as a place came up in the grammar... but it never did, poor kid.

Perhaps we made a big mistake not applying now. Thanks for the replies as I wonder if we’d have done better at least seeing if got on a waiting list .

We didn’t do it as DS finds change difficult and his current school continues to 13. But maybe we should have

Well, it really does depend on the school. For example, is it a state maintained grammar, or an independent that calls itself "grammar"? Is it super selective or in an area where everyone sits 11+?

The best thing to do now is to ring them and ask if they have a late-comers assessment he can do, and when it would be. There are schools which examine at the end of Y8 in order to fill places freed up by pupils moving to public school etc.

Near me it a lot harder to get an out of year place. The only kids I know who have done it are exceptional - think 5 A* at A-Level type of child. Worth a try but don’t bank on it.

So he'll be doing common entrance for private presumably?

At my dc's grammar only a very occasional place comes up, and when it does all potential candidates have to sit an exam and the highest score will take the place. Except for a few months after the new year 7 intake when the next on the waiting list would take the place.

It’s a selective state grammar but its website suggests there are two places available in years 9 and 10 with no waiting list mentioned (whereas years 7 and 8 have a waiting list).
I wonder whether there’d still be far more applicants for those places than applying now though?
We haven’t prepped DS for the 11+ exam particularly, but he’s got the hang of the questions he’s done and maybe we should just give it a shot now as I still seem able to apply.
So torn as all his friends will be carrying on and current school is a mile away versus 30 mins so he would mind and potentially be resentful if didn’t find it easy . But the grammar could also be so good for his next step.

If he's currently in a prep school they should be able to advise whether they commonly have students getting grammar places for yr 9 or not. My daughter's prep had choristers who had to stay till 13, in their area it was known that the girls' grammar often had places come up (not many, but some), but the boys' grammar if you didn't go at yr 7 that was almost certainly the end of that. The distribution of independent day school places in the area was clearly a factor.

Yes you can, there will be pupils leaving, for example moving house, leaving a vacant place. Go for it. If accepted, your child will almost certainly not be the only new one in the year.

For a popular school, it is difficult to get a late entry place for yr7 if you haven’t done the 11+. You won’t be grammar qualified, plus there are usually long waiting lists.

Many schools determine a period when they hold the waiting list until. It is often Jan of Yr7 or end of Yr7. Whilst many don’t want to move once settled at another school, even if a Grammar place comes up, some will. So this makes it difficult.

Lots of areas will say that the only entry points are at 11 or 16. So if you didn’t take the 11+ you have missed the boat. If they have an empty place (through someone leaving) they will usually take someone who passed the 11+ in another area and has moved to the area.

Some schools are more flexible and if they have a place will allow someone who is interested to take an assessment to see if they meet the standard required.

Some councils have a 12+ exam and some schools will let a few students take an exam at a late point after yr8 in case places become available.

So, the answer is that it depends. There is no single answer that applies to all schools.

However, the thing that is broadly true is that Grammars are very popular and over subscribed, so getting a place later isn’t easy.

Independent schools are likely to be more flexible. When people approach the school about a place (whether they have just moved to area or been in it a while but want to move school) then the school will often allow the,not sit an assessment or take things like CAT4 results from their previous school, and might offer a place.

It’s a shame you are now wishing you’d entered your child and didn’t go through the standard route, but things do change for families.

If you’re talking about taking 11+ for an independent, the school will often be more flexible with the application deadline.

If you’re interested in a place, enter him for the exam. Don’t hold off, thinking it will be easier to apply late as less competition.

If the exams are November or January, there is still time to do some familiarisation and prep for the papers.

If you don’t apply with the standard cohort, you really are at the mercy of people leaving and there not being others who are better who are waiting, to get a place. If you have a chance to go through the standard channels, then do so.

I wouldn’t hold out hope for one of only 2 places available at Yr9. I’d think the competition will be fierce.

Re waiting for yr9 entry instead of yr7, it depends on the school if there are more applicants per place or not, according to the school. Many schools are now taking fewer at 13 and filling most or all places at 11 so they have fees for longer.

I don’t think you’ve anything to lose by taking the exam.

Local selective grammar has some places in Year 9. They are often filled by kids from a Prep School that goes to 13. I believe there is an entrance exam.
I worked with someone whose son was offered a place at another GS in the County in Year 8. She knew that someone was leaving and rang to ask where her son was on the waiting list, and was offered the place there and then.

Thank you for all being so helpful.

If his current school go up to 13 then applying for a y9 place will be marginally more likely to succeed than applying for y8. There are a fair few private schools that start in y9 and it's entirely possible that a smattering of pupils might have secured places at the Grammar just as a stop-gap before moving to a 13+ entry school if their primary stopped at y6. I would expect quite stiff competition though.