Has DS’s school disadvantaged the students by the way they tested GCSES?

[Bigblueone]

They didn’t do mini assessments. They did exams in the style of normal GCSEs. They had no idea what was on the papers and these were the only opportunity they had to show what they knew. DS was told they’ll give out the grades based on what a normal year (pre 2020) would receive. After today’s news I’m concerned.

I'm sorry but what's wrong with what they did?

They shouldn't have any idea of what is on the paper until they sit the paper. If they've done enough work then they'll be able to answer the questions. If they cant, then they dont deserve a good grade.

Why do you think they have been disadvantaged?

There was no central moderation or consistent assessment approach so some children at some school will have done better than similar children at different schools.
There is nothing you can do about it, so best to focus on whether your DS has got what he needs for whatever the next thing is and not to get too hung up on how everyone else does.

I know other schools did multiple mini assessments where students knew the topic they were going to be tested on. They also had more chances to prove themselves (I believe some schools were doing 40-50 assessments.)

No, sounds fair. I’m sure he’ll get what he deserves.

All you can do is see how the grades are. If your dc can get to their next step then hopefully all will be well.

This year it is a complicated mess. It is ENTIRELY the government's fault as they dumped it all on schools and made no plans. I am so angry with this government I think I need therapy to get over being governed by them.

@Bigblueone

I know other schools did multiple mini assessments where students knew the topic they were going to be tested on. They also had more chances to prove themselves (I believe some schools were doing 40-50 assessments.)

But the school will still grade them in line with each other.

If an exam is very hard, then a grade 8 could be 60%.
If an exam is very easy, then a grade 8 could be 75%.

Your school sat different exams to the other schools. But your child's teachers know your child and will know a) what they are capable of and b) what would be the expected level for your child in that exam.

Thanks for the replies. I’ve been really calm about it all but today it dawned on me that he’s probably not going to do as well as other schools because of their approach.

Schools had to submit their assessment policy, rationale and samples to the DFE. If they thought what your son’s school was doing was unfair, they’d have queried it.

@lannistunut but how did so many dcs get As at A’level bearing that in mind?

@Bigblueone

Thanks for the replies. I’ve been really calm about it all but today it dawned on me that he’s probably not going to do as well as other schools because of their approach.

You haven't had GCSE results yet have you?

I am not sure your school will mark your children more harshly. That is what would make a difference, not the type/form of test.

What are you hoping your child will get? If you are hoping they get enough to get into sixth form, and they do, what is the issue? Are they quite borderline as to whether they can get in?

It’s not just about sixth form though, surely?

If that was the case all I would have needed at gcse back in the dark ages were three Bs and two Cs, but realistically for most higher level courses they need more than that.

If the OPs ds is wanting (say) to study medicine, or dentistry, he’ll need top GCSE grades.

No, completely fair. We did this

[quote Bigblueone]@lannistunut but how did so many dcs get As at A’level bearing that in mind?[/quote]
Because (following last year's debacle where the schools that carried out internal moderation lost out) schools will have given the benefit of the doubt to every borderline candidate. In normal exam years some of the borderline candidates will go down and other candidates will have a bad day/circumstances that mean they massively underperform. The number of As produced represents the number of students that could get what schools think is an A if they all had good days.
Of course, if they'd all taken exams and had good days, the grade boundaries would likely have changed to prevent this happening. Because what represents an "A" is never the same between cohorts.

@lavenderandwisteria

It’s not just about sixth form though, surely?

If that was the case all I would have needed at gcse back in the dark ages were three Bs and two Cs, but realistically for most higher level courses they need more than that.

If the OPs ds is wanting (say) to study medicine, or dentistry, he’ll need top GCSE grades.

That is why I asked what does he need - but pushy parents can appeal, kids can resit and it is likely that Universities will be aware in 2023 to take account of the mess this year.

I think overblowing it before the results would be a mistake. Wait until the envelope is opened and see how it is.

I would say there is just as much worry that a University will not feel able to trust an 8 this year as really being a sign of a certain standard.

If all the school used was 'final exams' then he won't have been disadvantaged compared with previous years but may not have the advantages that were built into the system.

By going for a final exam only approach the school has kept the 'one mark off a grade boundary' situation. Whereas if I understand it correctly, this year by using multiple assessments, schools could use a 'normally works at this grade' approach giving to some extent 'benefit of the doubt' grades. e.g. in any year 7 students might be working at grade 6, but in exams 1 might have a bad day and slip to a 5 and one might have an extra good day and get a 7. Your school has kept that, whereas others would give all of them 6s.

otoh I have read elsewhere on MN that boys do better with high stakes exams, so maybe the school thought this was still the best way to go as it didn't think pupils would sustain working at high levels for multiple assessments.

It looks like the private schools have been extra generous this year, so the attainment gap between state and private is wider

@Bigblueone school have had to give samples to exam boards for sampling too so the boards had to be satisfied they were doing things correctly. They also had to declare their policy on TAGs too so the exam boards will be satisfied the school have acted correctly.

If he can access his next step my advice would be grab it and move on. Then GCSEs won’t even matter.

This is how my school assessed . Totally fair and puts him into a much better position for further study because he needed the “normally expected “ depth of knowledge .

Sounds much better than most schools in terms of actual representation of what the young person has achieved.

Inflated grades reduce the value of qualifications, making people’s efforts less meaningful. Students can end up on degree courses that are too hArd or not appropriate.

Really hoping not too many of the extra medical students starting struggle. Medicine is tough, I did it back in the era when an ‘A’ was a rarity, resits and modules didn’t exist etc. 1990s. Most of us found it a really challenging course academically and it is not to be undertaken lightly. I want the Uk to have more doctors, but not for students to start courses, fail/drop out/struggle etc etc as it wasn’t quite right for them in the first place.

To reassure you, the method used by schools is almost irrelevant. The method allows you to mark abs then rank students. Most schools then applied their own grade boundaries to ensure a similar spread of grades to previous years.

A School may have chunked lots of mini assessments but that doesn’t mean the whole school can be given high marks. As another poster has said, the “grade boundaries” applied would just be higher.

That’s what I thought @Squidlydoo and why I was quite happy about it before they published A’level results. I can’t understand how there can be so many high grades if schools have ensured a similar spread of grades as previous years.

@Bigblueone

That’s what I thought *@Squidlydoo* and why I was quite happy about it before they published A’level results. I can’t understand how there can be so many high grades if schools have ensured a similar spread of grades as previous years.

They haven't ensured an identical number of each grade, obviously. They were not asked to do that anyway.

That doesn't mean your child will be disadvantaged by having a slightly different assessent method compared to other schools - your child is only going to be assessed on what they did in the assessment they sat.

Anyway - if the general trend is for more higher grades, why do you feel this will negatively affect your child - surely they will benefit from generous grading also?

It's all very difficult.

Grade inflation is inevitable under these circumstances. Imagine you have 10 kids who you think are on course to get an A. In a normal year, one of them might have a bad day and end up with a B. This year, even if that happens in the last assessment, the school still has the flexibility to say "they've got A on everything else they've done."

I think that happens far more often than someone you thought was heading for a B pulling off an A on the day, so taking out the "bad day phenomenon" pushes grades up.

Then you've got half a dozen kids who you're sure will get either an A or a B, but it might depend on what the questions, how much last minute revision they do, and which way the wind is blowing. In a normal year, the exam would be the final arbiter. This year, you might decide that you can't, in all fairness, give them all As. That's where the internal assessments give you some sort of objective measure - particularly important because you know the kids personally and you don't want anyone accusing you of bias. What assessments schools used for that was up to them.

Teachers know full well that different assessment methods will give different scores: I don't think anyone would equate scores on each topic examined separately with scores on the whole syllabus. What was practical to organise will have varied between schools. Where a lot of curriculum time has been missed, they may have wanted to give students less stressful assessment, whilst realising that they need to bear that in mind in interpreting the scores.

I don't think anyone can guarantee that there was no inequity between schools, but hopefully the exam board moderation will have picked up the worst of it.

@FrownedUpon

No, sounds fair. I’m sure he’ll get what he deserves.

It's not really 'fair' though is it when different schools do different things. Did you not read this bit:

I know other schools did multiple mini assessments where students knew the topic they were going to be tested on. They also had more chances to prove themselves (I believe some schools were doing 40-50 assessments.)

I agree, OP, it is a worry.