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Original poster

separate sciences or combined science

35 replies

DistrictCommissioner · 27/05/2021 22:17

DC is only in Y8 but options are coming up next year. She is in the top set for science at a large mixed comprehensive - predicted grade 7-8 I think, but I don't know how meaningful that is at this stage - and the school encourage the top set to take separate sciences.

DH is very keen for her to take separate sciences, in part because as like me he went to a selective school that considered combined science to be very inferior, and in part becuase he is in a scientific career (of sorts). I am ambivalent - I did 3 sciences, & it was utterly irrelvant to my future academic life, & they get so few options I can see it would be good to have another option free by taking combined science!

DC has no idea what she wants to do when she is older - drama, farming, archeology all get mentioned - so some sort of scientific career can't be ruled out, but is it really significant if she hasn't got the separate sciences at GCSE? I've been told that you can pick up the A level subjects without having done the separate sciences...

OP posts:
clary · 27/05/2021 23:56

Yes you can certainly do A level with double science GCSE. There will be extra content that you might need to catch up on over the summer.

Does taking triple science actually use up an option? in some schools it's taken by higher sets and content is gone through more quickly, that's what they do at my DCs' school. So if you do triple you get 10 GCSEs, double you get 9, but still four options (tho two are humanity and language for most).

If she may want science A levels I personally would suggest taking triple. What does your dd think? If it is an option, what would she do instead and is that a big passion?

clary · 27/05/2021 23:58

What I mean is, everyone has the same number of science lessons but those doing triple cover more content at speed. Option subjects are separate. Some schools do indeed have it as an option of course.

bonfireheart · 27/05/2021 23:59

In DD school, the teacher decide who does separate science and they've already said its only for those who are reaching an exceptional standard.

DD13 wants to be a paramedic which sounds science based but none of the info I've read says she needs separate sciebces to study Paramedic Science at uni. I think it would be an unnecessary pressure.

clary · 28/05/2021 00:03

I wonder what exceptional standard means? Ds2 got 9/8/7 in his science GCSEs, which we thought was pretty good and certainly worth doing. It's a GCSE not a doctorate. I don't think choosing to do triple is highly pressurised, especially not if it is an option subject, as the op implies. It just depends what is planned and what else has to give in that case.

Wotsitsarecheesy · 28/05/2021 00:06

I had this conversation with DDs science teacher a couple of months ago. He told me that in double science, they cover a smaller curriculum in less depth than if you take 3 individual sciences. So if you want to go on to do science subjects at A level, there are a few sections you will have missed entirely, and what you did study won't have been as comprehensive as if you had studied 3 separate GCSEs. He did stress that it is perfectly possible to take science A levels after doing double science GCSE, but that it takes a little more work as you need to catch up on the parts you missed.

WelcometoJam · 28/05/2021 00:21

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paralysedbyinertia · 28/05/2021 00:50

DD was very conflicted by this as she had to use one of her option slots to do triple science and she had other subjects that she wanted to do as well.

What swung it for her eventually was her delightful science teacher saying that it wouldn't matter in the slightest if she did combined and then wanted to go on to A-level science (the science teacher herself had done combined before going on to do a chemistry degree) BUT she thought that dd might find the pace a bit slow in the combined group, whereas the triple (separate sciences) group would be more challenging. DD has a low boredom threshold when the work is too easy, so that decided it for her. She hasn't regretted it at all, whereas her friend who chose combined science did indeed find the lessons a bit slow-paced. This was about peer group as much as anything - there seems to be a culture in dd's school that,,if you're capable, you do triple.

As things turned out, dd was glad that she chose the separate sciences. She enjoyed covering new content (a lot of the combined content seemed to be a rehash of what they'd covered in year 9) and as she is going on to do science A-levels, she won't have to play catch up.

Ultimately, your dd won't be closing any doors if she picks combined, so really, it's about what she is going to enjoy more along the way.

Lonecatwithkitten · 28/05/2021 02:48

My DD despite being good at science did not want to do triple, I had to fight the school a little bit. But she did double science getting 9/9, but I honestly believe she would have got worse grades in triple as she would have not been happy.

Original poster
DistrictCommissioner · 28/05/2021 07:48

The understanding I’ve been given is that triple science is one of the options - & they only do 9, so if you do 3 science, 2 English, 1 maths, then you only have 3 options left to squeeze in everything else. Which seems like a big downside to me!

As to whether you have to be exceptional, DD’s science teacher said at parents evening that they encourage the top set to take the 3 sciences, & I got the impression the option was certainly open to her.

I don’t think DD is particularly interested in taking the separate sciences but she is a people pleaser, & she knows her teacher wants her set to do the 3, so that is concerning her!

OP posts:
Original poster
DistrictCommissioner · 28/05/2021 07:50

One of DH’s worries is that if she takes combined but then wants to apply for medicine (or similar), will her GCSEs let her down?

OP posts:
paralysedbyinertia · 28/05/2021 07:57

@DistrictCommissioner

One of DH’s worries is that if she takes combined but then wants to apply for medicine (or similar), will her GCSEs let her down?
She would still be able to apply for medicine if she did combined. Having said that, doing triple does indicate an interest in science, which might be helpful.
DonLewis · 28/05/2021 08:04

Ah, the medicine myth.

My son goes to a superselective grammar school. At his options evening the headteacher spoke at length about this. Combined science doesn't preclude a level science or a career in medicine (according to her, around 50% of the students they send to medical school each year did combined science).

Most of the children who took combined did so because they wanted the 3rd option available to them.

My son, despite adoring science did combined to allow him that 3rd option. He is taking chemistry a level (at the schools sixth form) with no issue.

chillied · 28/05/2021 08:11

DD is also at a school where they do 9 and if you do triple science you then have 3 options not 4.

She chose combined science. Her science teachers suggested triple but didn't push it strongly. Try to help your daughter not 'please' the teachers on these choices but a subject teacher won't see the whole picture for a child. For instance the language teachers wanted DD to take 2 language gcses... which she also didn't do.

Perhaps the focus should be, finding out if there are other subjects that she wants to do more than the extra science? No point making the space for the options if she's not sufficiently inspired by other subjects.

In my son's case I don't think there would be enough other subjects he's gagging to do more than science.

TeenMinusTests · 28/05/2021 08:25

At DD's school, combined was 10hrs per fortnight (ie 1 per day) and triple was 14hrs per fortnight. It is a lot of science.
Triple appears to me to be more topics at the same depth, not harder or more detailed. (DD switched from combined to just Biology - don't ask).

Personally I'd wait until how the options are being run is announced. Don't let your DH railroad her into doing triple unless she really wants to.

bonfireheart · 28/05/2021 08:27

It's interesting to see how different schools do options. At DD school they all have to do Philosophy & Ethics as one of their options, so have less options to choose from.

paralysedbyinertia · 28/05/2021 08:31

Don't let your DH railroad her into doing triple unless she really wants to.

I agree with this. She needs to make her own choices.

TeenMinusTests · 28/05/2021 08:32

bonfire Lots of schools make P&E/RE mandatory at least to short course as it has to be taught in KS4, but it doesn't necessarily take up a whole option slot in terms of time.

ChicChaos · 28/05/2021 08:33

Triple Science takes one of the options out at my DD's school too, it's only available by invitation (no chance of separate sciences).

Mumoftwoinprimary · 28/05/2021 08:37

The chances are that most (although not all) of the most able at science will do triple science. As a result the triple science class will be working, on average, at a higher level. It is a lot easier to get a high grade if you are in a class where the average grade is high than to get a high grade on your own.

(I have A grades in both maths and physics A level. Maths was set and 16 out of 22 of us got an A. Physics wasn’t and 14 out of 18 got a C or lower. My A in maths very much felt like “turn up, do the work set, gossip with my friends, collect my A”. The A in physics was really really hard as the teacher stated openly that the class work set was only going up to a B.)

Original poster
DistrictCommissioner · 28/05/2021 08:47

Mumoftwoinprimary my friend with an older child said something similar - she encouraged her DS to take the 3 sciences because she knew the most able would be in that class, & that he was more likely to get distracted by lack of focus in combined classes. My DD will work hard where ever she is though but that is a consideration.

chillied yes sounds similar, the top language set at the end of Y7 had to take up another language, and they are encouraged to do 2 languages for GCSE. I think my DD will just do one though!

I would say that there are other options she would like to do - drama, History, Geography, dance, Philosophy are all options, & if doing combined doesn’t close any doors I think combined plus more options is a better choice...

OP posts:
pointythings · 28/05/2021 08:47

At our school triple did not take up an option slot; that group were expected to work at higher pace and intensity. Both my DDs did it and found the move to A levels easier as a result. But the love has to be there - if your DD doesn't really enjoy the sciences, combined is going to be better for her as she can then choose an option she has a passion for. There isn't a right answer - except for not making the choice based on pressure from a parent.

paralysedbyinertia · 28/05/2021 09:10

The chances are that most (although not all) of the most able at science will do triple science. As a result the triple science class will be working, on average, at a higher level.

This is definitely how things worked out at dd's school, and it definitely made a difference. Her (very able) friend did combined science and found it a bit of a shock going from a set 1 group in Year 9 to a very different group in Year 10. She ended up wishing that she had done triple just so that she could have been in a different group.

partyatthepalace · 28/05/2021 09:15

There’s a shortage of stem grads, so if there isn’t anything else she wants to do particularly, I’d do them separately as it’s better prep for A levels. However if she really wants to do other subjects and double science gives her that option then do that.

UserAtRandom · 28/05/2021 09:16

If triple science takes an option, I think the main point to decide is whether the option is better used elsewhere. My DD opted for combined science despite being predicted good grades, because she wasn't sufficiently enamoured of science to want to study it for 6.5 hours a week (more than a whole school day), and she had other subjects she wanted to fit in. The "are all the able students taking triple" was a concern to us, but actually (in a school where around 40-45% do take triple) DD has ended up in a top combined science set which is full of other very able scientists who didn't want to take triple for similar reasons to her. But you may wish to ask how this works out at your school. If only the top set are allowed to take triple, you'll clearly end up with a lot of very good scientists taking combined.

Springchickpea · 28/05/2021 09:19

I have a PhD in chemistry. I ‘only’ have double award science (was all my school offered). Had I been given the option I would have almost certainly jumped at the chance to do separate sciences, but that’s because I really love science. I did 3 science A levels.

I think for most people, if it’s not your burning passion, doing the double award is a perfectly good choice. It doesn’t stop you picking up more science later if you want to.