Secondary school appeal

[Mstiva]

Hi good morning our secondary school appeal is approaching fast and looking for a little bit advice if anybody can help please.
Firstly I’m not sure the school will argue it’s full as looking at the statistics available the overall capacity of the school is still approx 100 pupils under capacity. The pan has being exceeded in 4 of the last 5 years also.

Im finding gathering information on the schools curriculum is the tricky part especially trying to find out what subjects are taught at what school. The school I’m appealing for offers a triple science award which my son is looking to achieve aswell as gcse PE as he’s looking to be a sports therapist when older and the school offered just does the double science award it does teach PE also but looking at latest GCSE results I can’t see any GCSE level PE results. Apart from the ebacc subjects there’s not much extra on the latest published school results. I understand choices are available at ks4 but feel it’s important for the school we go to to have these on the curriculum. My son plays football and boxes competitively now so is pretty head strong already at 11 years old at the career he’s wanting to take. Stressful times for us all at the moment any help is massively appreciated. Thanks

You need to dig deeper. It is unlikely your allocated school only does double science and even doing so won't disadvantage a career in sports therapy. The appeal school may offer triple (ie separate) sciences but to how many pupils? Is there a level 2 btec pe offered instead of gcse. Again not taking it would not disadvantage a career. What level is he competing at? Is there any coaching programme or club/teams at either school?

What schools offer changes.
What schools offer is also based on budget constraints about viability of the size of the groups.
It is not unusual for schools to share provision across schools to offer a wider range of courses.

The school results is showing no results for any PE at all which I’m finding hard to believe as I know it’s compulsory for it to be taught but not to take an exam in it. I’m awaiting reply’s from both schools regarding extra curricular activities

OP from what I recall of your previous posts, the offered school is very small - so it may well be that no one takes GCSE PE. It's pretty popular at DS2's school (he does A level PE) but not so much at other local schools; one we know of had about 12 students taking the GCSE and this is from a cohort of 220+.

So it may well be that in a very small school (what is the cohort?) no one does it. Doesn't mean it won't be offered in future years tho. Have you called the school to find out more? If you base your appeal on "this school doesn't offer PE KS4" and they do, that won't go well.

You could do with finding out some other aspects of the preferred school that would suit your son - is there info on the website about clubs and school successes? For instance, my DS2 is involved in a techy project that the school has done externally for years and there is a lot of noise about that on the website - eg in school newsletters. I would have a look and see what is there.

As the school is well under capacity, they are unlikely to argue that they are overcrowded. Even if they try, the panel is unlikely to agree. And the fact they have been over PAN regularly suggests they can cope with some additional pupils.

The school is required to answer any reasonable question you ask to help you prepare for your appeal. If they are dragging their feet, make it clear that you need this information for appeal. If they still don't answer, raise this with the appeal panel. Tell them you have been hampered in your preparations by the school's failure to respond to your questions.

@Mstiva

The school results is showing no results for any PE at all which I’m finding hard to believe as I know it’s compulsory for it to be taught but not to take an exam in it. I’m awaiting reply’s from both schools regarding extra curricular activities

All schools do have to teach two hours of PE a week, but it will only show up in results if some students have also taken the GCSE (which will probably involve those pupils doing another 2/3 hours of PE a week, some of which will be theory rather than practical). I think there's also a BTec which some schools do instead of GCSE.

As someone else has said, in a small school it may be that not every subject offered at GCSE runs every year, depending on how many wanted to do it. That means it may or may not run in your child's year. Schools also change what they offer from time to time, so last year's results are no guarantee of whether it will or won't be offered now or in a few years' time.

I understand your responses about gcse PE this early in my sons school education but we are not appealing for my sons future in the next month/year we are talking about his full secondary school education and his future career choices. The school offered has an intake of around 50 pupils in each year group I’m still waiting on the responses. Thanks

But even if your appeal school offer it now, they may not in five years' time. 50 will limit options. It is not necessarily the be all and end all though. He could remain on wl and perhaps get a space before year 9, even if your appeal is unsuccessful this time. Are there any other schools you are on wl for?

I have just thoroughly researched college courses in all aspects of sport including sports therapy as my son has just had to choose his GCSE options. None of them require GCSE or Btec PE as a pre requisite so I dont think saying he needs PE for his future is going to be that successful. Although if they have 100 spaces I'm suprised you are having to appeal at all?!

I’m on waiting list for 2 schools 5th on preference school and 70th on the other school applied for. I’m surprised that it’s going to appeal if the overall school attendance is below net capacity I can only assume it’s because they have had more applicants than the pan for the upcoming academic year. We still haven’t received any arguments from the school why he can’t be given a place yet but are expecting to receive this in the next week for appeal early June. I’ve submitted evidence and my statement aswell as letters from current school to the admission authority but when this is looked at I’m unsure if it will be when the panel receives the schools argument or on the actual appeal day. Thanks

What is the current school stating in support and what have you submitted? I'm not sure you case is that strong this far except by numbers.

Hi the school is not stating anything yet as we haven’t heard the schools case why they can’t accept anymore children it’s due next week.. is that when the panel will also look at information I’ve enclosed against the schools case to see if we are successful at first stage of appeal? It’s all new to us so we are just trying to gather as much info as possible. We are based in the north east and local stats price that school appeals are 60% successful.

I meant the primary school, you said they had sent a letter of support? Did you used to live closer but moved away?

is that when the panel will also look at information I’ve enclosed against the schools case to see if we are successful at first stage of appeal?

If your appeal is a single hearing, stages 1 and 2 will be handled together. In that situation the panel won't make a decision on stage 1 until they have heard both stage 1 and stage 2 arguments.

I’m assuming it’s a 2 stage appeal as I was told will here 1st stage from school next week then our individual hearings are in June thanks

We were allocated a school that only did double science and tried to argue it wasn’t sufficient for DDs career intentions as a doctor. They said it wasn’t an adequate reason to appeal as apparently some medical schools don’t specify triple/separate sciences. I couldn’t find any tho....

@Helspopje do medical schools really look at what GCSEs were sat? I thought they would be all about the A levels?

I do when I sit on admissions

In a normal year you’re making offers before A levels are back so you use GCSEs, A level predictions, BMAT, PS everything as splitting a hugely achieving pack is extremely difficult.

@Helspopje I had no idea, everyday is a school day thank you for explaining

Does anybody know if it’s ok to request current pupil numbers from the schools to confirm the figures I have as correct thanks

Yes. The school must answer any reasonable question you ask to help you prepare for your appeal.

Hi thanks I’m going to send you a inbox now thanks again

Hi thanks I’m going to send you a inbox now thanks again