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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

MidYIS entry test - any practice available?

12 replies

andrexs2 · 29/04/2021 15:31

Hi All,
our daughter will start secondary in September, and the school invites all children in June for a test. From a friend who used to work at the school I've heard that they use the MidYIS test (www.cem.org/midyis).

Are there any practice materials available? Usually it helps quite a bit if one has already seen the type of questions (how to approach the solution) etc.

Many thanks!

OP posts:
GravityFalls · 29/04/2021 15:36

There's no benefit to practising for these tests. The results are for the school to see precisely where the student is currently working. Practising could give a falsely high level which would lead to a student being put in sets/given target grades that weren't achievable, and that would only lead to stress. The whole point is that every student is in the same boat with the tests so they're a good baseline assessment. If a student underachieves, that will be picked up by their subsequent achievement in school so they're not limiting in that way.

andrexs2 · 29/04/2021 15:38

Thanks, very helpful. Are they also used to determine in which class they go? My understanding is that most secondary schools have several classes/forms per year, 'sorted' / split by abilities.

We're not from the UK and learn as we go - so far only primary, secondary is new to us :-)

OP posts:
GravityFalls · 29/04/2021 15:55

It very much depends on the school - often Y7 start in form groups and get put into ability groups later on. I've never known a school use baseline tests alone as the basis of setting, but it does inform decisions. Sets are rarely immutable so it's common for them to change from year to year depending on progress.

Hoppinggreen · 29/04/2021 15:58

My DC school use them to track progress against performance and to set an attainment target .
They are useful but just because a child scores well/badly in them the school shouldn’t ignore what they observe in favour of the Midiyis score.

Malbecfan · 29/04/2021 17:04

My school is like Hoppinggreen's. The results are used to set targets for GCSE and track progress.

The trouble is, in my subject (Music) you can have kids with amazing scores who are crap musicians but given a stupidly high target grade. Equally, kids with lesser scores but accomplished musicians look like they are smashing their targets. My Head is realistic about their value in some subjects, unlike the last but one...

lanthanum · 29/04/2021 18:13

Setting in secondary is usually flexible, and usually done separately for each subject. It may be that only some subjects are set - maths is the most likely. Languages are often set, with sometimes the upper sets picking up a second language while the lower sets just concentrate on one. I don't think science is often set in year 7, but often is by GCSE. Schools usually review the setting very regularly, so whatever they base the initial setting on (KS2 information, Midyis, autumn term work, combination of all of those), if someone turns out to be stronger/weaker than initially thought (or just improves quickly), then they will usually be moved set before long.

EwwSprouts · 29/04/2021 20:43

DS did the MIDYIS test in the first term of yr7. School used the results as a baseline and to check progress as they went up through the school. What school said was anyone can have a bad day and not to place to much emphasis on the scores, and it's hard to fluke a great score.

To answer your question any logic, verbal reasoning, maths puzzles are good practice and make sure your child is reading as one part I think was spotting (not labelling) grammatical errors at speed.

WombatChocolate · 30/04/2021 08:24

Yes, any materials which test reasoning and are used for 11+ prep will be useful.

Schools would like students to do them with zero prep and the test producers and schools like tos at you cannot prepare, but some familiarisation with the kind of Qs certainly helps and can boost scores. It just isnt true that it makes zero difference. Kids who have prepped for 11+ who do these test later at the start of yr 7 are definitely advantaged as they are familiar with working to time and with the styles of Qs.

In likelihood, practice will give a boost but not a transformation of score. Those who say it can result in kids being put in the wrong sets and then struggling and can be harmful.....I say pah to that. We are not talking about 2-3 years of 11+ intensive prep that some do, when considering Midyis Tests. We are talking about a limited amount of time and a few familiarisation papers or looking at technique. It will boost students a few marks in likelihood. Those who will do this are also likely to be those who will work hard at school and that work ethic makes them more able to cope with a bit of stretch. I am not saying that anyone who doesn’t do any prep (and most don’t for Midyis) lack work ethic or will be poorly at all. But if you get a few extra marks, which means your GCSE target is a grade higher or you squeak into the higher set (and remember actually there is very little setting in many secondary schools, especially selective ones) then that’s no bad thing. Although sets can be flexible, it’s often quite hard to move up. You have to be at the top of your class and there usually has to be someone to move down first. Essentially, it’s much easier if you get into the top set to stay there, than if you’re in the middle set, to move up. High expectations from teachers and being in the data sets with higher Midyis can result in a wider range of options later down the line etc.

So I’d say, it’s not true that there’s no merit or that doing a bit of familiarisation is dangerous or harmful. A child who has done 11+ earlier in the year might not need to at all. Someone else could look at a book of verbal and non verbal reasoning techniques and do a paper or 2. That’s enough to make a difference. For anyone doing Midyis who has never seen those kind of Qs before in their life, it can be quite a shock. They will broadly reveal natural ability and those who’ve never seen them but are bright, will still do well. But they might do slightly better with some practice. And the more average child might be able to boost their mark by a few, which could count for a lot.

In the end, schools will look at how the kids do when they are actually there. It is true and this Midyis data, or KS2 data is just one small element in the bigger picture. But if it’s used for data target setting etc, it’s worth being aware that those targets get looked at and the schools tracks against all the way through to GCSE, so why not have the school start from the highest expectations of your child that you can.

I wouldn’t expect everyone to agree with what I say and I wouldn’t expect the vast majority to be doing any prep at all. But some parents are interested in this stuff and you might call them tiger mums, or pushy or whatever.....it’s probably true, but if that’s what they want to do and think benefits their kids, then a little bit of Midyis or CAT4 familiarisation with perhaps just 5 hours or so, can make a bit of difference.

andrexs2 · 30/04/2021 09:21

@WombatChocolate Thank you, I think that explains well what we had in mind. And indeed there are schools in which it can actually be rather challenging to change set, and schools which do not really adjust the GCSE target.

But back to my original question: I haven't found any preparation book, old test papers, or alike for the MidYIS test. Thus, I actually don't know what exactly they test, and what kind of questions they use.

For example, does it make sense to use SAT practice books? (we have some of those) Or CAT4 test books (we haven't looked for those yet).

Any tips or suggestions would be welcome (happy to receive direct links to websites with practice tests, further information, Amazon book links, etc)

OP posts:
andrexs2 · 30/04/2021 11:14

@EwwSprouts
Thanks a tlot, very helpful!

OP posts:
Comefromaway · 30/04/2021 15:19

Please don't coach her for this test. Strange results for a similar test in Year 7 flagged up my previously bright but average daughter's spiky profile and the school subsequently got the ed psych to assess her. She turned out to be autistic and massively underachieving in a certain area. Her previous school had not noticed because she was performing OK.

She ended up getting a fabulous set of GCSE's and A/A*s at A level, all because the appropriate measures were put in place and the tests flagged up she wasn't performing to her innate ability.

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