Kent grammar feeder primary schools

[TierdOfLockdown]

Hello!

I will be apply for my daughter to start reception in 2022. I currently live in South East London. I was wondering which primaries in SE london/Kent have a reputation for feeding into the grammars?

I have not from London originally so don't have much idea. Any advice would be welcomed

TIA

The primaries aren't allowed to prep children for the Kent Test. Some schools will get a much higher percentage of passes than others, but that will have far more to do with intake and parental demographic than with anything the school is doing. As long you go for a school that is generally good, so will give a good grounding in KS2 English and Maths, that's all you need as far as school is concerned. The rest will be up to you/a tutor to prepare.

And if you're planning on staying in SE London, be aware that a lot of the grammars have a very small intake radius. Even the super-selectives often now have a geographic element to their admissions criteria (eg inner and outer priority areas), so a child has to score very highly indeed to get a non-distance-based place. Finally, don't put all your eggs in one basket. It's not uncommon for parents to assume that a bright, well supported child is bound to pass with tutoring. This is not true. It's a tough test, it seems to get more competitive each year, and even the brightest children can have an off day. Make sure you have a good back up school, whether independent or state non-selective.

Joining as I’m interested in answers too.

I’ve been using www.compare-school-performance.service.gov.uk/ it shows progress each school adds from the kid’s starting point. I think all the ofsted report does is set the local house prices!

From friends, it sounds like everyone in the area pays for tutoring in advance of grammar tests.

Some grammar schools, like Cranbrook Grammar School, I’ve read are basically free private schools in the sense that the intake is mostly from local private prep schools, there is even a consultant recommended on the school site who advises on property buying for parents in catchment !

I only started my research recently, it is so open to change and headteacher dependent, I’ve decided to just focus on somewhere I’d like to live with a primary school that has good facilities (green space, play ground , buildings).

Will still be watching replies here though.

As someone who knew nothing I found these pages useful

www.theschoolrun.com/eleven-plus-Kent-test
www.theschoolrun.com/Bexley-eleven-plus-test
www.theschoolrun.com/Bromley-eleven-plus-test

Yes, the percentage of prep school children at the grammars is much higher than in the general population (especially at the super selectives). If you look at the breakdown of Kent Test scores by school type (you can find it buried on the eleven plus exams forum somewhere!), then the highest scores are very heavily weighted towards prep school and out of county candidates.

Are you planning to move to Kent or are you hoping your DD will get into one of the grammars in Bexley or Bromley? State schools do not prep children for the selection tests so you will have to use the freely available online materials, workbooks or even a tutor to ensure she is familiar with the format and time demands of each borough's selection test (they are not all the same). Most fee-paying schools will prep children for the selection tests even if it's only via weekly non-verbal reasoning sessions from Y3+. If you look on their websites under the destinations section you will often see a list of the grammar and independent schools they've moved on to. State schools rarely do this.

I would suggest that you focus your search for a primary school on what it offers your DD as a 4-yr-old. Is there lots of outside space for the children to access? A forest school? Uniform? Lots of homework? The opportunity to learn a musical instrument? There's a useful guide on the Mummy's Gin Fund website (and in the Facebook group) on how to approach primary school applications which may explain the process for London.

Grammar schools tend to have catchment areas, so you will need to see which schools you may be able to get into.

This website is a good resource for all things Eleven Plus. The regional section in the forums would be a good place to post this question.

11+ website

As others have said it isn’t about the school but the parents. I know some schools will appear in FoI requests as having high percentages going onto grammar and you can look on the FoI responses to see those but it isn’t always to do about the school.

In Orpington at Petts Wood you are typically located for access to Kent (inc Weald pass only), Bexley, then also nearby Newstead/ Olaves.

As everyone has said, Primaries are not allowed to prep the children at all - the Private Preps obviously do! You cannot rely on your child just being bright, when my DH who was Chair of Governors at our local Primary went through the Kent test 2 years ago with the Headteacher, there were one or two questions on it not covered by the National Curriculum. Also it’s about familiarity with the format. Typically, coaching for the Kent Test here starts in Year 4 or 5, a mixture of parents either doing this themselves or using private tutors. It’s pretty competitive and as you are out of area even more so as you may need a very high score to get in. That’s a lot of pressure to put on a 10/11 year old so perhaps worth a think about how your DC (and you!) will handle that.

Your chances are also affected by whether you have a boy or girl. Some but not all of the grammars have a smallish number of places for out of county children with high scores such as Judd (Tonbridge). Tunbridge Wells grammar for boys is the only boys grammar I know of in North West Kent that isn’t Super Selective and will take boys who just pass. Tunbridge Wells is obviously too far to travel from South London but they are building an annexe in Sevenoaks at the moment so in the future that will be an option. Of the girls schools, you’d need a very high score for Tonbridge Girls Grammar and just a pass for Weald. Weald however is the most popular choice for girls locally who have passed the 11+ so I wouldn’t count on getting in. With Weald you also get whatever site (they have 2, Sevenoaks or Tonbridge) they allocate you. So you may apply as the Sevenoaks site travel wise is do-able for you but find yourself with Tonbridge which might not be. This happened to a friend of mine 2 years ago and it was a year before she was able to switch sites for her DD.

As well as figuring in how your DC will cope with the pressure of passing the 11+, I’d also consider travel and what impact that will have on their day and whether this is something you think they’ll cope well with. My DD2 is Year 8 and is up at 6am, out by 7.15 and then has a 50/60 minute bus ride to Tonbridge. She is back home by 5pm, 6pm if she has had an after school club. She’ll then have at least one, often two pieces of homework. By Friday she’s pretty exhausted (but on balance we’re still happy we chose the school we did). Will your DC cope with all this well?

Sorry if the above reads negatively, I just think there is a lot to think about whether this process is right for you and your DC or not. Plenty of children do commute down to our schools (the trains are full of them!).

Where are you in South East London. There is Braeside Prep and Blackheath Prep, for example, if you are willing to pay fees. I am sure there are plenty in Dulwich.
If you go to a highly sought after state primary in Bromley or Beckenham then typically the school will not prepare but a large number of parents will tutor from Years 4/5 onwards and that way the children do not feel they are the only ones doing it. It is a much cheaper route than a prep. The prep parents often tutor too.
Look at the SATS results for sought after state schools with bigger higher depth percentages. For example, Balgowan, Clare House, Highfield in Beckenham, St James in Petts Wood (if you are Catholic). There are state schools like this in most South East London boroughs. However, I would only ever put a top set child through this who is also resilient. It is not for the faint hearted. Easier route if you want grammar is to move to e.g Bexley or eg Sevenoaks if you have a girl. Getting into grammar from South East London requires super selective scores (unless you are Bexley catchment) - that means very bright child plus loads of work.

"As everyone has said, Primaries are not allowed to prep the children at all - the Private Preps obviously do!" - The Prep schools are categorically not allowed to prepare the children for 11+, and would tell you the same if you asked. Please check your facts before spreading misinformation. It only underwrites an unfair them and us mentality, which isn't applicable on this point.

The Prep schools may not be allowed to prepare children for the Kent Test but that doesn’t stop them! I used to work at a Kent Prep School and they did verbal reasoning in their English lessons, using 11+ practice papers, and practice questions in maths. They also ran holiday courses and after school clubs. These were called ‘familiarisation sessions’. The preparation for the test was one of the selling points of the school and teachers were quite open about it when talking to prospective parents. On top of this the children all had their own tutors.

In contrast state schools really are not allowed to do anything like this. The state primary my DDs went to gave absolutely no assistance at all.

It is a deeply unfair system but intensively tutoring a child to then scrape through really does them no favours at all when they spend the next five years struggling to keep up.

You taught at one Kent Prep that did this, but I can assure you, it isn’t all of them. Assuming all Preps will give your child an unfair advantage above state school absolutely is not the case. Primaries can bend the rules as much as Preps - the rule applies to both equally.