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Secondary education

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Original poster

dd given a past paper to do at home under exam conditions - what would you do?

134 replies

LetterOfTheLawFella · 23/01/2021 20:53

dd was meant to be taking her gcses this year but obviously things have changed. She's been struggling with French and got a 3 in the mini mock she did before Christmas. This was the higher level. We talked about maybe doing the foundation paper instead and it looks like her teacher is thinking the same as he's sent an email asking parents to supervise her doing a foundation level past paper under exam conditions. 45 minutes and no external support. He's confirmed this will be used as part of the teacher assessment.

Would you help your child in this situation?

OP posts:
dancemom · 23/01/2021 21:07

@LetterOfTheLawFella

all her peers who are not cheating

Do you really think all her peers won't have help? Are you all saying you wouldn't do everything you could to support your child to do the best they can?

"Helping" is not supporting her to be the best she can though
Ohalrightthen · 23/01/2021 21:07

@LetterOfTheLawFella

all her peers who are not cheating

Do you really think all her peers won't have help? Are you all saying you wouldn't do everything you could to support your child to do the best they can?

Yes, i would give a LOT of extra help and support, get her in the best possible position for the exam, and then i would let her sit the exam on her own because i think integrity is important, and i raise my children to be honest.
bourbonne · 23/01/2021 21:07

@LetterOfTheLawFella

all her peers who are not cheating

Do you really think all her peers won't have help? Are you all saying you wouldn't do everything you could to support your child to do the best they can?

To do the best THEY can.

By supporting them to learn and study.

And supporting them to take pride in themselves and responsibility for themselves, be honest and upstanding people, not cheats and not feeling dependent on Mummy.

How do you think the attitude and norms you're setting are going to serve your child when they enter the workplace?

TheLetterZ · 23/01/2021 21:08

@LetterOfTheLawFella

all her peers who are not cheating

Do you really think all her peers won't have help? Are you all saying you wouldn't do everything you could to support your child to do the best they can?

I absolutely do support my child to do the best they can and be the best they can, by instilling good work ethic study skills and basic morality.

Which is to not cheat!

This will not be the only assessment and won’t have that big an impact on her grade but think of the message it is sending.

StepOutOfLine · 23/01/2021 21:09

@sofiaaaaaa

If you mean cheating, teachers are surely aware this will be a possibility. It would be extremely suspect if a teen that has struggled with a normal paper and has to be moved to the foundation exam suddenly gets 100%. They will know
Absolutely. We actually rang 2 parents this week to say "you did really well in that test, but next time could you let your son do it please?"
MrsBennettsSecretSon · 23/01/2021 21:10

My DH is a languages teacher

He always laughs at how obvious it is when kids have been helped, giveaways are vocab that has not been taught, verbs in tenses that are not even part of the curriculum, phrases used by the older generations, things lifted from Google, google translate, kids going from a 3 (not knowing how to conjugate avoir in the present) to getting an 8 and using subjunctive faultlessly Grin

It’s really really hard to cheat well

Good luck with it. Hope she does well. Can you help her revise instead?

Original poster
LetterOfTheLawFella · 23/01/2021 21:10

What about this scenario - dd does the paper in the right conditions and you see she has made some silly errors. Would you say/do anything?

OP posts:
SanFranBear · 23/01/2021 21:11

@LetterOfTheLawFella

What about this scenario - dd does the paper in the right conditions and you see she has made some silly errors. Would you say/do anything?
No... are you reading the responses?
StepOutOfLine · 23/01/2021 21:12

@BornOnThe4thJuly

I probably would to be completely honest. I would then make sure I gave her lots of support in filling in the gaps, in areas I’d had to help with though. I think they’ve been so disadvantaged in the last 12 months, that they deserve a leg up.
They've been disadvantaged like every other kid on the planet you mean? Yes. And grades and expectations have been adjusted accordingly.
Ohalrightthen · 23/01/2021 21:12

@LetterOfTheLawFella

What about this scenario - dd does the paper in the right conditions and you see she has made some silly errors. Would you say/do anything?
No! What about "exam conditions" is so hard for you to understand?
SleepingStandingUp · 23/01/2021 21:12

@LetterOfTheLawFella

all her peers who are not cheating

Do you really think all her peers won't have help? Are you all saying you wouldn't do everything you could to support your child to do the best they can?

So your plan is to make sure she gets a good mark so her grade is inflated so she gets better GCSEs even though she presumably won't really need that grade for A Levels etc and even though she'll know every time she thinks about it that you cheated?
SleepingStandingUp · 23/01/2021 21:14

@LetterOfTheLawFella

What about this scenario - dd does the paper in the right conditions and you see she has made some silly errors. Would you say/do anything?
The right conditions do not include anyone looking over her answers and correcting them
bourbonne · 23/01/2021 21:14

@LetterOfTheLawFella

What about this scenario - dd does the paper in the right conditions and you see she has made some silly errors. Would you say/do anything?
How good is your French?

If, like most people, you've used about three words since your own schooldays, what makes you think you'll be better than your DD?

Imagine if you "corrected" her and it turned out she was right!

Let her take ownership of her own exam. She's a young woman. It's not about you.

sofiaaaaaa · 23/01/2021 21:16

@bourbonne presumably the answers are available online as past paper

TheOnlyLivingBoyInNewCross · 23/01/2021 21:17

@LetterOfTheLawFella

all her peers who are not cheating

Do you really think all her peers won't have help? Are you all saying you wouldn't do everything you could to support your child to do the best they can?

But you're not supporting her to do the best she can, are you?

Stop trying to dress up the fact that you want to cheat your way to a good grade for her as something altruistic. You're not doing her any favours at all.

Heyha · 23/01/2021 21:17

The only vaguely naughty thing I (as a teacher) would say would be ok here is that I would not make her stop exactly on the time limit if she was just finishing off a sentence or something. In the classroom it would be very much "pens down now please" but at home I wouldn't be too worried about saying "that's time up, just finish that little Q" if need be. Cheating helps nobody in the long run.

bourbonne · 23/01/2021 21:19

[quote sofiaaaaaa]@bourbonne presumably the answers are available online as past paper[/quote]
Ah right. Well then, why does she need Mummy/Daddy to do the googling for her?Honestly, if I had to choose between the two, I'd rather have the memory of cheating on an exam in secret than the memory of my own bloody mum or dad standing in the corner doing it for me!

Obviously I'd rather have neither memory and be able to look back on my grades and know that good or not-so-good, they were all mine.

TheOnlyLivingBoyInNewCross · 23/01/2021 21:19

@LetterOfTheLawFella

What about this scenario - dd does the paper in the right conditions and you see she has made some silly errors. Would you say/do anything?
You really have no integrity at all, do you?
Original poster
LetterOfTheLawFella · 23/01/2021 21:20

If the teacher wanted to ensure strict exam conditions why wouldn't they have got the students to do the paper during a video lesson. It feels like an opportunity for some parents to help.

OP posts:
bourbonne · 23/01/2021 21:21

@LetterOfTheLawFella

If the teacher wanted to ensure strict exam conditions why wouldn't they have got the students to do the paper during a video lesson. It feels like an opportunity for some parents to help.
Why don't you suggest this to the teacher?
Original poster
LetterOfTheLawFella · 23/01/2021 21:23

Why don't you suggest this to the teacher?

That's not a bad idea actually.

OP posts:
BornOnThe4thJuly · 23/01/2021 21:23

“Why does your DD deserve a grade she didn't earn herself, when the large majority of her classmates will be sitting the exam themselves? What makes it OK for her to cheat? Because she's had a hard year? So has everyone else. That doesn't entitle her to a 5 if she's only capable of a 3.”

I think they should all be getting better grades to be honest. They’ve not had the chance to learn properly, so I don’t see how they can decide grades based on exams like they usually would. My DC are much younger, maybe I’d feel differently if it came to it, I definitely don’t like the idea of teaching them it’s ok to cheat, as was pointed out by a PP. I do feel very, very sorry for the kids in exam years though.

Ohalrightthen · 23/01/2021 21:23

@LetterOfTheLawFella

If the teacher wanted to ensure strict exam conditions why wouldn't they have got the students to do the paper during a video lesson. It feels like an opportunity for some parents to help.
They probably assumed that most parents have a decent grasp of right and wrong, and don't want to encourage their children to lie and cheat?

Generally speaking, most people want their children to be honest. Not you, obviously, but most other people.

Doing an exam with your whole class on zoom would be incredibly distracting.

TheLetterZ · 23/01/2021 21:24

@LetterOfTheLawFella

What about this scenario - dd does the paper in the right conditions and you see she has made some silly errors. Would you say/do anything?
Submit silly mistakes and all. Then afterwards (probably the next day) go through it with her. Then correct those little mistakes.
ktp100 · 23/01/2021 21:27

Absolutely not!!

If it says exam conditions it means exam conditions.

Don't help her to cheat. If she struggles it's a good sign she needs to revise more. Helping will just give her a false sense of security.