grammar or private

[user198434798]

I have a DS in Year 5 and we're working towards sitting the 11 plus exam next year with the aim of trying to get into one of the very good grammar schools. There are no good states or grammars near where we live so we will necessarily have to move.

We've also recently started discussing the possibility of private school as well, this is of course very expensive and would effectively mean that my full salary with go towards private school fees+related costs. So then we'd be a one salary household for the next 6 years and in total this will cost 150k. Not a small amount but we're happy to consider the possibility of doing this , given that we've also saved some money this year.

DS is very academically inclined and I think would thrive in an academic school, with no particular extra curricular interests that we'd need to take into account.

IF he gets into one of the top/good grammars that we're aiming for, what are people's opinions about grammar vs private in that scenario? Would it still be worth giving up my salary to pay for the private in that case?

I went to a grammar and had plenty in my class who had been to private preps and moved across. To be honest, in my town the schools were pretty even (maybe the private had a few more facilities, but nothing dramatic) so I think a lot of parents saw no benefit in shelling out for education that was just as good and free down the road. If your child won’t make the most of private facilities, but would thrive in a very academic school, surely save your money?

One of the main criteria I've been considering in deciding how good a grammar/private is academically is the percentage of students that get into Oxbridge. I know it's not the be all and end all but it's one of the metrics I've been using.

Depends on where the school is I'd say. If private is a stretch financially (and it sounds as if it would be) and the grammar is good and close, I'd definitely 100% choose the latter. End result will probably be the same either way.

But if the grammar includes a lot of travel that's a different matter... I've thought about this a lot in recent weeks in relation to my own DC and decided in the end that I'm not really up for them doing a lot of travel each day.

Depends on how much it would cost you to move closer to the grammars (you say you would need to move). Assuming you own and not rent, then by the time you have factored in the stamp duty, moving costs and I am guessing a premium over your current property to be in the grammar catchment then you will have already spent tens of thousands of pounds (and your child might not pass). I think moving just for grammar schools is a huge risk and puts so much pressure on a child.

I would, however, move to be in the catchment area of a really great comprehensive or secondary modern school. Our local comprehensive school sends more children to Oxbridge each year than the very highly regarded independent school in the same town. The independent, however, has far better GCSE and A-level results across the board. I think they do a better job of making those average students really meet their potential which accounts for the difference.

We had the choice of independent (not the one I refer to above), grammar, or the comp. We discounted the comp as it was co-Ed, leaving the decision between the grammar and independent. I honestly couldn’t justify having to go back to work full time to pay fees and the knock on compromises on family life. You get smaller class sizes, better facilities and generally much better extra curricular activities at an independent but is that worth the hundreds of thousands extra?

Following a windfall my daughter chose the independent in the end. Some people see it as a backup school for some of the north London academic schools. Some people couldn’t fathom why we wouldn’t go with the grammar and save the money.

The reality is that it didn’t come down to simply grammar vs independent. It came down to choosing the RIGHT school, which isn’t necessarily the “best” school on paper. Not all grammars are the same, just like not all independents. You need to delve deeper into individual schools before I think you can possibly make the decision.

thanks for the advice.

We'd have to move for both grammar and private - there are no good private schools (or any in fact) near where we live, so he'd have to commute which is something we'd like to avoid. His current primary state school is 7mins walk from us.
We own and would have to pay stamp duty etc and cost of selling this and buying another house anyway.

If DS can get a place at a good grammar school then you should go with it. Moving will cost a lot of money. Also, private school fees rise year on year. Uniforms can be expensive and thee are many extras.

Firstly, I'd beware of using Oxbridge as your metric. Partly because that will depend on intake as well as how good the school is, but also because Oxbridge is not the be all and end all - and it's not always the 'best' option. A really good school won't pander to parental prejudices by just trying to get as high as possible a percentage of Oxbridge entries, when the best university for a particular course, or the right university for a particular student, might be Harvard or Exeter or UEA or wherever.

Anyway, that's an aside. We were in exactly the scenario you describe and went for independent. It was a very, very close decision, as both schools were very good. But in the end we went for private mainly because of a broader curriculum, smaller classes, generally better resources and wider extra curricular provision. If academic outcome had been the only concern, we'd have gone for the grammar, where I'm sure our child would 'achieve' just as much. There's another thread on this subject atm where a poster said that education is about 'the journey not the destination' and that completely sums up how we felt. We thought, rightly or wrongly, that the journey/experience would be better in the independent so that's what we went for in the end. But it will depend on your child and on the schools you're talking about.

Thanks. I totally agree that Oxbridge isn't the be all and end all, also because whether you get in or not can be quite arbitrary in the end, I know plenty of people who are exceptionally smart and who didn't go to Oxbridge and others who did but are not particularly exceptional. I'd prefer him to go to a school where IF he wanted to and it was the right option for him, he'd have a good chance. I'm actually more interested in the top American institutes but most of the schools here only have a tiny handful of students going there so I think getting into a US university might be an uphill struggle if you're applying from here.

I agree it's about 'the journey not the destination' and would prefer a school that facilitates open minded thinking and deep learning and not just extremely focused on getting good exam results.

but most of the schools here only have a tiny handful of students going there so I think getting into a US university might be an uphill struggle if you're applying from here.

Surely that's because most schools here want a UK university, and to not have to pay all the US costs?

My DD got into a good private school and a good grammar. What swung it for us was breadth of curriculum on offer at the private school, especially languages. If I had had a child who was mainly interested in maths and/or science I might have made a different decision. Having said that I also heartily agree with the 'journey, not destination' attitude and private schools are lucky not to have to worry about things like Progress 8 and eBacc.

Both schools we considered get excellent exam results but I don't think that necessarily means it's all they are interested in. I think with some schools it's just that they are very selective (and it would be surprising if they didn't get really good results).

There are some schools in the UK which send a reasonable number to American universities and know about the admissions process. DD's school sends about 10% to US universities.

Just be mindful of when you move. I don’t know where you are, but I think for the Trafford grammars you have to be in the catchment when you take the exam, you can’t wait for the results and then move if you pass IYSWIM.

Is he currently in a normal state school? If he is then he will probably be fine in a grammar school. Some children who are used to small class sizes and lots of attention from a teacher find it harder in classes of 30+ (and many classes are over 30) where the pace is fast and there is little time for individual questions. Ultimately wherever he goes he will get out what he puts in. A child able enough to go to a grammar school will probably emerge with mainly 8s and 9s at GCSE. You could consider private for 6th form at that stage. It does though depend on the child and the school. Do be aware that the private schools in a grammar area might not be as suited to high achievers (on average) as those in a non grammar area as although there will be some people who continue with private regardless, others will choose to send their child to grammar school, reducing the range of more academic children in private schools.