moving from private to state secondary?

[linwil]

How big of an issue is it for children to move from a private to a state secondary school around years 8 and 10? Especially when it's not due to choice but necessity? Has anyone got experience with this and if so how did it go? I realise a lot depends on the particular schools involved as well as the children. In our case it'd be from a well-regarded, average private school to - most likely - an ofsted good, large, middle of the road state school.

I'm asking as we are moving soon and DH's company has offered to pay private school fees for our three children, one of secondary age and two of primary. We're tempted to go for it mainly because it's a good school in the area we'd like to live in, close to DH's work as well as friends, and the local state (not as good) is full in DD's year.

Our alternative would be to live in a different area, much longer commute for DH as well as to see friends etc. but the state secondary there is outstanding oftsted and very highly rated and still has a place in DD's year (it's a rural school, all other years are full). DD likes both schools. We'd like to send primary aged siblings to the same school as DD when they're going to secondary so would want to live in the catchment.

I've posted about our upcoming international move before and the responses were really helpful so I thought I'd consult all of you on this as well!

When I posted before I was not yet aware of the outstanding state option, nor of the fact that 3 years from now there's a chance DH's company's policy will change and they will no longer pay the private school fees. DH believes there to be about a 25% chance this may happen. We couldn't afford the private for three kids for many years. If company policy does not change we'd be good for the next 8 years at least which would get them almost entirely through A levels, and if need be we could pay for the last couple of years for our youngest out of pocket.

Our current view is it'd probably be better to live farther away and go for the outstanding state as there would be no risk of having to move the children to a different school due to cost. On the other hand, we'd love to live in the area near DH's work and the private seems a lovely school (but so does the outstanding state). Plus I realise how lucky we are to have been offered the money for school fees and feel perhaps we'd be silly not to make use of this option.

If we went for the private how difficult would it be for them to move to a large state secondary later on if necessary? It'd be the good ofsted one in that area, provided there are places, and not the outstanding school in the other area. DD1 is shy but determined and very academic. DD2 is much more outgoing, creative, less academic though still good grades and DS, quite shy also, loves to learn but is too young still to be able to tell how he'll do when he's 11.

I'd love to hear your thoughts and especially would appreciate hearing of other's experiences with moving their children from a private to a secondary school. I think in our decision-making process regarding schools this is one of the biggest factors. Thanks!

DD Y8 has a really good friend who's just joined her state school from a very selective private girls. Our school is 'good' bog standard about 230 kids per year. She's done well though from what I can tell and seems pretty happy.

I wouldn't go for anything that would mean I have to move in Y10 though. A large majority of schools now start GCSEs in Y9 and joining in Y10 could mean they are forced to do subjects where there is space.

I would go for the state option, but only because I would hate to spend the next few years worrying that I might have to move them. I certainly wouldn't want to move a child in Year 10 if it could be avoided.

Moving between private and state shouldn't be a problem. Lots of pupils do that around here.

www.compare-school-performance.service.gov.uk/find-a-school-in-england

Have you looked the schools up on there?

Personally, I’m pretty sure I’d stick to the independent schools and worry about moving as and when the need arises. However, I do agree that Y 10 is bad timing so if that were to happen, I’d carry on paying the fees for that child for Y10&11.

Private school - what extra curricular activities does it offer compared to state?
How much longer would the commute be - which may be a disadvantage.

Some people move private schools from a prep to a 13plus anyway so moving in private schools does happen anyway.

Thanks so much for your replies. That is very good to know about year 10 - I’m new to the UK secondary education system and did not realise they choose their GCSE subjects so early.

Cloudburstagain, private offers loads of extra curricular but state also offers a bunch. Main extra ones for private are horse riding, swimming and sailing all of which I’m not sure our kids will be into (but could be of course). The extra commute for the outstanding state would be about 35 mins in the car each way instead of 10.

JoJoSM2, thank you so much for the link to the compare schools website! I had to dig into the numbers as there are not that many listed for the private but on the ones where I could compare, which are attainment 8 score and EBacc average point score, the private seems to score REALLY low. It’s a bit shocking to me unless I’m not understanding the numbers correctly?

Basically on attainment 8 score the outstanding state outperforms the average by a lot and even the middle of the road good state school scores just above average. Yet the private scores lower by nearly 20 points?? Same for the previous year though the year before that they did do a lot better (but still not as good as the state schools). The private does do well on A levels outperforming the others by a bit.

It seems odd to pay so much for private if some of the results are not very good? Or is there something I’m missing about these numbers?

Thanks again!

Private shools dont have to publish anything on that website. You are better off looking on their websites for their results and comparing that way. This will be why its so much lower.
Also when comparing, think about the abilities of your children and filter results by prior attainment. For eg a school might be really great at improving results for high achieving pupils but not lower and middle. This will show in the % by prior attainment. Obv this is not a problem if you have a high achieving child.
However, it works the same the other way. There are some schools that are excellent with low and mid attainers but fail their high achievers. This will show when you filter by attainment.

This website can be useful but you can get stuck hyper analysing data. The reality is when kids are in a supportive home they will do well and distance in those situations matters more than the difference between outstanding and good.

I work in schools and imo you need to look at behaviour policy and how the school sticks to it. I don't know where you're coming from but the behaviour of UK kids in schools is disgraceful and this would be the most important thing for me personally; state or private.

That’s a government website that’s good for comparing state schools. Sometimes you’ll find that a ‘good’ school outperforms the outstanding, for example.

Private schools will publish sth on their own websites but they aren’t compared against state. I doubt it would perform a lot worse that a non-selective school unless it’s known for being a place for less academic children.

Other than co-curricular provision, class size is much smaller in indies (30 is standard in state). They often have longer days but get more holidays, have far superior facilities and more space around them. Since the fees are several times higher than state school funding, things like resources don’t tend to be an issue either whereas state schools are struggling at the moment.

That makes sense about the website, good to keep the numbers in perspective.

Foxesandsquirrels, we're coming from Belgium but have moved around a lot before this (military family), kids have been in a local French language Belgian primary which was lovely though not particularly high achieving and at the moment attend an American curriculum international school. No issues with behaviour at the current school and while we've some experience with British primary schools I don't know much about secondary. I'm amazed sometimes looking at my eldest that she's such a big kid - don't know where the time's gone!

In which case please make sure you get the behaviour bit right. It's not uncommon to see kids chucking chairs and swearing at teachers, in a lot of secondary schools.
Parents may tell you otherwise but honestly most don't have a clue what goes on in their child's classroom, and not sure how they could anyway.

If you can’t afford fees what’s the likelihood of DH losing his job? And would you stay in the UK? That’s got to be factored in with the 25% risk the policy might change.

I agree moving in Y10 would be a bad idea. Can you put some money aside to cover fees if necessary.